MA for a Bailiff

Hello, I work as a Bailiff. I often have to enter people homes, (usually they are NOT happy) I get shoved/attacked from time to time. sometimes by one person, and sometimes from 2/3 people (usually different directions) I am looking to add a Martial Art to combine with my employers Control and restraint, Physical Intervention training and spatial awareness training. Cleary I cant punch/kick people, but I can push them away, 'throw' them onto the floor from a forearm grab to pin, and even (if necessary) pin them on the floor with an arm lock.

I am looking at Judo, Wrestling, Sambo and BJJ

Which will help me the most for, grabs, throws, pins and multiple attacker (within reason)

Cheers

Brook

 

Hi there and welcome to map

Any of those arts you listed should cover what you want and in an alive manner (against a resisting opponent). The biggest factors would be quality of instruction, convenience and how much you enjoy it.

Do you have any clubs in mind or are you willing to tell us your rough location, because we can probably help you to narrow down your search a bit.

How much you enjoy it is a massive one, you can pick up bits and pieces quite quickly but to get good at anything takes time. You might be doing this for work but at the end of the day you still need to turn up and train in your own time, yoyr more likely to stick at it longer and ultimately get more out of your training that way. Best bet would be to get out there and try them all out, see what you prefer and such instructor/class you get on with best.

P.s. Did I mention judo?

 

How much Defensive Tactics have you had? In WA State ALL Bailiffs, Correction Officers, Bounty Hunters, And Non-Commissioned Officers all receive mandatory control tactics training (Control and Restraint) along with "usually" level 2 Defensive Tactics (Striking and Neck restraints).... I would seriously look into seeing what other options in Defensive Tactics you have.

As a former Law Enforcement Officer and current Defensive Tactics Instructor I can tell you that as far as Martial Arts is concerned any of the Judo, Aikido, Hapkido, systems would work fine.

 

Thanks for the welcome... That's is some great advice, I live I London. Is there something specific that I should be looking for a instructor?
What would your choice be of MA in my job?

 

Hapkido...Sweet advice bro.:yeleyes:

 

Its interesting that you mention Aikido, I like the 'ideas' of aikido, but concerned about the realism of the style, often it is considered soft. How can you make it effective and realistic? Im sure you have done this considering what you do for a living, or did you combine it with something else? Another style?

 

Taekwondo. Knock 'em through a second floor window with a spinning heel kick to the face and they'll never bother you again.

 

As an art it's great...less so as a combat system, but that is as much to do with the predominant training methodology as anything else

For your requirements a system with "larger" restraint options would suit best. Judo and Wrestling would be ideal as they involve larger mechanics that tend to be operable under duress when fine motor skills degrade. My preference would be for wrestling, but that is entirely due to preference. Judo is a great combat system and is cheap as chips. If you are in London consider BJJ too, as there are some exceptional schools in that area.

As a baliff you would also be looking to restrain/control and disengage, so striking systems would not be the primary operating system, but boxing is a great addition if only to work punch defense in the best way

Wrestling/Judo + Boxing = win!

 

Thanks Hannibal... I will defiantly take your advice on board... you mentioned disengagement techniques. I have been taught a couple during our training, does Judo or wrestling also teach disengagement? Thanks again

 

I Imagine that, Judo, BJJ, Wrestling and Sambo all teach control and restraint techniques?

 

I'm a massive fan of judo so personaly is suggest that but then I have a biased opinion. The one with the best teacher is what I'd suggest.

With regards to teachers someone who is licenced by a governing body to teach their system and has adequate insurance everything else is personal preference. An instructor who's teaching style you prefer is more important than what grade they are and such (in my opinion).

With disengagement techniques judo has grip fighting that could come close but I dont think I have ever seen disengagement techniques taught as such. I would imagine that the other styles have similar elements but not having studied them I can't say for sure. Always worth speaking to your instructor though, they may know how to tailor their sylabus to meet your needs

 

Biased opinion ...

