knuckle conditioning

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by JHughes, May 4, 2007.

  1. Guizzy

    Guizzy with Arnaud and Eustache

    Good to hear.

    It's far too rare to find people actually taking advice after asking for it.
     
  2. Mike Flanagan

    Mike Flanagan Valued Member

    I gave up playing keyboards myself partly because I knew I was asking a lot of my hands - working at a computer all day, then coming home and hitting things and playing the keyboard. It was also admittedly due to a lack of enthusiasm for playing anymore, brought into focus by the realisation of my own musical mediocrity.

    I have a student who drums and I know he sometimes finds it challenging. This is hitting drums with the hand though, I suspect using drumsticks is rather less hard work on the hands.

    When it comes to the bag I think your method of practice should be dictated by your goals. Basically its a question of sport or self-defence? If its sport, then stick with gloves. Its kinder on the hands and you simply don't need skill in striking hard with a naked fist for any sporting competition you're likely to take part in. I don't train for sport at all, so self-defence is my goal. I simply don't see the point in wearing gloves and developing habits that would increase the risk of injury in a real life encounter. But it does fundamentally affect the way you punch. You can't go 'au naturale' and hit a bag in the same way a boxer does. Try it and your wrists will pretty quickly complain. Your knuckles will get pretty scuffed too. You can do many similar techniques but you have to be rather more careful about your placement of the fist on the bag. Personally I find uppercuts the most potentially problematic technique, I'd recommend building up the intensity very gradually.

    But like I said earlier, given that my goal is self-defence, punches are not at the top of my list of striking techniques. I use forearm and elbow strikes at least as much and this is reflected in the priority I give them on the bag.

    In a nutshell, boxing gloves are safer but less realistic than hand wraps, which are safer but less realistic than no protection at all.

    Mike
     
  3. KenpoDavid

    KenpoDavid Working Title

    internal component

    There is also a significant "internal" componenet to Iron Palm technique that really hasn't been addressed. The guy teaching me won't even start with the hitting stuff until I have reached a certain point in my meditation practice. then, he tells me, there is a specific "regimen" I have to follow for 100 days. Miss a day, start over...
     
  4. Yohan

    Yohan In the Spirit of Yohan Supporter

    I've been told that iron palm is more about training the waist then the hand.
     
  5. JHughes

    JHughes New Member

    conditioning for iron palm i would of thought effected the whole arm......

    but i could be wrong.
     
  6. Doublejab

    Doublejab formally Snoop

    Nope, just the fist or palm. You can condition the arms quite a bit as well of course, some old kung fu systems apparently used to condition the forearms to that they could smash aside the enemies blows, both blocking the attack and hopefully breaking the attacking limb.
     
  7. Guizzy

    Guizzy with Arnaud and Eustache

    Hey, my system is not that old.
     
  8. mai tai

    mai tai Valued Member

    sweet
     
  9. Doublejab

    Doublejab formally Snoop

    Cool, you do Crane as well. Has your school got a website? How do you condition your arms?
     
  10. 0thetruth0

    0thetruth0 New Member

    Nice thread

    You people sound like those americans who do karate like it was an aerobics dance to make your parents proud.

    Just watch a real martial artist after proper conditioning training (Buakaw Por Pramuk, K1 champ):
    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gloGY3UDZDo"]BUAKAW BANCHAMEK kick - YouTube[/ame]

    You don't know what K1 is?

    If you are humble enough to learn something, watch this to the end, it's not that long:
    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12fGkBJ2HV"]YouTube[/ame]

    You never heard of Pan Qing Fu? President of the Canadian Wushu Federation? Google some pictures and watch his hand knuckles. Then you'll understand what it took to grow up in one of the poorest cities in china, full of criminality.

    I entice you to explore more of Baukaw's training videos or Karate kyokushin conditioning.

    Best Regards
     
  11. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    Let me see? 7 years since a post? You do much K1?
     
  12. Unreal Combat

    Unreal Combat Valued Member

    I'm trying to figure out what Buakaw kicking a banana tree has to do with conditioning hands. After a quick search on YouTube I found nothing that had anything to do with Buakaw working on hand conditioning.

    What I will say, as both a Muay Thai and K1 rules Kickboxing fighter, is that in the three years I have been training I have never needed to do any form of hand conditioning that I don't get on the heavy bag (our heavy bag is pretty much hard as rock), or the hard rubber bag. Whenever I've worked on either it's always been with gloves on. I would say I've got pretty strong punching power.

    I think it's pretty much unrequired in a sport where you wear hand protection and where your hands become conditioned to impact over time.

    As for whether one would need it for on the street, I think learning where to hit and how to hit would benefit someone much more. I find most hand injuries tend to come from bad targeting or technique than anything else. The chances of getting into an altercation are pretty small unless you go looking for it, and there's more damage to be done with an elbow than a knuckle.

    I think the only sport I could see hand conditioning have any benefit would be bare knuckle boxing or Burmese bare knuckle boxing. It's really not so much required when your hands are wrapped properly and you've got 10oz gloves on though. I think it's pretty unnecessary personally, regardless of any artists training showreel videos (most of which are done purely to raise the profile of a fighter) but each to their own.

    Oh, and I'm not American. ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2014
  13. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    I guess you haven't studied Pan's biography. He did not merely developed his knuckles, but his "technique". But this all said, he did this because of his confinement of his environment and era

    Times have changed, but it seems people romanticizing have not
     
  14. 0thetruth0

    0thetruth0 New Member

    Nevermind the rant, I was mostly replying to the first posts on the first page, just found it insulting the despize people showed for something that's so precious for any effective martial arts like conditioning, in particular that of the hands. When it comes to the rest of the body, I don't know of many who can bring down a tree like that. Van Damme did it in a movie, but...

    Karate Kyokushin is what I practiced for sime years until I had to leave, it was one of the best experiences ever. By nature, I have some insensibility and with the training we did, being hit with sticks, legs, hands, just about everywhere on the body I got to a point (also because I was skinny) that people were nervous to kumite with me because they would hurt themselves on my bones.

    I never did or would ever take part in K1 or that crazy style Cage Fights where everything is permitted, never will even be close to the level of people like Pan Fu.

    But I have the biggest respect for people like him and Buakaw, or just about anybody who does martial arts with the purpose of stregthening his body and mind.

    General body conditioning is of the essence, a lifetime job and very hard.

    All the best to you.
     
  15. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    Nothing to be insulting/offensive about. Conditioning (of this type) is over-rated
     
  16. Dave76

    Dave76 Valued Member

    Welcome to MAP truth. You should know that the posts you are responding to are 7yrs old. I don't think anyone from the first page of this thread are still here.
    You can find the date any message was posted by looking in the upper left hand corner of the post.
    You should post an introduction thread and stick around awhile!
     

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