Martial arts questions

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Music Man, Nov 21, 2015.

  1. Music Man

    Music Man Valued Member

    Actually, I think palm strikes hurt my wrist more than regular fist punches because of the extreme bend back of my hand when doing a palm strike. When I punch with my fist everything is lined up straight so it doesn't really cause me any major pain.
     
  2. John Titchen

    John Titchen Still Learning Supporter

    Because I brought this up yesterday on another thread... no matter what you do accidents can and will happen.

    I didn't even hit anyone to get this injury. I went to hammerfist a student while we were doing some free work and stopped short and opened my hand as I could see I'd had the shot and due to the heat his head was not protected (we were both wearing High Gear and MMA gloves). At this point he straightened up and his head hit my outstretched hand from underneath (thus catching the padded back of the hand) at speed. I felt the break (to a lesser extent I still feel it most days) immediately.

    While I can type with that hand, I'll never play the piano as well as I used to.
     

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  3. Music Man

    Music Man Valued Member

    After all my back and forth on this issue I think what I want to do is take boxing and supplement that with a style that will help me to be able to prevent takedowns if someone tries to tackle me to take me to the ground and will help me to know how to get back to my feet as soon as possible if I do get taken to the ground. What's a good style that will help with those types of things? I don't need to be an expert in that style just have good ability to defend myself against people trying to take me to the ground and knowing how to defend myself on the ground and get back to my feet asap.

    I guess the fact is is there is a risk with any style of martial arts for self injury. One can only do their best to train as safely as possible and prepare for worst case scenarios on the street. Drumming is my livelihood and my passion so I do have to be careful. But I also don't want to wrap myself in bubble wrap and be afraid to do anything else in my life. So I just need to train as safely as possible while not being afraid and paranoid all the time that I'm going to get hurt while training or while in a real fight God forbid I ever find myself in one.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2015
  4. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Judo and wrestling are great for takedowns and takedown defense, BJJ is king of ground defense, a good MMA class will encompass those skills plus striking skill.
     
  5. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

  6. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

  7. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

  8. Music Man

    Music Man Valued Member

    Thanks Dead pool! Just curious, are you from Virginia?

    One thing that I worry about with an mma programme is since they will be teaching competition style that would mean they won't put enough emphasis on getting back to ones feet in a street fight if it goes to the ground. And since one will perform as they train I would not want to develop the bad habit of trying to do sport based ground fighting in a street situation.

    Also, being that mma does have a bit of everything is it a good programme for street self defense? Or is it too sport's based for a street fight?
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2015
  9. Knee Rider

    Knee Rider Valued Member Supporter

    They will teach you to sweep and how to strip grips and control position. Context dictates tactics and if you don't want to stay on the ground then you won't if you have the skill necessary to make that choice.
     
  10. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Nope not from virginia, but everyone who trains BJJ knows ryan hall of 50/50 BJJ, he's a legend.

    http://www.bjjheroes.com/bjj-fighters/ryan-hall

    Standing up from the ground, and escaping non dominant positions are bread and butter MMA (and BJJ) basics

    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmHveOzyEtc"]MMA Technique - Basics - Standing Up From Guard (Shoulder Post) - YouTube[/ame]

    Covering the basics of standup striking, clinch fighting, and ground fighting is definitely a good idea for physical SD (obvious avoidance is best though)

    Obviously there are some differences, legally, as well as the pre and post fight areas. But getting some solid sport proven skills gives you a massive advantage.
     
  11. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Just to clarify, most MMA programes, have separate classes for wrestling, ground work, and standing striking so as to learn the skill in isolation, and MMA specific classes where you learn to integrate those skills together.
     
  12. Korpy

    Korpy Whatever Works

    Gracie JJ is becoming a joke now too.

