Demonstration Vs. Application

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by David Harrison, Jan 6, 2017.

  1. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Anyone seen how popular this Fred Maestro character has become since Funker Tacticool started pimping him?

    We've had one of his videos on MAP before, though I can't remember which thread.

    Anyway, I came across a fight of his on YouTube, and thought it gave a very good insight into how easy it is to look cool in a demo, and how easily that can fall apart when someone genuinely wants to destroy you.

    I think that no matter how hard someone tries to be an honest uke, there is still a psychological expectation that changes the dynamic when compared to "even-stevens" sparring or fighting.

    Here is one of Fred Maestro's show reels:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RU9xof8heYA

    And here is his fight:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HWqD-H0_LU

    What is expected, but still funny, is the comments saying "yeah, but he isn't allowed to use Silat in the ring, if he was he'd have broken the guy's arm in the first second".

    I realise this is not any kind of revelation, but I just thought it was a nice illustration of demo vs. reality, plus I'm getting sick of him spamming up my youtube feed.

    This is not meant to denigrate his performance in the ring, but rather to shine a light on the honesty of his demos and marketing schtick.
     
  2. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Haha....everyone looks cool until they get punched in the face.
    Clear case of punch allergy. Which is cool. Not many people like getting punched in the face but continually ducking into a clinch, turning away and flopping back are clear signs of not enough sparring under pressure and from there developing better defensive habits when under fire.
     
  3. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Yeah, I was surprised at how poor his punches were. Not bad accuracy, but not much body behind them.

    Still, he always looked game when he got up again. If only he'd put a bit more of that honesty into his current activities.
     
  4. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    This is what happens when you train theory instead of practice.
     
  5. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Also worth pointing out that the fight was back before 2005 (my early google-fu shows that is the first mention of it on a forum) so it gives us a "start date"

    If you are the same in 2017 as you were in 2005 you have done something VERY wrong in your training!

    I am not saying he is ubermensch or anything like that, just that he may well have changed a bit in the past 12 + years
     
  6. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    It would be a little telling if he hasn't stepped into the ring since.
     
  7. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Would you lay the same claim against me? :)

    I have not fought in a "sporting" capacity since the first ever UK BJJ championships in 1999 (well, excluding point sparring I did at an in house tourney for fun in 2011)

    In fact in terms of "full contact sports" I have not fought since I grabbed Bispings championship nuts in 1994....
     
  8. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Oh yeah, for sure.

    However, seeing as we know he is aware of the reality of things not always going the way you want and having to eat punches and be taken down etc., none of his youtube stuff for Funker Tacticool seem to reflect that in any way. Seeing as his Funker stuff is supposed to be teaching, shouldn't he be using his experience from when he was less skilled?

    Not necessarily. Perfectly fine if he doesn't want to for whatever reason.
     
  9. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    I think his crafted image would take a knock, but in reality it wouldn't be an issue. I freely share the times I have had my buttocks served to me when i discuss my career in martial arts - and it still happens today :)
     
  10. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    Obviously not, you test your skills on a daily basis and the stakes of those skills not being practical have far higher stakes than an embarrassing YouTube video.
     
  11. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    I think that's a great attitude. Certainly my instructor talks far more about when things went wrong for him and how to avoid that rather than glory stories.

    I don't have anything against Mastro personally, I even think he has some cool stuff, it's just the lack of honesty in TEH REALZ demo and seminar circuit that I find objectionable.

    Prime example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsKT0VuxaqE
     
  12. Kurtka Jerker

    Kurtka Jerker Valued Member

    Well just look at the other videos on Funker Tactical. They're not going to let practicality or nuance g et in the way of showing off a cool technique to CoD kids that think they're learning some operator secrets. I mean really, they've got someone on there who by all means is a serious dude. I can't say anything bad about Zero's background but he's teaching people to use a sock as a holster and bubblegum as field expedient ear protection. It's ninja gimmicks first and foremost.

    And then you have guys Travis Haley and Pat Mac who are actually imparting knowledge that makes people better.
    https://youtu.be/U-_9OIiQOJg

    EDIT(Just a detail for those who don't know, a 2.5 second draw is considered a benchmark of competence by many, that's why he mentions it. 2.5 seconds isn't amazing but it's faster than most) EDIT EDIT: Also, trigger warning for F-bombs
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2017
  13. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    Plus that beard. Pharoanic magnificence.

    Mitch
     
  14. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    god, i seriously love--LOVE--martial arts demos. "just look, you too can look bad-ass with a compliant uke. train with me."
     
  15. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Yeah, and they're making good money from it.

    I watched the next Pat McNamara video and he talks about something that I think is very relevant to martial arts as well, especially once sticks or knives are involved:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzwVXA9J620

    How many times have you seen weapons demos where they feel the need to strike a cool pose or twirl a stick at the end? :D
     
  16. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Yeah, isn't it cool how you can totally mess a guy up if your responses are twice the speed of the techniques they're feeding you?
     
  17. Giovanni

    Giovanni Well-Known Member Supporter

    or when uke does a technique that totally sucks. my favorite is always when <pick your art> does a video on how to block a double-leg (or whatever technique you'd like), then the <artist uke> does the worst double-leg ever--at half speed to your previous point.

    yes, i was also taught a double-leg defense as a hapkidoka. i now laugh at the counter. but truthfully, it had been so long since i wrestled competitively. when i was the uke, i had no idea how to actually do it anymore, which of course made the technique work that much better.

    i miss kihap shouting too! lol. i think next time i catch someone in an arm bar i'm going to scream very loudly.
     
  18. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Ha! I like the Bruce Lee kettle-boiling noise after you stamp on their head :D

    Master Wong is a classic for countering duff techniques. Guy is hilarious.
     
  19. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Awww stoppit, you'll make me blush.....:)
     
  20. gapjumper

    gapjumper Intentionally left blank

    I thought (ok I only could watch the first few seconds) that he clearly showed poor understanding of correct/usable distancing. You could generate some power (though not realy with the strikes he showed), but beer-gut x 2 is not a good range....unless you are are Giant Haystacks maybe.

    That he believed his own rubbish and went to a fight.....oops!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 6, 2017

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