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  #496  
Old 27-Aug-2015, 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by qazaqwe View Post
I can't attest to having officially trained in it, although i did go to an "mma gym" that i believe was being run by a group of hapkido practitioners, but i was under the distinct impression that low kicks were not practiced in hapkido, unless you counted instep stomps?
I would guess that the school you checked out probably wasn't a typical 'Hapkido' school. Most HKD schools use a lot of low line kicks. Some use lots of high and acrobatic kicks as well.
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  #497  
Old 27-Aug-2015, 01:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giovanni View Post
traditional hapkido means post world war 2 and based on drajj.
Agreed

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ksw was not even codified as a system until the 60's. in my mind, you can't be traditional if you've mashed two relatively new systems together. sure, you can make the argument that ksw techniques or drajj go back centuries. whatever. mashing the two together isn't exactly traditional in my view.
I don't know... I think it gets pretty tough to argue through this stuff.

In my opinion, I think KSW is about as 'traditional' as Hapkido is, depending on what you call 'Hapkido'. Choi Yong-sool's 'Hapkido' is pretty much DRAJJ (traditional), probably with some Judo influence (from Suh Beok-sup). What became known world-wide as 'Hapkido' is more the DRAJJ + Ji Han Jae Dojunim and Kim Moo-hyun additions (esp. kicking). My understanding is that KSW in the early years was pretty much Hapkido + Forms + some chinese influence. Is Ji Han-jae Dojunim's combination of HKD roots and other stuff more 'traditional' than GM Suh In-hyuk's combination of HKD and other stuff?

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  #498  
Old 27-Aug-2015, 01:30 AM
qazaqwe qazaqwe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thomas View Post
I would guess that the school you checked out probably wasn't a typical 'Hapkido' school. Most HKD schools use a lot of low line kicks. Some use lots of high and acrobatic kicks as well.
It was more that even in the context of mixed martial arts, or an interpretation of it at least, the concept seemed almost completely ignored, which made me think it was a facet of hapkido, the high kicks were very much present, as were the joint locks and throws, although the grappling seemed focused on fast exchanges with little mat work, but no one who instructed me ever showed me anything resembling a low kick outside of a few very low stomps to the ankle joint, does that sound like a form of hapkido, or other Korean martial art?

Last edited by qazaqwe; 27-Aug-2015 at 01:33 AM. Reason: Overuse of the word grappling.
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  #499  
Old 28-Aug-2015, 01:31 PM
Giovanni Giovanni is offline
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Originally Posted by Thomas View Post
Is Ji Han-jae Dojunim's combination of HKD roots and other stuff more 'traditional' than GM Suh In-hyuk's combination of HKD and other stuff?
while i understand what you're getting at, it seems to me that the combination of however you want to define hkd and however you want to define ksw isn't exactly "traditional". that's really the question. because now we're getting into drajj + judo + kicks + chinese forms + native korean arts. right?

in this sense, i think "traditional" is really just a marketing gimmick.
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  #500  
Old 28-Aug-2015, 02:05 PM
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Shihan Shihan is offline
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Greetings all,

It's been a while since I have been here and it's good to see Thomas is still sharing his wisdom with the rest of us. As for the term "tradition" when applied to hapkido or any martial arts, I take this approach and view it as such: A lake on a mountain top supplies water to the different towns in a valley below. The towns are at the north, south, east west points of the mountain, so the water travels down 4 different paths to water the towns. In one town, the water pools together in a stream. In the next town, it comes together at a lake with fish in it. Another town it serves as a waterfall. And in the last town, it gathers underground and comes up in a well for all to use. If you needed water, what town would you go to? The one that fills your need. We can all point back to a line from where the art originated, but the most importantly (to me) is my instructor a competent one? Also, where does my interest really lie? self defense?, good health?, tradition?, tournaments? What is a person real need for training. This may seem simplistic, maybe even naive, but if you did your research and the instructor belongs to a reputable federation and/or comes from a line of well known/good teachers, I say go for what you know.
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  #501  
Old 28-Aug-2015, 03:02 PM
Giovanni Giovanni is offline
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this is why i hate martial arts.
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  #502  
Old 28-Aug-2015, 04:28 PM
qazaqwe qazaqwe is offline
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How many people have the same picture of wolverine as their avatar? Has this ever been discussed as being a thing? Why does everyone do this?
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  #503  
Old 28-Aug-2015, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giovanni View Post
while i understand what you're getting at, it seems to me that the combination of however you want to define hkd and however you want to define ksw isn't exactly "traditional". that's really the question. because now we're getting into drajj + judo + kicks + chinese forms + native korean arts. right?

in this sense, i think "traditional" is really just a marketing gimmick.
I think we are on the relatively same line of thinking, just arguing semantics

I think the term "traditional" is very tough to use with Korean arts, unless you use a lot of latitude. If you call Hapkido 'traditional', despite its relative newness and its (continued) period of evolution, then Hwarangdo and Kuk Sool Won are pretty much 'as traditional'.

That said, those arts like Hapkido, Hwarangdo, Kuk Sool Won, and even Taekwondo have been around for 50+ years and have a fairly common definition of 'what they are' and what a legit lineage is... I'm "OK" with calling them 'traditional' now.

I think they main difference between 'traditional' and 'non-traditional' is the approach the leaders take in addressing changes in the approach they use. If they try to 'harken back' to their traditions, or if they look to outside sources/more modern approaches marks the distinction well.
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  #504  
Old 29-Dec-2015, 01:50 PM
fcom1844 fcom1844 is offline
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Completely agreed with Thomas - the argument is for what is and isn't "traditional" is subjective.

