Martial arts weapons uk law

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Arcaderat5, Dec 29, 2016.

  1. Arcaderat5

    Arcaderat5 Member

    Hi all. Quick question. I practice in the local parks. If i were to take my sticks there and train with my partner e.g. sinwali, will we get arrested?

    Ive emailed the police this question but they havent replied for the past few days...

    Thanks :)
     
  2. Mushroom

    Mushroom De-powered to come back better than before.

    Try their Twitter (depending on where you are).

    If it's just sticks and you're simply practicing and being very obvious that you're practicing. No. It is highly unlikely you will be arrested. You may get stopped, depending on what you're doing and if you're scaring the locals and Cops may get called to ask whats going on.

    Basically. Keep your sticks in your bag. Maybe where your schools clothes with clear logos. Carry ID. And when you done. Sticks back in your bag and go home.

    Blades however. Yes you will most likely be stopped and confiscated.
     
  3. Alansmurf

    Alansmurf Aspire to Inspire before you Expire Supporter

    ^^^^

    What the Shroomer said !!

    Be polite disarm yourself if approached and reasonably explain your presence and the sticks .

    try to find a secluded spot to train so as not to alarm others
     
  4. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    I train in parks myself, including some sword work.

    I've never been stopped by the authorities for using wooden swords, as it is fairly obvious they are not sharp, and I don't (usually) harrass members of the public with them.

    Be sensible. Be open about what you're doing. You should be fine.
     
  5. Anth

    Anth Daft. Supporter

    If needs be go to the local police station and ask personally. I'm sure they'd rather a few questions than a full armed response to two nutters attacking each other with swords. Maybe have a few photos of the weapons as not everyone will know what you're talking about then, as Shroom says, keep some ID and something like a martial arts club membership handy.
     
  6. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    It is also worth asking the Park Keeper/ Staff as they may have their own rules about what you can and cannot do - certainly when I worked as one there were things we would not allow within certain city parks....and that was in Hull where the bar was very low!
     
  7. Tom bayley

    Tom bayley Valued Member

    Speaking as someone who has been arrested while practicing in the park.

    Yep! you can be arrested but it should not lead to a prosecution.

    The thing is not to carry an offensive weapon.

    The definition of an offensive weapon is “any article made or adapted for use for causing injury to the person, or intended by the person having it with him for such use by him, or by some other person. (N.B. this definition includes a disguised knife). It is an offence for any person who without lawful authority or reasonable excuse has with him in any public place any offensive weapon." https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q338.htm

    A stick carried for practice of a sport is not an offensive weapon. So practicing wu shu with a stick in public would be legal as it is a performance sport. The same could be said for practicing sport sparring with a partner (although this might be harder to argue)

    Common sense is the key. If you are approached by a member of the public or an official put the sporting item on the ground by your feet before you speak to them.
    Should you be arrested you should ask for legal advice.

    When I was arrested. The police insisted that they would release me if I agreed to accept a caution for possession of offensive weapons. A caution is an admission of legal guilt. It goes on your criminal record. I politely pointed out that I would not accept a caution as I was innocent. After six or seven hours I was released without charge and dropped of at home by a friendly police man.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2017
  8. GlennBlack

    GlennBlack Banned Banned

    I go in the woods as it saves that potential inconvenience of having to deal with Police.

    An artists uses paint brushes to paint that is their tool you are a martial artist and the sword ect are your tools to practice with not weapons.
    A park does not actually require permission to train in as you will find the land owner will not be able to sign a permit to allow you to do so you will meet refusal and a bs excuse about liability insurance and health and safety.
    It then becomes a civil matter in law between you and the council managing the land they don't own and now the Police have no jurisdiction as it's a civil matter and there can be no force of criminal law in a civil matter where there is no injured party.
    But as I've already pointed out I go in the woods as I can't be bothered educating Police about the law.
    I think Toms post above demonstrates beautifully how daft they can be sometimes without even realising!
     
  9. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    Good luck with this nonsense.
     
