Knife Defences

Discussion in 'Weapons' started by pgm316, Feb 21, 2003.

  1. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    Knife defences are possibly the most neglected part of martial artists training. Traditionally knife defences weren’t a big issue because other weapons were as important and the fighter could then have their own weapon if they felt need be. And still many clubs don’t teach knife defences as an major part of their style, sometimes only squeezed in at the end of a lesson as a bit of “self defence” instead of spending full lessons working on techniques.

    The importance of knife defences has recently been brought home to me as two friends have been attacked in separate incidents. One friend was sadly killed in an attack. The other, a martial arts instructor was attacked by two people both with knifes, and maybe with a bit of luck and a lot of skill managed to hospitalise his attackers.

    Personally I’d like to learn more about knife defences! I feel I can have a go against a kicker, puncher, grappler but a knife attack takes the fight to another level.

    Andy mentioned how ineffective the Lau Gar knife defences can be, I’d like to hear about these. Understanding why some are bad is just as important as hearing about good ones.

    A knife section in the magazine articles might be of use.
     
  2. Freeform

    Freeform Fully operational War-Pig Supporter

    First of all I'm sorry about your friend, and i do agree with you on this subject.

    It is interesting to note the rise in popularity of MA's now, such as Kali, which contain alot of knife work. And even within this envirnoment of people I would term knife 'experts', they will be the first to tell how ugly things can get.

    I've see mentioned else where on the forum that Karl Tarnswel has brought out a video of knife defence scenario's which is quite good and reasonably workable.

    Colin
     
  3. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

  4. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    Thanks for the advice, the video is at the top of my shopping list!

    I've been doing a fair amount of knife defences lately, I'm not sure how effective they are compared to other methods, I shall see :) They seem effective, no flowery movements.......
     
  5. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

    It'd be hard to describe them really. The reasons they don't work are all the obvious ones. No comprehension of what someone would do with a knife, impractical counters etc blah blah. A guy actually got a serrated Rambo knife through his bicep at a BB grading a few years back.

    My own feeling is that knives are f*cking dangerous, and that 90+% of knife work taught within Style specific MA's is completely irresponsible. We may hear about the odd MA person who has survived a knife attack, but we never hear from the dead ones do we?

    To be taught by specialists, or not at all in my book.
     
  6. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    I've not been able to find the video under the link :confused:

    I'm probably doing something wrong, but I do intend buying it. I've mentioned it to the people I train with and there interested.
     
  7. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

    Just drop Rosi an email & tell her I sent you.
     
  8. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    OK, cheers Yoda, I'll do that tomorrow, its drinking time now! :)
     
  9. Cain

    Cain New Member

    Do I smell a discount here :D

    |Cain|
     
  10. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

    Nope - that would be doing a mate (Karl) out of his income! In any case this tape is worth at least twice what they are charging for it.

    Just ensuring he & Rosi know I'm spreading the word :D

    pgm316 where are you based?
     
  11. Cain

    Cain New Member

    Hey, that was meant to be a j/k, I would be surprised if u took it seriously :D

    |Cain|
     
  12. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    I've emailed Rosi for some info on Karl's STAB program, I mentioned you pointed me in their direction Dave.

    I'm based in Blackburn. I have mentioned the video to one of my instuctors and he's interested. Definitely something we've never covered enough!
     
  13. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

    Blackburn?????????

    I thought you where MILES away!

    Get yer ass down to our place in Haydock sometime & say Hi :D
     
  14. TkdWarrior

    TkdWarrior Valued Member

    Man i want to learn Kali/escrima :(
    -TkdWarrior-
     
  15. Andrew Green

    Andrew Green Member

    Spar with them, that has to be a part of the training otherwise you will just end up with a huge sense of false confidence.

    Most knife defences are useless becuase they are based on unrealistic and super-exagerrated attacks done with no intent to actually hit. After the initial "attack" the attacker stops and dummies for the defender. The defender is then free to do all sorts of cool and fancy things that wouldn't work if the attacker reacted in any way except the "correct" way.

    Knife sparring makes you realise how much it sucks to fight someone with a knife, you will get cut unless you are very lucky, its just a matter of where, how deep and how many times.
     
  16. Cain

    Cain New Member

    How about using that Bruce Lee kick in enter the dragon where Bruce breaks off the bad guy's arm holding the bottle :D

    No seriously I would go with Andrew on this one - Spar with it.....not the real knife, the rubber one I mean :D

    |Cain|
     
  17. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    I just get a feeling saying Hi is going to be a painfull experience ;)

    and its Blackburn erm Arizona! :D

    give me a few years to psyche myself up for it! :eek:
     
  18. pgm316

    pgm316 lifting metal

    They had a group of people doing knife defences last night, and a bit of a debate started on whether to use a kick or not.....

    Arguments were you could keep them at greater distance with the kick..... Hit them before them hit you....... Possibly kick the knife from their hand.......

    The kick works better in training when someone is stepping in with an obvious lunge! The kind of range you could possibly escape from anyway:D

    My question is, do you consider a kick a usefull technique? Usefull in certain circumstances? Or not at all?
     
  19. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

    Not at all - any knifer worth his salt will be inside kicking range before you see the knife, IF you see the knife.
     
  20. Knight_Errant

    Knight_Errant Banned Banned

    The self defence book seems to think not. It says explicitly 'do NOT attempt to kick the knife out of his hand'. It also says:
    'look for a blocking object, such as a chair.
    Get some protection- a hard jacket around one arm will offer minimal protection
    stay away from the knife, if your attacker is slashing
    if he is using a stabbing action, take the blade on a briefcase or handbag
    Use a stick, broom, umbrella to parry the knife hand'.
    Is this advice any use?
     

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