Has anyone tried to make a comprehensive "Family Tree" of all the various forms that are grounded in Kuk Sool, or closely related to it? I mean things like Tae Kuk Mu Sool, Han Kuk Mu Do and Sankoesi. There were a few before the Great Franchise Schism, but based on poking around the interwebs it seems there are quite a few more these days.
What is the general point of this thread? All we seem to talk about is the offshoots or the rogue schools of KSW! Does it really matter! We should be talking and concentrating on KSW. Meaning less chat
Cause the style is Kuk Sool, and it now there is much more to Kuk Sool than just the Won. I'm not trying to stir up a "which one is right" debate, or anything of that nature, I'm just curious as to if anyone had collected a list or something along those lines for all the Kuk Sool offshoots that currently are out there and what names they are under.
I wonder if the group in this thread (http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125958) would count...
Again though, what's the point in building a list! What will you actually achieve? I'm pretty sure many of the others 'kuk sool' out there will have no interest in building lists. Just concentrate on our martial art. This forum seems to be getting filled with more and more irrelevant other 'kuk sool' stuff! Can we not just focus on WKSA
Some people like to see how an art grows. Just like family trees in genealogy, some people like to see the history and genealogy of their style. I look at stuff like that in my arts - particularly CLF. And oh yes, I still have plenty of time to concentrate on practicing my style. So I think implying that someone interested in the history, lineage, and growth of their style (and it's offshoots) can't also be concentrating on said art is a ridiculous statement.
MAP is a discussion forum, people are welcome to discuss whatever they want (obviously within reason). If you don't like a topic, you are welcome to stay away from it. If you wish to discuss other aspects of your style, you are welcome to start threads about it.
You seriously can't see the benefits from examining how your system has been propagated or how it relates to other arts with similar influences?
I generally feel there is more discussion about 'other kuk sool' than actual kuk sool won. I do see the point but also feel it's a waste of time. Before I'm kicked out ill quietly leave this thread as I see nothing will be gained by this
...this is coming from the man that was looking for mu sool won gear and uniforms from back in the best days of ksw before the old masters split...
Again, with the utmost respect, I get where you're coming from, but you are making a fundamental mistake. The forum here is for "Kuk Sool". There are many org's teaching Kuk Sool these days, the Kuk Sool Won is just one of them. Sure, it's the biggest, but it's not the only one, not by a long shot. And just as, as a current TKD guy, I like to talk TKD with ITF, WTF, ATA and whomever else I can come across, we should not plug our ears and refuse to listen to discussions on form, technique, or history with someone just because they come to Kuk Sool from a "non-Won" place. It's still Kuk Sool.
Yes, I was looking for Mu Sool Won uniforms and old Kuk Sool Won uniforms as I'm a collector of the rare Kuk Sool stuff, and believe me it's a nightmare finding older stuff. And you know how many ppl tried to help on that thread, no one! I see everyone points at looking at the other interpretations of Kuk Sool I just don't see the point in building a family tree. I genuinly can't see any member of Mu Sool Won, NKMAA, Kuk Sool Hapkido etc etc building lists. I just seems a pointless exercise.
Maybe they value their older stuff too. My seonbae (and original instructor) still has his general's uniform tucked away. Definitely would never relinquish it. Similarly, I personally feel that a certain level of attachment exists in these masters that left kuksulwon. These gentleman (and one lady I met...but not master level) left after DECADES of time training and demoing/seminaring across the world. That curriculum is just to close to them I guess. They are proponents of their own styles of that curriculum now, so getting them to help with a tree is futile unless it is serving the benefit of their group. Best bet is to find their students that left with them.
As someone who loves the Hapkido sub-forum, I feel your pain. On one hand, it's nice to see vibrant respectful conversations going on and taking part in them. On the other hand, when the political in-fighting begins, it's no treat. In this case, the best advice I can give is (1) try to start appropriate conversations that will develop into positive discussions about KSW, (2) try to lure other KSWers into doing the same, and/or (3) jump into some non-KSW discussions with the intent to share, build, and create better relationships Good luck
Ok so. We agree Kuk Sool Won is the biggest and the association that started it all. Then we would have Mu Sool Won, Kuk Sool Hapkidp, NKMAA, World Kido (?), then the various UK off shoots like Master John Watson school of Korean martial arts, John Wards school of martial arts. Not many there I know but in the 5 min this has taken I have started a list. My point being, I now just have a list which is of no value to me. You could spend months and years trying to compile a list, if you ever found all the offshoots.
Something I always wondered was the origin of kuksool in the united kingdom and ireland. Was it mok yang kim or a few others as well? This seems like some pretty interesting stuff, but he has passed on
Have you looked at these old threads? http://www.martialartsplanet.net/forums/showthread.php?t=70554 http://www.martialartsplanet.net/forums/showthread.php?t=85691