  10. GlennBlack

    GlennBlack Banned Banned

    Nonsense?
    Ok so you have sat down and studied law and read the law books and understand what legalese is and speak from first hand experience not opinion ?
    I think you will find it is law which you clearly do not know otherwise you would not hold the ignorant opinion that it's nonsense.
     
  11. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    So your opinion is that someone elses opinion is just an opinion.

    Do you actually have any proof to back up your claim.

    References to the law and/or specific legal cases would be valid here, more hersay would not.
     
  12. GlennBlack

    GlennBlack Banned Banned

    In the first instance I have my own life experience then I can quote law if needed but I'm not here to legally represent or educate people who simply think I'm talking nonsense rather than maturely ask me to share my experience and knowledge respectfully.
    If you are using self defence in public and do not have the legal knowledge required to deal with the authorities then that needs to be added to that training.
    If people want that knowledge I am happy to provide a link to the appropriate legal documentation for them to read then we can to begin to explore how to use that hen dealing with Police officers who falsely accuse us of wrong doing.
    Fair enough?
     
  13. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    The purpose of Martial Arts Planet has always been to bring people from around the world together to discuss and further our knowledge of the martial arts and associated topics.

    Just saying. :D

    Carry on.
     
  14. GlennBlack

    GlennBlack Banned Banned

    Totally agree Simon I was simply pointing out I am happy to share but insults are unnecessary it's childish behaviour.
     
  15. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Thats exactly what i asked for in the first place!

    also backing up your points with evidence is just good practise.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 6, 2017
  16. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    Glenn, your bio says you've been a reality based instructor with over 30 years experience.

    I've just watched a couple of your videos and have to ask you to elaborate please.

    How to you structure your training and do you have your own school.
     
  17. GlennBlack

    GlennBlack Banned Banned

    Thats exactly what i asked for in the first place!

    also backing up your points with evidence is just good practise.[/QUOTE]

    Good practice?

    I would disagree about backing up my points with evidence as what you call points I call facts because I have the knowledge to know they are facts because I am a professional and not ignorant of the law and do not need to prove anything unless you hire me to represent you in matters of the law!
    Good practice is ensuring you have the knowledge to understand what you are reading and if you require further information or clarification you conduct yourself properly seeking that clarification otherwise you get left out in the cold.

    I will sort some documentation and upload it into Dropbox and post it up in due course.
     
  18. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    Glenn I'm going to call you on this.

    I removed the link to your website, as we don't allow links back to personal site, but it certainly didn't show you as a legal professional for hire.

    I also removed the link to your You Tube channel and let me tell you swinging a pair of chucks in a corn field doesn't make you a reality based self defence instructor.

    Again, your call.

    I can't find any reference to you having a martial arts school, or any reality based training.

    We have some of the best reality based SD instructors on MAP, so if you are as experienced as you say you'll be known by one of them.

    My advise is to take a step back, look around the forums, join in where you can and don't pretend to be anything other than someone with a love of the martial arts.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 6, 2017
  19. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Actually although you are right in the broad sense you are less so at the nuances - it is not a complicated process to employ other areas of law to support a removal from a public area provided legal articulation behind them.can be done

    With regards to weapon trianing in a park it would not be difficult to have you removed legally should that be the desired result

    There are several supporting legislative aspects to this including ownership of the land (Royal Parks have a different set of rules than municipal), breach of the peace and in certain cases aggravated trespass...This does not even enter into the law surrounding weapons themselves and the minefield that entails nor does it get into the bylaws that as often as not fill in the gaps left by criminal legislative measures and can equally be enforced by a Peace Officer (thereby triggering S.25 PACE considerations)

    So yes you may have a counter claim/defense at the court level but you are likely getting removed at the initial contact if that is what is being sought and the officer has even a remote idea of what they are doing
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2017
  20. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    I look forward too it . ..

    But if you want to be taken seriously here, a little evidence of your facts goes a long way to help others in the conversation, I'm canadian originally so its very easy to not know other countries laws.

    Remind me again, are you an expert witness or lawyer?
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2017

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