raising Qi?

Hey,
as most of us Ma´s know chi (Ki, Qi etc.) is one of the most useful tools and weapons of almost any Ma-system.
But are there generalls ways to raise one´s chi?
I´ve experienced that on some days I´m kind of exhausted and I´m feeling my chi is low, then training is not so eficient as normally.
I know that there are some ways to do it with Yoga but I´m personally not doing any Yoga.

 

Jessyblue

I think the mystical/spritiual/chi/Qi stuff is important to many people for different reasons as to me it is of no use anymore as I am looking at the training aspect and self defence aspect alone.

It is more a TMA thing and has been around for centurys, its odd as its one of the things you cant really measure so I find it a strange one to really commment on.

My original Karate stuff it was important then, in Kickboxing it was not used, Taijitsu it was a bit but was a silent thing as it defeats the stealth aspect, in all the other arts I have done it has had no use so I guess as I was getting by without it for so long I dropped it.

I dont think it has been proved that it exists so I guess its a hard subject to quantify or teach - still I am no expert on it.

SONSHU

 

Qi- I'm not going to be as rude as I was last time, But I am going to be sceptical. What it really is is the chinese pseudo-science's concept of a universal life force- a dead body has no chi. A living one has it. This way of thinking about the world is internally coherent and sometimes actually works e.g. it produces the workable hypothesis that you need to exercise ('laziness softens the muscles'). Rather like some greek doctrines, it lacks the necessity of rigorous scientific proof. I still doubt very much that it is a mystical energy that one can accumulate in huge quantities and then channel to produce 'magical' effects.
If you're still interested, here is a long excerpt from 'kung fu, methods, philosophy and technique'.
Oh damn, lost the book. Be back to you on this one. It has these things called the 'five restrictions' and the 'eight somethingorothers'. It's all basically common sense, apart from the mumbojumbo about sex, and doesn't offer you anything you couldn't get from western methods of practice. Just in my opinion.

 

I was being polite

I do not believe in any of that stuff I just believe in the techniques being applied and working.

Comes back to the fight in the 70's where 10 kung fu masters all with wonga apparent chi had a fight with 10 thai boxers.

The Thai fighers won - results are desputed its either 10-0 to the thai's or 9-1 to the thai's either way the chi did not help then!

Some people are into it and thats cool but I am more sceptical and only look at stuff that can be measured, this cant and not can the benefits of other martial things done by more traditional people.

Still each to there own.

SONSHU

 

I think Chi as a method can help in many different ways in life - Chi being a concentration & meditation not a mystical power.

It can help through times of physical pain & also anguish or mental pain - at times when you need concentration or inner peace.

It will not help you win a fight because of it's mystical power; it CAN however as pointed out before help concentration (this would help more in a fight where the two fighters are evenly matched in technique) but in the end it will be the better fighter with the better techniques where techniques differ, that wins!

 

Sounds to me like logic

Just pay attention when you are fighting and as you said the better fighter wins which is obvious and irreleavant of Chi or any of the like.

I would say it is one of the things that people use to mistify students all this talk of chi and aura's etc. I don't know of any scientific proof to support it exists. Could be wrong has anyone got any repots on it?

SONSHU

 

Sometimes the use and/or development of Ki (Qi, Chi) gets dismissed by people because they've been led to believe it is some kind of mystical energy or magic power. It gets dissed by martial artists and non-martial artists alike usually because of a lack of understanding.

Ki refers to the body's natural energy. The muscles and nerves work through electric impulses (for more details, refer to a science book or medical text). A human can devlop their body to more efficiently produce and use the electricity within their own body. It's not magical, it's just tuning your body to produce and use the energy more efficently. Through proper development, you can become a bit faster (because your nerve relays work faster) and you can develop more striking power (because your nerve relays work faster). What are some ways to develop Ki?

1. Work on breathing control. Most people don't breathe correctly... most people don't use their entire lung capacity. Practice (Yoga style) breathing... controlled breaths that fill up the diaphram to the lower lung to the top of the lung and then exhale slowly in reverse. By maximizing the Oxygen that enters the blood, your energy will go up.

2. Making your body flexible through stretching and movement. This generates more blood flow to your extremities and passes blood and oxygen through your body (hence more energy). This can be done with patterns (and forms) or postures as found in Hatha Yoga

3. Developing the way you expend your energy outward when striking or blocking... usually through a "ki-hap" (energy-uniting yell). With this last minute EXHALATION, your body tenses and electricity races through your muscles and nerves providing a burst of speed and power.

Ki is not mystical. Many martial artists develop it without calling it chi/ki/Qi. It takes a lot of practice and work to develop great power using Ki. This additional power in some cases can be felt coming from the person (current jumping) and this is where you get your stories of ki knockouts and whatnot. Can it be done? Yes, if you've developed your personal energy well and if you direct it to weaknesses (esp. pressure points, which are really nerve junctions) you can overload/knock out certain facilities. Does this work in a real life situation? Not too well because of the concentration and aiming and such needed to use it. Does developing ki make you a stronger, faster, and better martial artist? Yes.