    Your perspective on BJJ I will tell, is wrong. The "sport stuff" as you call it, have worked for me when I bounced in bars and had people attack me. Sometimes all I needed was to land a throw or a trip and my attacker was stopped in his tracks. And the whole "going to the ground in a street fight is a bad idea" nonsense is just that...it is nonsense. That is usually said by TMAers who cannot actually defend themselves.

    Where do you live, I can find you a reputable BJJ school.
     
  13. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    With Steph Smith, a Ryan hall blackbelt.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2015
  14. Rebel Wado

    Rebel Wado Valued Member

    There is more than one way to palm strike. I think you are making assumptions based on limited knowledge of open hand striking. If you are power slapping, the bend at the wrist from striking is no more than if you cupped your hand (really no bend).

    IME, there are only two kinds of palm strikes where you bend the wrist back. One is basically forming a bear claw (fingers curled like a fist with thumb on side), and rather than striking with the palm, instead strike with "the end of the forearm" (bottom part of the palm that aligns with the hard bone at the end of the forearm).

    The other is a short ranged palm strike where you slightly bend the fingers. The fingers strike first and then the bottom of palm (aligned with the end of the forearm) hits like a combination of a strike that sends a wave through the target. This strike can easily bend the wrist back and damage it if done improperly. I think this is the more difficult type of palm strike to get good at. Rather than a linear strike, it should feel more like uprooting someone up with a crushing wave. It is very close to how CPR on the chest is performed in feeling (see video below):

    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSsHcdy4GnA"]How to Perform CPR : How to Perform Chest Compressions for CPR - YouTube[/ame]

    However, if you want to protect your hand dexterity for music, striking full power with the hands shouldn't be your first choice of attack.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2015
  15. Korpy

    Korpy Whatever Works

    Wow! If Smith is in the threadstarter's area, he needs to check him out. He will learn solid self defense from a Hall black belt.
     
  16. Music Man

    Music Man Valued Member

    I have never really considered Judo as a primary style for self defense. But the more I read about it the more it looks like a good street fight style. It seems to be very practical and it looks like it has a very low risk, compared to striking, for self injury.
     
  17. Music Man

    Music Man Valued Member

    I just read about all the injuries, and the frequency of injuries, when doing Judo. So I think I'll pass on the Judo lol!
     
  18. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Do you want to learn physical self protection skills? Then tou risk injury

    Sorry but you have to be realistic; drill under pressure to work under pressure
     
  19. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Just curious Music Man. Do you get in a lot of fights? Do you get in a lot of fights because of playing at bars as a musician? Like, how many fights have you been in in your life?
     
  20. GoldShifter

    GoldShifter The MachineGun Roundhouse

    Part of me thinks that Rebel Wado and I are going to find some way to incorporate Kajukenbo into the mix of styles recommended.

    Personally, I've been more hurt playing rugby than I have practicing and using martial arts. Granted that I'm a small person, about 5'5.5 (gotta get every ,5 I can :D) and playing scrum half, I've been hurt more in rugby with acute injuries than say, the chronic injuries I've gotten from martial arts due to my ignorance. If you train wrong and be dumb for things, you'll get hurt doing pretty much anything. Getting hurt will most likely happen but the severity of it is really determined by you. It's a rough lifestyle/sport/world we partake in and injuries are going to happen. Personally, I found peace in that aspect and just accepted it haha.

    When I was learning how to do some tricking or XMA, I was teaching myself and didn't know how to land properly, I was also ... 12 or 13. I landed wrong (with a straight leg), for about 4 years until I went to college and learned just how catastrophic the injuries could have been. I could have torn an ACL or even the terrible triad. One thing that probably saved my leg was learning early the mindset of, if you're going to have to bail, then bail. Never try to stick the landing if you know you're going to come down wrong, unless you're really good, then you can probably do it.

    Keep and open mind, go slow at first, and slowly incorporate speed and power into it once you have the form down. You have the form down, you can hit properly, hurting yourself a lot more than the guy you're hitting.

    Cheers :D
     

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