Certification Issue

Discussion in 'Tae Kwon Do' started by Hwoarang112, Jul 31, 2016.

  1. Hwoarang112

    Hwoarang112 New Member

    Hello - Years ago I was promoted to 1st Dan at my former dojang. I was give a certificate and later went to another Dojang (WTF/Kukkieon certified) and found out my certificate was fraudulant. This was a major blow to me as a 16 year old after working for about 5 years. I felt as if my time was wasted. I understand some may say the association/school should not matter. Howevr, I am against being given something that is not true.

    I have gone to ither dojangs in the past but due to work/finances and was either told I can wear my black belt but have to work up to their program...or start over as a white belt, where I skipped belts at promotions. I had instructors recognize I was certainly no white belt at sparring sessions.

    I have seen there are guys who have advertised certifying online taekwonwoo and others. I am now in my late 20's and also training Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu primarily and work full time. I have lost some flexibility but mentally that stuff never leaves you.

    Is something like that worth it? I may sound stupid but I dreamed of being reconized by the Kukkiwon and knowing my dojang's lineage.

    Kind Regards,
    A confused/disappointed and frustrated student
     
  2. Knee Rider

    Knee Rider Valued Member Supporter

    Well dude, that must be frustrating, but if having a recognised TKD black really means a lot to you then I'd suggest starting from square one in a legit school and working your way up. If you still enjoy TKD then it shouldn't be a chore :)

    Good luck with your BJJ too!
     
  3. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    From what I have seen, online certifications in most peoples eyes have no more legitimacy than your first fraudulent certificate.

    If things didn't leave you, you should be able to work through the ranks at a legitimate school quickly.

    Sorry that happened to you.
     
  4. Hwoarang112

    Hwoarang112 New Member

    To clarify the online certification is to test under a 6th dan and receive a 1st dan cert. from the kukkiwon.
     
  5. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Clarification doesn't change my statement. Online certifications are largely considered as a thing not worthy or respecting. Search the phrase on MAP here and you will see what I mean.
     
  6. Hwoarang112

    Hwoarang112 New Member

    Thank you very much for the feedback!
     
  7. Earl Weiss

    Earl Weiss Valued Member

    If you get a legit KKW cert how is anyone to know if you "got it online". or other wise question it's legitimacy?

    My first thought is that if this is truly possible, unless there is some extensive Skype or video review of your knowledge and abilities.

    Any KKW people care to weigh in on this Online KKW cert. thing.
     
  8. Hwoarang112

    Hwoarang112 New Member

    Hey Earl - So it seems you demonstrate kicking combinations, breaks, etc via video that is sent in. Same with the dan cert. He evaluates and goes from there. Thats how it was explained. Each kup/dan level has a time frame on how long it must be held.
     
  9. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    Just trying to come at this from another angle...

    In what way was the certificate you received after 5 years work "fraudulent"?

    Was it because your new school didn't recognise the certificate, because it was from another school/association?
    Perhaps they had a (financial) interest in you re-grading from white again?
     
  10. Xanth

    Xanth Valued Member

    That's the crux of all certificates. What makes it fraudulent ? I'm sure you worked hard to receive it, and if you believe in the abilities and respect the teacher that presented it to you, then it's a good certificate. Can you trace that instructor to see his lineage and who may have certified him? My BB certificate is legitimate, but I can't take it to any other school either without being told exactly what you were told. If it's KKW you want, then I'd suggest you find a reputable school and set down your roots there.
     
  11. Hwoarang112

    Hwoarang112 New Member

    He certificate had the kukkiwon logo/WTF logo on it but it was not from the kukkiwon.
     
  12. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    How do you know?

    Did your first school have affiliation to that body?
     
  13. Hwoarang112

    Hwoarang112 New Member

    Apparently not as my name was not in the kukkiwon registry for 1st dan. The instructor who taught mine was actually it seems an owner of mcdojos which seems to be something I found out.
     
  14. raaeoh

    raaeoh never tell me the odds

    A few months ago 1st dan from another style started at my school. Her belt is not recognized, her skill is.
     
  15. miles

    miles Valued Member


    Those types of certificates are available from several martial arts supply stores as well as eBay.


    Where are you located? Perhaps I can refer you to someone.
     
  16. Thomas

    Thomas Combat Hapkido/Taekwondo

    I remember quite a few years ago where a local master was issuing "Kukkiwon" certificates - printed out to look just like the official ones and charging 'official' prices (plus handling).

    Years later, when some of these black belts moved on to other schools and tested for higher dans, it became an issue that they had not been registered under the KKW. Their new GM contacted the Kukkiwon and explained what had happened... they were able to get their new grades but had to pay for the all of the previous grades. On the one hand it was nice to be allowed this flexibility but it really sucked that the previous guy got away with this (nothing happened to him... he still holds his KKW positions and such).

    My advice to you would be to consider how important the actual Kukkiwon certification is to you at this point. Most likely, you could join a good school and work with the instructors to "get back to form" and then test for your first dan and register it through the Kukkiwon. Alternatively you could find a non-KKW school that will honor your first dan ranking and start working towards 2nd dan. Regardless, a decent instructor will have you work for a while before testing for a dan rank under him/her.

    To be honest, belts function well as sort of a bookmark in the curriculum of that school and a KKW belt is nice for the international recognition. Realistically though, a dan rank is only really worth the most to you. Your actual skills are shown on the mat and a Kukkiwon cert won't make you better nor will it get you much beyond access to sanctioned tournaments and such.

    How much is it worth to you? Is it worth putting the time and money in to get that certification?
     

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