For most people who develop ki (ask people who study Hapkido, Aikido, Tai Chi Chuan, etc.), we will not reach any sort of ability to do mystical-looking things, but developing ki makes your body healthier (improved circulation, nerve status, brain awareness) and can help response time in fighting. In addition, ki development usually leads into using the improved electrical systems of your body to heal faster.

 

Now I want to be careful here but

I think its a lot of groovy word bending and the sort of thing a TKD person would say.

I feel all the stuff you have said is done through training, noting more or nothing less.

The energies you talk of can not be measured and as a result can not be tested. I did a Thai chi class where when I was asked to get into horse stance I could feel the ball thing and admit I was slighly taken back. However I still think its is more muscle trickery.

The Ki or Qi, Chi etc is a fastest gun in the west trick as you can not prove or disprove it. Hence there will always be believers. Breathing is critical for training and I do watch my breathing and have played with it a little.....but.....the rest of the stuff is a karate/tkd/other styles type of packaging/branding/marketing tool.

Its just my view guys but until I see proof I am not a believer. If a Ki is done it might make me jump, still it will alert my mates and we will clobber him! - joke!

SONSHU

 

And just what sort of person is a "TKD person"? I hope that you are not going to apply some sort of unfounded sterotype upon me without having ever met me and without knowing what kind of training I have done.

That said (and yes, I am a bit offended by that kind of off hand dismissal because of the style I follow... I would never consider insulting someone's point of view because they followed a differed style than myself), if you carefuly read what I wrote, you'll notice that you view and mine are similar. Specifically, I do teach that ki is not mystical and that the benefits are attained through the training systems of most martial arts.

To summarize... ki is energy. Energy is what controls the body (nerves and synapses). If you make your electrical system work faster, your performance improves. Nothing mystical... just hard work. Many styles teach it with different words.

As far as measuring ki, it is difficult without expensive equipment. I presume that you do not measure the speed of punches/kicks that you throw in class, nor do you measure the preasure per square inch that a lock applies to the body, nor do you measure your running speed or the amount of damage you can take in any sort of formula. If you have the right equipment, you may be able to. I bet that your dojang doesn't have it. If my dojang could afford to buy that kind of equipment, we wouldn't... we would spend it on other training aids.

I find it interesting that you mention that you are unqualified to give much advice on ki and that you don't believe in it ...

("I think the mystical/spritiual/chi/Qi stuff is important to many people for different reasons as to me it is of no use anymore as I am looking at the training aspect and self defence aspect alone.

It is more a TMA thing and has been around for centurys, its odd as its one of the things you cant really measure so I find it a strange one to really commment on.")

but you have posted 4 of the 8 replies on the topic. The original poster requested information on developing ki, not a poll of whether you believe in it or not and if this person already practices ki, do you think that your argument of "well, I don't believe in it so you shouldn't do it..." is going to change their mind?

If my response offends you, I apologize in advance.

 

Sonshu - i sence you already use Chi, you just don't use the phrase " " Again it depends what you call Chi. You don't call it Chi but you say that breathing & concentration is something you practice - within this practice is Chi as I understand it.......concentration, as when a martial artist goes through a board or more to the point doesn't first time; you slow your breathing filling your lungs more than you did the first time & begin to focus more.....concentrating.......building & psyching yourself up..........this is Chi as I understand it, the fact of the matter is all athletes use this technique al the time & people use it in their everyday lives, to twist that bottle top or to carry that shopping one more block.

In that sence its an extremely useful tool & if you can harness it easier, be more focused for longer periods of time........then that can't be bad & only be positive.

As for mystical powers - naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!

 

Thomas

Before you go off the deep end.

My words were not intended as an insult - it was because the styles you do work on that belif - hence it is the sort of answer you do, its like a judo person saying they done believe in throws!!!!!

Am I right in that you do this as a part of your style as I think all people in TKD do and Hapkido (not 100% on this one).

I do belive in concentration as its critical but so many people cloud the issue to themselves and others that it is somthing its not. I was not insulting you or passing judgement but merely pointing out your reasons for your belif in it.

As for measuring a lock to throw you can do cos it hurts people or works, the chi of techniques can not be proved or disproved as it is one of the things you can not at this point in time measure.

Ki or what ever name you give it is so often miss used in packaging or saying someone has strong chi because they are better than you. When they are better than you because they are better than you. Stronger, trained longer etc.

I am just very sceptical as I have heard a lot of bolix from people claiming this and that with these spriitual/energy/mystical type things.

Never once did I say anything bad about you but merely that is the sort of answer you would have based on the styles you do. There is a common trend with people train of thought created by the exposure they have had to theres and other styles.