Jujitsu ..

in West London if any good

regards

Smurf

 

Another biased opinion: Kajukenbo

Except there probably isn't anything really you can use, as a style that focuses on striking and attacking the attacker. You could change punches into palm strikes, which could arguably be a hard shove. Multiple attackers can and should be offered, but if it isn't, you could always speak with your instructor on how to do deal with that. Is obviously won't be a quick fix, there has to be a lot of study in the style to competently use the martial art, but if it does get to fists, I'm not sure if that is legal for you but I'm going to assume that if you do need to go to striking, you are protected law to protect yourself. Kajukenbo will offer that kind of training, subduing your opponent efficiently, and probably making your opponent not want to continue their physical confrontation. There are some parts where you could cause serious bodily harm to an individual, but that goes with all martial arts and also your discretion. Ex: In Kajukenbo, at one of our defenses, you finish with a kick to the head while your opponent was just recently thrown, this obviously isn't legal because at that point in opponent is a non combatant but if you do throw it, you chose to throw it. Same thing with an arm bar in BJJ, if you keep that arm bar, and keep going past the normal range of motion, you could break their arm. It's not the aggressive solution of certain martial arts, but the discretion of the user.

 

Aikido is actually one of the few systems that's incorporated in most Law Enforcement training (although many either don't know or don't give credit). Due to it's gentleness and practicality. The realism you speak of with regards to control and restraint is quite practical, for example having to throw someone to the ground, or using a pressure point to subdue. Aikido follows the same approach as most of the other soft styles (Hapkido, Judo, Ju-Jitsu, etc).... To put it simply, many of the Control Tactics used in Defensive Tactics and control and restraint come from many of those systems mentioned.


Kajukenbo, Jeet Kune Do, Keysi, Krav Maga, all work but you have to think of the purpose and liability.

 

Judo, JJ or wrestling. Or best advice, if you perceive any potential issues, dial 101 and set up an appointment with the Police to also attend to Prevent Breach of the Peace.

 

Thanks Smurf. Would that be BJJ? or JJJ?

 

For work, this. It will be less hassle for you if it's the cops smacking people around instead of you!

Also, it's all well and good you learning something and slinging someone across the room, or pinning them to the ground in an arm bar, but where do you go from there? Try and reach your phone before they rush you? Fish through a pocket while they are pinned, or let them go and hope they don't get lucky the next time they come at you while you're trying to call it in?

Please don't see this as me putting you off learning something. Go for it by all means. I'm just trying to help with things you may have not considered. If you lash someone through a coffee table or whatever, it's your word against theirs when the rozzers arrive.

I know next to nothing about your line of work, save for what I've seen on tv. How about body worn video? People can be less likely to attack if they realise it will be documented and will be caught.

If you can de-escalate before you go hands on, all the better. I'm sure you're aware of all this too, so please don't find this post patronising by any means

Finally, if you can justify it, you can use whatever force you feel necessary at the time, so don't worry too much about punches and knees etc. Saying that maybe learn a striking art and adapt with open hand slaps instead of a punch if you're not comfortable smacking someone in the chops!

 

Hanging with a lot of people from both sides. Police won't be "smacking" anyone around. They would stand there and make sure no one kicks off. But its not all on the side of the Bailiffs.
Their paperwork would be thoroughly checked (especially if its privately handled ie civil recovery).
Because in the end it is a legal document and if a certain process is not followed or paperwork not correctly done, then the Bailiffs could be illegally recovering items.

I would say the onus is on both parties to make sure the paperwork is correct.

A person can also refuse Bailiffs entry, they cannot force entry unless they have a legal warrant.
That also includes stepping a foot in the door to prevent it closing.
In shared housing, they can only recover what is owned by the person involved. However that can be hard to prove unless there's a receipt for everything.

 

I realise that, it was a lighthearted comment. I hang with a lot of people from one side...

What I meant was that if there did turn out to be a scuffle, it would be better and easier for the OP if the police had to deal with it instead of himself

 

I totaly agree with the point you make however i disagree with the conclusion you draw from it and the advice you have given here.

It's better to get the police involved when there's a conflict sure but they may not always be avaliable and they might take a while to arrive. Repossessions are risky and I my self would much rather know some basic judo (for example) and still use the police and try to avoid/deescalate any potential incidents. Why limit yourself to one potential method when you can employ multiple methods to ensure your safety.

It seemed like you were saying physical intervention was pointless and I think that irresponsible advice to give some one working in a potentialy dangerous industry.