Title meaning>?

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by Kframe, Jul 17, 2014.

  1. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    Language is like martial arts, a little bit of "knowledge" can often be dangerous. Unlike Western languages that share a common root, Japanese can be very tricky, and often how things are said makes a big difference in meaning. As for the title, it has already been explained. The why is the problem. Unless you are a trusted confidant of Hatsumi Sensei, chances are you will never get a firsthand explanation, just what so and so things or wants you to believe. If you aren't even in the organization and don't know the people involved, you are pretty much out of luck. Not that it's really that important in the first place. There are a few potential reasons that most people can already envision.

    1) It means something for the people receiving it and/or Soke

    2) It is meant as a kind of sign to others

    3) It really doesn't mean anything



    So, the choice of belief is yours. Many will gladly offer their expert opinion based on hearsay, or whatever. However, the only way to get an answer is to ask the boss or listen to what is given as the "official" explanation. But if you look at the above possibilities, something becomes clear.



    1) There is enough of a gap in skill, knowledge, understanding, and ability between the Shihan and the foreigners who like to claim this title and use it to refer to themselves. So another rank, award, or title isn't really necessary.

    2) The Shihan have all known and trained with Hatsumi sensei for decades, so though they might appreciate the recognition on behalf of Soke, the rank doesn't really do much for them. If they have Menkyo in any of the ryu, that is more than enough for them if they need any further affirmation and confirmation of their skills other than the obvious; the ability to use them.

    3) Whatever the reason, for most people, the third option is the reality of their understanding of the upper echelons of the Bujinkan. Maybe there is a reason, or a myriad of reasons that Hatsumi sensei does any particular thing or another. Yet, for most people it is moot. It's okay to ask why, but all you will usually be able to get is expert opinions, not simple facts. Yet the simple fact is that most of the things people concern themselves with have nothing to do with how to develop the skill and ability demonstrated by a rare few.

    For me, that is why conversations such as this don't really interest me, as they have nothing to do with my journey. Of course for those who are far away from the source, any nugget of information might seem useful. The problem becomes though, how do you sift through all the mud and silt to get to some real gold and not spend your time and effort chasing fool's gold instead.
     
  2. hatsie

    hatsie Active Member Supporter

    That's a question I can answer , having watched so many gold rush shows on foxtel ( and having a crush on Emily rydel shhhhhh)
    You get a good sluice plant! :D hoping for about $50 a yard
     
  3. benkyoka

    benkyoka one million times

    I think he may be trying to insulate them. When Soke decides to pass on his position to someone else the Bujinkan will fracture. Many people will think 'I am the same rank as that Japanese shihan' and proceed to make a mess of things. This way at least they are spared from having to get caught up in the 15th dan slugfest that is sure to happen.
     
  4. Niinpo

    Niinpo 万変不驚 Banpen Fugyo

    You can pretty well guess that what Soke does he does for good reason, as to what that reason is not important, we are always told to not compare ourselves to others, we may have the same goal but our paths are different. I remember similar questions when the first Judans and then every grade upto 15th dan first started, so it might just be the start of the next level.

    Either way, it will mean different things to different people and the important thing as usual is just to keep going and be happy for the people receiving the award. It is a huge accolade whatever it means to them and am sure it will add to their own personal insight and journey and ours if we follow them. :)
     
  5. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    That is coming perilously close to "god moves in mysterious ways". :(
     
  6. Kframe

    Kframe Valued Member

     
  7. benkyoka

    benkyoka one million times

    Superior skill is relative in the Bujinkan due to an environment that doesn't actively promote competition such as sparring, etc. For each person you find who holds someone in high regard you're likely to find someone who doesn't think much of them.

    To answer your first question, I don't know much about Shiraishi-sensei's background but I do know Ishizuka-sensei did competitive Judo in high school (he actually met Soke at Soke's medical clinic because he suffered a shoulder injury in a competition.)

    I don't know about needing to have a competitive background in order to be skilled, or thought of as skilled, in the arts of the Bujinkan but I do think it comes down to one's nature. Those who are inclined to test themselves, and in the process put themselves at risk, tend to stand out. It's all about the attitude.

    (and maybe you gotta like hurting people. ;) )
     
  8. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    To kind of piggyback on what benkyoka said, there is no illusion as to who really is skilled in these arts and the test is simple. For foreign megadan who don't even know or can't show competence in all the kata from the different ryu(or even all the kata in the tenchijin ryaku no maki for starters), they themselves are the only ones blind enough to follow and rate them when compared to the real Japanese Shihan.

    When the boss retires, this will become obvious as people will have to start choosing who to follow if the organization splits. That's when I'll get my popcorn out and start watching the fireworks.:)
     
  9. hatsie

    hatsie Active Member Supporter

    Tandoori flavour ?
     
  10. Count Duckula

    Count Duckula Valued Member

    If I had to speculate, I'd say it has something to do with that. There are umpteen shihan, and even a significant number of Japanese shihan or menkyo holders who might all split the Bujinkan. By doing this, Hatsumi may indicate whom people should follow, while still avoiding the implactions of explicitly naming a successor or stepping away.

    I don't know the 2 dai shihan involved and don't know much about Bujinkan politics, but if they happen to be on good terms, then having them made dai shihan would do a lot to keep the bujinkan unified.
     
  11. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member

    Or he's done it to keep the person he chooses as successor free for the important stuff.


    :yeleyes:
     

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