GUN FU- Just an excuse for not learning to fight properly?

Why is it when people talk about self defence in the streets of today people always go on about guns and the infamous gun fu (a phrase which is really starting to wind me up, and is seen as the end to all martial arts debates). How many people on this board have actually seen a real gun up close and in what context? How many people have seen a gun used in a fight in the local chippy? How many people here have seen someone get shot in a night club? I am sure that there will be exceptions to this (escpecially in America) but for most MAPers i am sure this has never and will never happen. We all know that if someone gets a gun and you havent that you are probably dead- I think the phrase 'No s**t Sherlock' springs to mind. Lets all just forget about guns unless we are in the military and keep ourselves out of situations where guns may be involved- by not joining the army.

End of rant.


Andy

 

Seen a gun.

Fired a gun.

Had one loaded with police chalk training rounds fired at me twice in close range.

Planning on eventually getting a license and learning at a minimumn:
- What different types of safety's look like and how to disengage.
- How to tell if the darn thing is loaded.
- How to hit the broad side of a barn.

Don't plan on owning a gun.

The thing is that if you say that you're an all around fighter then you need to understand all ranges and methods of fighting that you might come across.

Way too many people invest too much power in a gun. Others disrespect it by saying "there's nothing to it, I could pick one up and take care of myself if I needed to."

A better question is: what's a good excuse not to do this sort of stuff?

- Matt

 

I regularily point one towards clay discs flying through the air.

 

I haven't seen a gun fired ever, or seen a gun drown and I've spent a lot of time hanging out at night. I've only Seen holstered guns (police)...

It just doesn't happen around here.

 

I've seen many of all sizes and shapes, military and civillian, and I've pumped off thousands of rounds with them myself.

I've had one pulled on me six times, I've been fired at twice. I've been hit with rocksalt fired from a shotgun (a favorite trick of ranchers and farmers; replace the pellets in a shotgun shell with rocksalt) The pain is unreal: "The stab yourself with a dull icepick and pour salt in the wound", kind of painful.

I've seen about ten shootings that didn't directly involve me. I can't forget them no matter how hard I try.

I own a few, I hope that they never need be fired at anything other then paper targets and cans.

I'd recommend restricting all fighting (armed or not) to the mat, ring, cage or octagon as the case may be.

As for Self-defence, it isn't really complete without an understanding of the weapons you are likely to face and the proverbial a-bomb of the criminal arms race is the semi-auto firearm. That should be the worst you could run into, unless they legalize full-auto machine guns and RPGs in the streets of the U.K. (I'd pay a dollar to see that).

 

I own and carry firearms. Yes I have a permit. I have been shot at but not hit. That is to say shot in my direction. I have used one in a SD situation. I have seen people shot. I have taken courses in tactual firearms use. The courses were in tactual shotgun and pistol. I competed in long distance rifle.

 

I've fired a gun. The last time I did so, it was a .22 rifle at Scout camp when I was about 14. I've never seen an American cop with gun drawn (although I have acquaintances who've had guns pulled on them by cops), but when I was in Trinidad, I saw the Trini cops running around with their guns drawn fairly often.

 

I’ve been salted before when I was a kid stealing watermelons. Men have you got it right about the pain. I got it in the lower back and rear. Had to hide and throw away my clothes. I didn’t want a whipping on top of the salting.

 

Never fired one, never seen one drawn. But once some dudes ran up in my neighbours house with shotguns and had everyone lay on the floor. The police shot a schoolmate of mine in the head a stone's throw from where I used to live. You know why I've never seen one drawn? I'm in my house by 8pm, and if I'm not, I'm at a friend's house, never on the street. Why? Because when cats shoot, they shoot. I've never seen a gun fight, but I've never seen a fistfight either, never heard of a fist fight, but I've heard of many many many gunfights/knife fights happening so close.
Where I'm at, guns are everywhere, and I would be an idiot not to acknowledge it.