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  #505  
Old 08-Mar-2017, 04:49 PM
jfuk jfuk is offline
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No nonsense HKD... should be called nonsense!

I know this school as I tried it out a while ago and I gotta say I was not too impressed. I have taken other martial arts before, but the teacher and other students were pretty cool and easy to get along with. I have moved to Mississauga and thought I would try this school, but I found nothing but immaturity and little kid-like attitudes, including the teacher Ian Gibbs.

When I told him about these things, the didn't seem to care or mind. He actually got a little upset when I began asking him questions. How pathetic for a teacher. I was a little surprised at his attitude. And he boasted on his website that he got a black belt in Tae kwon do under Master Ooi, from the WTF. When I got suspicious I actually called Master Ooi who told me that he knew of him and, yes, he did train him. But he did NOT give him a black belt! I knew right away this guy Ian is a fraud and phony, and so I got out of there in a hurry.

Others too should be careful. He knows a thing or two about hkd but a true black belt he is not and I can see that. I've also noticed that since then he has taken that claim, (that he has a black belt), off of his website. I guess he is just a business man and a fairly smart one, who doesn't want to get sued.
Oh well, buyer be ware, as it is said. I hope this helps anyone who is looking for a decent school. Don't go here because you won't get very far, and that's because you can't. A student can only be as good as their teacher.
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  #506  
Old 08-Mar-2017, 05:14 PM
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This place?

http://nononsensehapkido.com
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  #507  
Old 08-Mar-2017, 05:37 PM
Giovanni Giovanni is offline
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the guy is calling his school hapkido yet has no hapkido ranking?

i'm obviously in the wrong business. if this guy can own a school, then there's got to be something i can do with 1st dan hapkido, blue bjj and 6th kyu aikido.

HAP-JU-KI opening up in 2017!

Last edited by Giovanni; 08-Mar-2017 at 08:38 PM.
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  #508  
Old 08-Mar-2017, 08:03 PM
fcom1844 fcom1844 is offline
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Yes sir!

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  #509  
Old 09-Mar-2017, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfuk View Post
I know this school as I tried it out a while ago and I gotta say I was not too impressed. I have taken other martial arts before, but the teacher and other students were pretty cool and easy to get along with. I have moved to Mississauga and thought I would try this school, but I found nothing but immaturity and little kid-like attitudes, including the teacher Ian Gibbs.

When I told him about these things, the didn't seem to care or mind. He actually got a little upset when I began asking him questions. How pathetic for a teacher. I was a little surprised at his attitude. And he boasted on his website that he got a black belt in Tae kwon do under Master Ooi, from the WTF. When I got suspicious I actually called Master Ooi who told me that he knew of him and, yes, he did train him. But he did NOT give him a black belt! I knew right away this guy Ian is a fraud and phony, and so I got out of there in a hurry.

Others too should be careful. He knows a thing or two about hkd but a true black belt he is not and I can see that. I've also noticed that since then he has taken that claim, (that he has a black belt), off of his website. I guess he is just a business man and a fairly smart one, who doesn't want to get sued.
Oh well, buyer be ware, as it is said. I hope this helps anyone who is looking for a decent school. Don't go here because you won't get very far, and that's because you can't. A student can only be as good as their teacher.
Please forgive me for asking, but a post like this does raise some 'red flags'... your first post (and only) is on the 'Hapkido Check-in' thread to 'call out' a Hapkido school owner as a 'fraud and phony'.

I am curious as to what your Hapkido background is and why you feel the need to make this kind of statement on a general introductory thread. I am sorry, but the tone of your post sounds like a deeper bad-blood connection to this guy than just a 'disappointed in a school I checked out' post.

I could be wrong, of course, and apologize in advance

That said, as an experienced Hapkido student and instructor...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hannibal
I like that there are lots of videos on the site, but have to confess that the ones I watched were not terribly impressive.

Looks like he's shooting for a simpler self defense type system but it also looks like he's adding in some kids' stuff and flash to pay the bills.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Giovanni
the guy is calling his school hapkido yet has no hapkido ranking?
If I recall, this instructor's name came up a few pages back as a student of GM Hwang In-shik, someone who produces very, very good martial artists. I believe someone said he was an 'orange belt' under Gm Hwang. I do know that GM Hwang's belt system runs a lot slower than most other groups and that an Orange belt probably has 3-5 years of training (or more). I've seen posts that this guy has maintained some sort of connection to GM Hwang.

So... yeah, he does have a legit Hapkido background of at least a few years from a well known instructor, but most likely doesn't have a black belt from him (I seem to recall that GM Hwang gives out very few black belts and only after many, many years of study).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Giovanni
i'm obviously in the wrong business. if this guy can own a school, then there's got to be something i can do with 1st dan hapkido, blue bjj and 6th kyu aikido.

HAP-JU-KI opening up in 2017!
Go ahead.... with the right advertising, you'd probably make money!
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  #510  
Old 15-Mar-2017, 06:48 PM
budoshingikan budoshingikan is offline
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I felt like the nonsene hapkido link was pretty informative. I've even gone as far as to share it with a few of my students.

I personally feel that if someone wants to open a school so long as they've trained for a while it's on them. If they don't know what they're doing it will fail pretty quickly to be honest.

Either way, have a great day guys!

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