throwing heavier people in ju jitsu

Discussion in 'Ju Jitsu' started by ade1971, Sep 4, 2014.

  1. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Is the question how do I practice technique Z so it works, or is this a question of which technique is highest percentage against a heavier partner?

    Also do you mean vs no resistance, or with resistance?
     
  2. greg1075

    greg1075 Valued Member

    Timing, off balancing, footwork and getting your center of gravity below theirs is going to be key... If you think you're low, go lower (doing squats helps). Practice the entry and foot placement again and again, then practice the loading up again and again, then the whole throw again and again. The person's weight shouldn't matter as much as their height. If they're taller, it should become easier for you to get your center of gravity below theirs. Now short and heavy people are harder to throw and every aspect of the throw has to be executed better.
     
  3. bodyshot

    bodyshot Brown Belt Zanshin Karate

    OP all of this advice is very very good and when you take it as a whole this will all have you throwing almost anyone. Theres only one thing I would add to this, are you lookig around, what I mean by that is do you know what your doing or trying to do or are you kinda unsure and moveing slowly and looking around for advice. Judo and Jujitsu are not Taichi, in other words you gotta get aggressive, remain technically sound in the technique but you gotta go hard sometimes especially against a big heavy guy, remember its gonna take some doing to lift that guy.
     
  4. Aegis

    Aegis River Guardian Admin Supporter

    Smaller people shouldn't in general be trying to actually lift significantly larger guys. Far better to use sound technique to drop their weight rather than picking it up. Of course, if you're really strong, you can get away with it...
     
  5. Kave

    Kave Lunatic

    I agree with this, but if you are aiming to throw someone with a minimum reliance on strength then it is a lot easier at full speed, rather than trying to slow the technique down. If I am throwing a big guy, and if he is moving towards me, I can quickly use his own momentum to throw him (with a bit of luck). However, if I am trying to soften the throw, or slow it down, then I find that I end up holding their weight.

    I like the challenge of throwing bigger guys. If you get the throw right against a larger opponent it looks impressive and validates all the hours you have spent training, but if your technique is off you end up either stuffing your back, or face-down on the mat feeling like an idiot. That being said, I don't enjoy trying to slowly go through a throw with bigger guys because I inevitably end up carrying their weight.
     
  6. bigreddog

    bigreddog Valued Member

    As a big guy, I would suggest you need to do full speed technique, which means you need to hone it on smaller people. The problem is in practice we tend to be nice and decelerate the throw on our partners, but that won't work on bigger folks. Get us moving first, then execute at full speed.

    Of course people who have been knocked unconscious first are the easiest to throw.... :)
     
  7. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    All make good points. I'd add that depending on your style of jujutsu, the throws can be very different. Some throws work better on some body types as already mentioned, and some throws you should learn to make yourself a more rounded martial artist, others because you might actually think about using them if you ever needed to. For those techniques that are going to be high percentage for you, think about the simplest and least taxing moves. Why worry about trying to lift up a big guy and throw him when chances are you might end up hurting yourself or straining more when you can easily throw him with more efficient techniques(trips and techniques that make him throw himself without you having to carry his weight).

    Any technique can work if you do it perfectly(which comes with time and good practice), but any technique can be countered if you know how(again time and practice) so don't sweat it. If you follow some of the advice already laid out, you should make gains in your performance. Beyond that, know how to separate different techniques in your mind for use, historical interest, practice or gaining well roundedness, good for matches, etc. Some will fall into different categories based on your body type and preference.
     
  8. bodyshot

    bodyshot Brown Belt Zanshin Karate

    You know I think its the slow ones that hurt the worst, Ive seen stars from more than one inside no gi reap, believe me when I say I won my silver star t shirt the hard way.
     
  9. rne02

    rne02 Valued Member

    Being a smaller guy (165cm 64kgs), I found to opposite. If I tried to do things quickly there was no technique, it just ended up as Star Wars Jitsu (i.e. use the force).

    To learn throws I often broke them down into three stages. Off balance Uke, then get my feet in the right position and get my hips below Uke's hips, and thirdly execute the throw. There were of course some throws that that simply would never work in a month of Sundays once you start dealing with people twice your own body weight. Technique can only do so much, it can't but it can't defy the laws of physics :)

    Agree with you on the last bit though, it gets forgotten that throws are not supposed to be used in isolation, atemi aemi atemi, and then as he falls or gets off balanced, use your nage to "help him to the ground".
     
  10. Latikos

    Latikos Valued Member

    I love phrasing it like that :D

    That's the way I get shown every new throw and how my teachers make me learn them in the first place.

    If I were to try throws all fast and flashy before they *know* I can do the technique properly, I would be reminded to go slow for the moment.
    To get the finer parts of the mechanics (so that you can throw people more easily later, once you actually can do the throw and know what you're doing), it seems to be necessary to start slow.

    I don't even remember how often I would only get my Uke of balance, without anything else. An after that how often I would only get into the right position to "carry" him on my back (I'm lacking the correct word right now, sorry. I'll change it, once I found it :eek: )...

    Throws always look so easy, but (at least for me :D ) there is a lot of work behind them, until you do them properly.
     
  11. Alansmurf

    Alansmurf Aspire to Inspire before you Expire Supporter

    Uchekomi .....

    On ten throw ....
     
  12. greg1075

    greg1075 Valued Member

    Slow is good and good is fast.
     
  13. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Slow is smooth, smooth is fast
     
  14. greg1075

    greg1075 Valued Member

    I just reread my post and was like...what the...no idea where the word swap came from whatsoever.
     
  15. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Slow is smooth, Smooth is good and good is fast!
     
  16. GenghisK

    GenghisK Jiu Jitsu Kempoka

    The obvious point to me here is "which throw?"


    Different throws favour different body dynamic combinations.

    G
     

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