 

in this country, you cannot carry a gun anywhere except to go hunting. even police dont carry guns. I myself have never seen a gun outside of my friends hunting lodge and a gun club. I think there are like 6-7 gun deaths in this country a year. I could never live in america, the idea that someone could walk around the street with a gun on them freaks the crap out of me. the fact that america has an INSANELY high rate of gun deaths, yet still do nothing about it, freaks me out even more.

so for me, gun defense is hardly an issue. the chances of me being assaulted with a gun are so minute I might as well train in swordsmanship as well (actually someone earlier this year attacked two people with a samurai sword...)

 

I agree, Ikken. In many places around the world guns are much harder to come by than in the United States, and so being able to deal with unarmed assailants is a bit more of a useful skill. The only guns I've ever seen here in Canada are those carried by the police. When I was visiting my uncle in Illinois this summer he showed me his gun collection. I must say I was very alarmed. I don't see how there can be so many gun deaths there without some type of control being implemented.

 

Trained in firearms, been issued firearms, been shot at, caught SLIGHT ricochet fragments, had a gun held to me at close range, etc...

To be a complete martial artist, you MUST be aware of weaponry in all its forms. The Samurai studied archery as well as kenjutsu, and modern Marines/Soldiers study everything from fists and knives to rifles and grenades.

This does not mean you have to agree with private firearm possession. Simply become aware of the threat they entail, and how to cope with the threat if it arrives.

May you achieve
Satori

 

Ikken, it's our 2nd Ammendment right to have guns. Naturally, some people will think it also means to kill people. =/

I plan to go to the military, so I will see a gun soon enough. Other than that, I've only seen hunting rifles in stores, or when talking to cops (in a friendly way ), I've seen them in their holsters.

I think it's just weird how some people act tough because they carry around a toy that can kill people. =/

PL

 

BTW, please don't construe my earlier post to suggest that I particularly like guns. I tend to fall in the camp that think's my county's obsession with guns is reprehensible. While they can be useful tools, I have difficulty understanding why they are still a constituional right.

- Matt

 

Yes, wer're lucky to be in NZ. Obviously for you yanks it's pretty important to learn about guns.

By the way, what club are you at Iken? I'm at VUW Wellington.

 

i train with Jason Houghton up in whangarei... dont suppose you're going to the fight night this saturday at the auckland boxing association? probablynot (bit of a trip from wellington) but we have a couple of guys fighting in the foreplay shows. should be a good night, 18 fights, apparently a few title fights as well.

 

For the majority of people that have answered, guns are legal to own and carry. Come on brits, where are ya?

This post was to raise just a few points. The main one has been addressed by most so far. Which is 'do you need to learn how to defend against them?'. For those of you where guns are commonplace then I guess that that is kind of a yes. But lets face it, the skills you will learn are kind of the same as wearing safety goggles- ALMOST useless against a determined attacker. You never know, you might get lucky.

My second point was in reply to all these posts about street self defence where someone always mentions gun fu. Many a time people have mentioned about martial arts being useless on the street because of the infamous gun fu. Forget about guns because you are pretty much screwed if one gets pulled on you. Train to fight and to take the guy out of the equation before he gets the gun out and/or get the hell out of there.

Type in gun fu to the search engine and see how many posts where this is mentioned as the end of all arguments and you may see where I am coming from.

 

It is worth noting that guns are designed so that people do not need to worry about getting close to an opponant. So unless you can fly FAST then it is all over for you.

 

The Brit perspective

I live in England and I have actually seen a gun pulled in a pub fight. It was a good few years ago when I still lived in Kent (and was a bit too young to have been in said pub), the gun wasn't fired, but it was still enough to make me think twice about getting in fights in pubs, and also enough to stop me ever going there again! I was also on work experience in a mortuary when a shooting victim was brought in, so I suppose you could say I have been a witness to gun violence in the UK.
At the same time, I haven't seen anything of a gun in seven or eight years and the term "gun-fu" really gets on my nerves too. I've defended myself in street altercations quite a few times and have never had a gun pointed at me, so I would say that my MA training has been street-applicable without covering any "gun-fu." I think training in a solid knife defense system is a far more pressing concern in the UK as blades are far more widespread here

 

Isnt this supposed to be the art that incorperates the "legendary" techniques of the Iron Fist, or am i thinking or some other art here, correct me if i am wrong, like usual???