Sorry if you took it the wrong way but I was stating why you would feel how you do - fair assessment????

SONSHU

 

Morphus

I honestly dont feel I use it - the reason I look at breathing is because when in sustained physical activity it is important to allow certain effects.

The reason I know techniques work is because they have been done on me. You seem to have a sensible aproch to it but I honestly dont feel it is somthing I can tap into.

My state of mind affects my performance I am just into not miss leading people in stuff that is specific to the individual - again why I feel like I do about Kata. DONT GO ONTO THESE SUBJECT JUST STATEING IT!!!!!!!!!!!

I dont feel people can really educate others on it as it is just a state of mind, people do massive things in this world but do not give it a silly eastern name. Its just confidence and belif and training not a thing that is many things to some and nothing to others.

ALSO that CHI knock out thing - see where I am going!

SONSHU

 

Sonshu:

"Sorry if you took it the wrong way but I was stating why you would feel how you do - fair assessment????"

Thank you for your defense of my thinking but it's not necessary. I think my posts adequately cover what I think and why. Yes, I answer they way I have been trained... by masters and people who have studied this stuff for a long time. There is more involved than "groovy word bending". Their knowledge goes back a long time and has served them well in their lives. However, my answer is based on my own views and conclusions, and should not be taken to be representative of entire styles (which if you do a search will see lots of different thoughts between followers of the same style.)

Yes, Ki is a central component of Hapkido (hence the middle character "Ki"). Can Ki be measured absolutely? No. Can it be felt (to compare with the examples of a lock/fall/punch hurting)? Yes. There are many things which are not (or cannot be) measured. Martial arts schools don't measure the force of kick/punch/throw/lock in absolute terms... maybe by mild/medium/strong power... but not by absolute numbers.

I personally have felt ki energy used in varying quantities and could measure it from mild to great... but not with numbers. I have used Ki energy. Again, it is NOT mystical, but it is a way of using your body's personal electric currents. You don't believe it? Good. You don't have to. Is it part of your belief system/ philosophy/ training? No? Good, then don't let it bother you. I am giving advice to the original reader because s/he (1) asked for advice and (2) I have had training in it.

Some things are believed in before they are proven, e.g. religions, evolution (theory), gravity (theory), etc. Just because you cannot measure it, feel it, or prove it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Adding a name to it (even silly names) doesn't make it real or unreal.

And, by the way, if I go off the deep end... toss me a line, will you?

 

JUST ANSWER HIS ****ING QUESTION! Damn, he just wants an answer not a giant arguement over whether chi is real or not!


Jessy, have you tried acupuncture, yoga, or meditation?

 

And there was me thinking this was a discussion forum when all along it's just Q & A

 

Sorry, I should calm down....


It is a discussion forum, but I think he is wanting to know ways to raise Chi, there are about 7 different threads with arguements on this and they are all nearly identical.

 

Here is a good post in another "chi" thread by Kwan Jang.

That changed my whole outlook on it.

 

The strange/funny thing with myself & my art we don't use Chi - i just feel people have their methods of focus & concentration......ONE of these could be construde as Chi. There are many other methods similar.

 

Rignt... back to the topic...

Some other things to keep in mind about experiencing a decline in your energy flow are other more basic things such as:

1. Basic diet and health... if you're not eating right you'll have less energy.

2. Mental health... same as above.

3. In a martial arts setting, sometimes I feel a bit weak (or my ki is down) when I've fallen into a rut. Training seems to be the same day after day. I've learned my requirements for the next level and want to do something doifferent but we have to work with people who need more practice, etc. My prescription here is to do something new and original to get some new energy flowing. At our school we do some cross training or sometimes we dig out an old drill that we haven't used in a while... this "new energy" from novelty can sometimes lift the spirit as well.

4. Also, here is a good place to use forms (please don't post anti-forms replies... this is merely a suggestion). While doing the form (established pattern), work on your breathing, muscles and power delivery. This is a good way of rebuilding your techniques and matching them up with your muscles and nerves. I find that working the forms in superslow motion (and/or dynamic tension) helps build up and release Ki quite well. Once you have the hang of this, you can work the patterns in varying speed and power to feel the difference.

5. Practice techniques such as kicks/punches on pads or bags while focusing on power delivery and your "ki-hap" (energy uniting yell). Try working some techniques that you don't normally work... e.g. if you normally use mainly low kicks... practice some head high ones (Before anyone bashes head kicks... this is for building power, novelty, and ki). Use some unusual hand techniques. The combination of novelty, concentration on proper technique, increasing speed, and interest will help rebuild some of that lost ki.

6. Practice footwork drills with careful attention to your breathing. Work the footwork drills as moving techniques with no attacks within them. Focus on the breathing, movement, and flow of energy.

That's just a few ideas to help rebuild your ki. If anyone else has ideas, please share.

 

Good post Thomas.