Did Bruce Lee ever study Ninjutsu?

Discussion in 'Jeet Kune Do' started by Obake, Nov 13, 2015.

  1. Obake

    Obake Valued Member

    Hello again, :)

    I was just wondering. Does anyone know if Bruce Lee ever studied Ninjutsu, either through reading books, watching videos, or training with a partner? I don't recall ever hearing anything about Bruce Lee training in Ninjutsu, but there have been a lot of mythological connections between Bruce Lee and ninja in the past, including tabloids and magazine articles which claim that Bruce Lee was assassinated by a ninja. I know it's bogus and far fetched, but this isn't the only reason I ask. There's other reasons.

    Bruce Lee uses techniques similar to Ninjutsu in a couple of his kung fu movies. In the movie Chinese Connection, there's a scene where he dresses like a shinobi. In the movie Enter The Dragon, he portrays a sort of ninja spy who is working for the CIA, so there's other reasons why I ask.

    Even in some of his Jeet Kune Do writings and teachings, Bruce Lee seems to use concepts that are similar to Ninjutsu in many ways. So I was just curious as to whether or not Bruce Lee ever studied Ninjutsu? If so, where did he learn Ninjutsu and who did he train with? If not, then how does he seem to know so much about Ninjutsu and incorporate those things into Jeet Kune Do?



    ~Obake~
     
  2. SWC Sifu Ben

    SWC Sifu Ben I am the law

    Gonna beat Hannibal to this one...............no
     
  3. Obake

    Obake Valued Member

    If not, then how does he seem to know so much about Ninjutsu and incorporate those things into Jeet Kune Do? A good example just to name one off the top of my head would be something like "the art of winning without fighting" and things like that, which you've seen him quote in some of his writings and movies. Bruce Lee seems to have an understanding of certain concepts in Ninjutsu, it would seem. Also again, he did portray a sort of Chinese ninja in some of his movies. What is the base of this knowledge?
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2015
  4. Ben Gash CLF

    Ben Gash CLF Valued Member

    Hatsumi started teaching in 1972, less than a year before Bruce Lee's death, so no.
    He didn't
    A) the bulk of combative material taught in the Bujinkan by definition isn't ninjustsu
    B) commonality of techniques between systems is hardly unusual.
    The classic "ninja outfit" is a convention from Japanese theatre (anyone dressed all in black is supposed to be invisible, so a character struck down by an unseen assassin is shown killed by a figure all in black) and does not represent ninja attire.
     
  5. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    What specific elements of Ninjitsu do you feel he incorporated into Jeet Kune Do besides stuff from movies?

    My impression from your posts so far is that you base too much about real martial arts from Martial arts movies - also known as "Movie Fu." My suggestion is that if you want more reality based MA's to influence your work, stop relying on Movie Fu. :)
     
  6. Bozza Bostik

    Bozza Bostik Antichrist on Button Moon

    Bruce Lee died in '73. The film Enter the Ninja was released in 1981...so, no.
     
  7. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    My eye is starting to twitch at these posts....
     
  8. Obake

    Obake Valued Member

    Well again, not just from the tabloids or from his movies, but also from his writings too. It could have been, as Ben Gash CLF said, the commonality of techniques between systems. But that in itself strikes curiosity about Bruce Lee, who himself wrote a lot about the roots of different branches.
     
  9. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Tao Te Ching
    Art of War
    Plethora of other books

    Bruce never studied ninjutsu ever.

    End thread
     
  10. Mangosteen

    Mangosteen Hold strong not

    some even argue that nobody has ever studied ninjutsu
     
  11. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Ben Gash CLF is right, but I would like you to please be specific in what you are referencing here. It also means that he studied other arts and any connection you see is merely due to that and not that he studied Ninjitsu. Again, please specifically tell us what writings and how they specifically reference Ninjitsu teachings.

    Did Bruce Lee himself write about studying Ninjitsu, did he cite Ninjitsu in his writings at all? He didn't, did he? He mentions all sorts of other styles, yet not that one. Shouldn't that be enough to answer your question?
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2015
  12. SWC Sifu Ben

    SWC Sifu Ben I am the law

    That's just the propaganda of the actual people who practice ninjitsu.
     
  13. Obake

    Obake Valued Member

    I suppose you're right. Thanks for your help. :)
     
  14. Obake

    Obake Valued Member

    Hello Aaradia, :)

    First off, I'd like to apologize because I didn't bring my notes with me today, so I don't really have the stuff I need off-hand to provide you with specifics. To the best of my knowledge, Bruce Lee never wrote the word "Ninjutsu" in any of his writings, nor did he ever mention "Ninjutsu" or teach "Ninjutsu" to any of his students. I get that much, so I'm not arguing with it. He did mention all sorts of other styles like you said, but never "Ninjutsu" specifically, so I will admit that it should seem fairly obvious.

