Vegetarians/Vegans - Animal fat necessity?

Discussion in 'Health and Fitness' started by inthespirit, Oct 22, 2014.

  1. dormindo

    dormindo Active Member Supporter

    That makes perfect sense. I just wanted to clarify that, outside of the general terms you outlined in the definition, many vegans are diverse in their practices and reasons for said practices. Being a vegan myself and knowing a fair few vegans even in this part of the country, there can be some differences in what is done. As far as I know, none of the vegans I know (personally, not people I've communicated with online) are against vaccination as a for instance. Funnily enough, I know a few meat eaters who seem diametrically opposed to it and know a few who have not vaccinated their children. As you allude to, their are differences in tolerance for animal products in clothing (not at all vs. if it's used or already in one's wardrobe, etc.). I just wanted to clarify that as you have brought up several issues that many vegans talk about but are not directly related to veganism as such.
     
  2. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    But the word "vegan" has grown in definition since it was coined. And the Vegan Society doesn't have a say in that.

    I mean, if you purchase meat for your pets, which is treating animals as a commodity and goes against the core tenet of Veganism (as a proper noun), you can still come under the definition of a vegan as a common noun. Just like Al Gore.

    Do you get the distinction?
     
  3. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Are you against vaccines mdgee because eggs are used in their manufacture?
     
  4. mdgee

    mdgee Valued Member

    PASmith, I'm against vaccines because they're not safe. Merck does no formal testing on any of their vaccines before they are released and many medical doctors have gone on record and stated that the antigens produced doesn't mean you are actually protected. They just give the world a false sense of security. That's why there was a breakout recently of measles in a highly vaccinated area of China. Funny that all of the children who had receive the measles vaccine got measles, eh?

    However, I'm not against vaccines if Merck is willing to produce something without eggs, dead fetuses, aluminum, mercury, and some of the other nasty ingredients. I've seen too many children and adults have issues with vaccines. One of the biggest problems is that we force too many on our children. When I was growing up I had less then ten between the ages of 0 to 12. There was no mumps, or chicken pox vaccine and people didn't die or get a brain eating virus after chicken pox. I also don't recall people dying within days or weeks after getting a vaccine. Again, I blame this on Merck and the CDC. Neither organization is held responsible for the deaths caused by their vaccines and they attempt to bury them under the rug.

    Here's just one example of many that I have read. Sadly, these deaths aren't as rare as most would think. There are loads more that the CDC refuses to associate with anything they have approved and Merck is very protected until they kill a high profile person that they can't hide from.

    http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...lu-shot-caused-teenage-sons-death.html?pg=all
     
  5. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    They are a damn sight safer than unrestricted diseases running rampant through populations.
    Do you really think the world would be a better place if we didn't eradicate smallpox through vaccination?
    If the answer is yes how can you seriously argue that with a straight face?
    If the answer is no wouldn't it suggest that your view of vaccines has been overtly coloured by anti-vaccine propaganda?
     
  6. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Bear in mind (according to some sources) "Smallpox was responsible for an estimated 300–500 million deaths during the 20th century."
    You know...stopping that seems pretty damn good to me. There'd have to be a hell of a lot of vaccine injuries to counter that and make vaccination unviable.
     
  7. Ros Montgomery

    Ros Montgomery Valued Member

    Can you show me the source of that info, please?
     
  8. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

  9. mdgee

    mdgee Valued Member

    PASmith, but I have something that I just wrote that you completely ignored. How safe are vaccines? No thanks. There are plenty of ways to protect ones family. My son, who I've mentioned before, is 22. He's had one vaccine in life before he went off to college. He had chicken pox, measles, and mumps. Oh, and contrary to that b.s. commercial for some bizarre vaccine that didn't exist ten years ago, just because we had chicken pox doesn't mean we will get shingles. However, if you get vaccinated with that shingles vaccine guess what they're giving you a nice dose of? The shingles virus! Go figure.

    So yes, smallpox and polio may have been eradicated but we didn't have the same the poisonous crap into our vaccines 50 years ago that are being added to them today.

    And, to answer your other question, I have my own brain and I decide what kind of poison is pushed on my family. I will never, in this lifetime, get a flu shot, nor will anyone in my family. My family knows how to stay inside and recover from the flu. We dealt with the flu twenty years ago when there was no vaccine. Funny that there seems to be an increase of deaths after a flu shot was released, doesn't it? I'm sure you, your parents, and your grandparents all survived getting the flu multiple times
     
  10. Mangosteen

    Mangosteen Hold strong not

    This may be the most ill informed post on this site.
    You have the world at your finger tips please google "mooc vaccines" and begin some learning so your words aren't randomnly strung together.
     
  11. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member

    Didnt we have TB raising it's head a few years back for similar reasons?

    Also wasn't the relatively recent outbreak of measles put down to lots of unvaccinated kids?
     
  12. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    As I said. Safer than rampant disease. That's the point.
    That's how medicine works. You do a cost/benefit analysis (there are always costs to medicine...even "safe" medicine) and if the benefits outweigh the costs then a treatment is probably viable.
    Vaccine's are about the most successful medical intervention we've ever created.
    The fact you can ignore that shows how much vaccines have done for us.
    You live in a nice bubble where the reality of rampant diseases isn't apparent.

    You honestly think our understanding of vaccines and their make-up was better 50 years ago?
    That "poisonous crap" actually helps maintain the vaccine and ensure it's usable at the point of administration (very important in developing nations).
    Oh and I don't think polio is quite eradicated yet. And do you know why? Anti-vaccine propaganda (in polio's case it was Islamic anti-western propaganda IIRC).
    You probably think it's eradicated because for most cosseted westerners it seems like that. I've never met anyone crippled by it for example.
     
  13. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Indeed...it's been added to vaccines for 85 years! Hah.
     
  14. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Oh come on Dean...that's obvious. Measles was being eradicated by chi-gung and acupuncture. The fact people were also getting vaccinated was pure coincidence. :)
     
  15. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant

    Thanks for bringing this up PA! Just to keep the MAP readership informed, I have been celestially taught a unique form of Anti-Ebola Chi-Gung!

    Will teach* to anyone for nothing less than a prepayment of £ 999.99!

    *Please note all teaching will take place remotely via the medium of dreams. No refunds.

    Are you Ebola Proof?!? :yeleyes:

    :p
     
  16. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Yeah, the kids of migrant workers. It's in the article I linked to.
     
  17. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

  18. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant

  19. pecks

    pecks Valued Member

    Went to Uni with someone who had polio as a kid. She was born in India (and not vaccinated).
     
  20. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Exactly. The only person I can think of that I know had polio was Ian Dury out of Ian Dury and the blockheads.
    And there's a breakdancer called Junior that had it (caught in Africa when a child I think).
    Polio's pretty much a thing of the past in the developed world.
    So much for vaccines causing more harm than good.
     

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