    However, I am not very knowledgeable about Bruce Lee or Jeet Kune Do, or with Ninjutsu either, so everything I know is purely based on what I have seen or read in books or movies. If something looks similar to something else, I will try to connect the two together or find a common link. As I mentioned before, Bruce Lee does seem to demonstrate very ninja-like skills in his movies, and he says some very ninja-like things in his writings. Again, I have already mentioned one example of "the art of winning without fighting," which is a concept found in both Jeet Kune Do and Ninjutsu.

    Off the top of my head, I can think of another example of something that Bruce Lee said which was very ninja-like. Bruce Lee was always talking about "the style of no style" and "the formless form," and in Ninjutsu they have what is called "no art, no name" which is very similar to Bruce Lee's philosophy, at least in how it sounds. Also, the very meaning of Ninjutsu is "perseverance," which is something Bruce Lee thought was very important for a martial artist to obtain. Again, in the movie Enter The Dragon there is a scene in which Bruce Lee uses something similar to Ninjutsu's shadow method of infiltration. In the movie Chinese Connection, he uses a disguise similar to one of the five traditional disguises used in ancient Ninjutsu during the Sengoku period. So there are actually many specific examples. This is just to list a few off the top of my head, but I'm sure there are others.

    Now is it pure coincidence? Maybe it is. Or again like Ben Gash CLF said, perhaps it is just the commonality of techniques between systems. But what systems are we referring to, if not Ninjutsu? I really don't know. I'm not really an expert on martial arts. But if he didn't learn these things from Ninjutsu, then where did he learn them from?
     
  15. Botta Dritta

    Botta Dritta Valued Member

    There is no ninjustu in Bruce Lee writings. No connection.

    Much of the his philosophical underpinnings come from Taoism, krishnamurti and Spinoza.

    Ninjutsu philosophical underpinnings, at least in the 20th century seem to come from Yamabushi mountain ascetics, Buddhism (I might be wrong on this one though) and historical chinese military classics such as Sun Tzu and 36 strategies.

    The scene in enter the dragon where he infiltrates the compound dressed in black and sneaking around? well yes it does look ninjaesque, but so what? Many 1960's spy and heist caper movies were doing the exact same thing, perhaps influenced by james bond movies as much as early ninjutsu movies. People forget that Bruce lee was as much interested in cinematic directing as much as martial arts. He just used a well worn trope that was already well established in popular culture. He could have been influenced by the Italian comic book Diabolik with its black clad assassin for as much as we know.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2015
  16. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    no he didnt

    Clear now?
     
    chatter box likes this.
  17. Obake

    Obake Valued Member

    Actually, it sounds like you know a lot. I was not aware of the 36 strategies. I'll have to look it up. Also, what is the difference between Yamabushi religion and Buddhist religion? I have heard of Shugendo and Onmyodo, but I don't know much about either of them, or how they relate to Ninja religion. I also had never heard of Diabolik, but I will definitely look into it. Thank you so much for all of your help.

    Always smiling, :)



    ~Obake~
     
  18. 47MartialMan

    47MartialMan Valued Member

    Bruce Lee didn't study Ninjutsu, but Chuck Norris did and wiped them out by the dozens
     
  19. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    I feel that the question about the Chinese being aware of Ninjutsu was reaching, but this seems like trolling.

    Perhaps to save forum space and spamming the front page any questions regarding ninjutsu and those who may or may not have practiced it, you might consider making ONE thread rather than the several asking "did this group know about ninjutsu?" or "did that group know about ninjutsu?". It's spaming the front page and it is rather annoying searching through all the other threads to answer your almost identical questions.
     
  20. Obake

    Obake Valued Member

    I'm sorry Chadderz, thank you for that advice. I was not aware that my threads were spamming the front page. I will try to limit my posts. I have one last question for the Jeet Kune Do thread, before I end it.

    Can you have a Jeet Kune Do (JKD) approach to Ninjutsu training? I was told that Jeet Kune Do is a fighting method that doesn't just blend different styles together, but actually uses a scientific approach to examine different styles' strengths and weaknesses and looking for specific personalized techniques that work fluidly together for the individual. If that's true, then can a JKD practitioner train in Ninpo, or vice-versa, and combine those two traditions to create a new style? Thank you so much again for your help.
     

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