what difference is wtf,itf and ata?

[southern jester]

have looked over several tkd threads not seen this question. what differences are there between itf,wtf and ata tkd? took tkd classes years ago think it was wtf. it was like 25 years ago cant be expected to remember everything.

[Ragnarok2005]

In summary [So is not applicable to every school, instructor and student on Earth] -

- ATA - Money grabbing belt factory ***** you should avoid.

- ITF - Patterns and Breaking.

- WTF - Sport Taekwon-Do. Sparring and emphasis on kicking.

[neryo_tkd]

i don't agree with what you said about WTF because WTF is not only about that. i thought you learnt it by now.

[TKDMitch]

Originally Posted by southern jester

have looked over several tkd threads not seen this question. what differences are there between itf,wtf and ata tkd? took tkd classes years ago think it was wtf. it was like 25 years ago cant be expected to remember everything.

Can't speak for ata as I've no experience of them, but essentially

ITF do patterns from the Ch'ang Hon set (Chon Ji, Dang Gun etc). They spar semi-contact with hand/foot/head guards and allow punches to the head.

WTF do Poomse, diferent patterns. They spar full contact but do not allow punches to the head (Olympic sparring).

Mitch

[southern jester]

possibility that ata (american taekwondo) would not be familiar to anyone not living here in states?

reason subject got brought up. have a neice that has practiced wtf style for several years. think about ten or so. anyway missy changed schools recently because her former one placed so much emphasis on competition. now she is enrolled in a itf school. they do not pressure students to participate in any tournaments. (not saying all wtf schools do btw).

her older brother mike has been in both wtf taekwondo and shotokan. since i have never seen itf taekwondo before asked him what style looked like. he said the forms looked far more like shotokan and maybe almost same. does that sound even close to right?

[estranged13]

i lived in Nebraska for 2 years, its ATA central, not a good program unless you want to be a school owner, then they set you up in a francise like mcdonalds.

[Ragnarok2005]

Originally Posted by neryo_tkd

i don't agree with what you said about WTF because WTF is not only about that. i thought you learnt it by now.

I've heard it said a lot of times. I havent learned any different.

[Ragnarok2005]

Originally Posted by southern jester

possibility that ata (american taekwondo) would not be familiar to anyone not living here in states?

reason subject got brought up. have a neice that has practiced wtf style for several years. think about ten or so. anyway missy changed schools recently because her former one placed so much emphasis on competition. now she is enrolled in a itf school. they do not pressure students to participate in any tournaments. (not saying all wtf schools do btw).

her older brother mike has been in both wtf taekwondo and shotokan. since i have never seen itf taekwondo before asked him what style looked like. he said the forms looked far more like shotokan and maybe almost same. does that sound even close to right?

ATA is only in the States yes. But they were the guys who pioneered what we now affectionaly call McDojos. All about cash and numbers. Avoid at all costs.

ITF forms are the same as Shotokan yes. Except we change a few things and mangle the order a bit and then throw in some really stupid stuff just to make it look more interesting.

[TKDMitch]

Originally Posted by southern jester

...her older brother mike has been in both wtf taekwondo and shotokan. since i have never seen itf taekwondo before asked him what style looked like. he said the forms looked far more like shotokan and maybe almost same. does that sound even close to right?

Sounds exactly right. ITF TKD forms are very close to Shotokan kata.

Mitch

[neryo_tkd]

Originally Posted by Ragnarok2005

I've heard it said a lot of times. I havent learned any different.

meaning in your school, but don't keep saying that it is so in the rest of the world.

[aaron_mag]

You're getting pretty good info in this thread. Shotokan and ITF are pretty similar. When I was in college I used to work out with a Shotokan blackbelt from Europe. I'll never forget the first time we worked out together...we were like, "Our styles and techniques are almost the same..." Didn't learn the background behind it until later.

ATA - Rags pretty much nailed it. They seem to be behind the new chain of schools that call themselves, "Karate for Kids".

[TheMadhoose]

ITF anti anything not ITF " thats not true tkd" typical rant from ITF guys
WTF 2000 year old style
ATA have cash can go far What on earth is an eternal grandmaster????
its hard to get no bull tkd trianing all orgs come with propeganda and claims of supremacy and warn of the other dark side orgs.
Been part of TAGB GTI ITU ITF same internal bickering diferent badge

[Counter]

Originally Posted by Ragnarok2005

I've heard it said a lot of times. I havent learned any different.

What neryo said. There are people here with way more experience in WTF taekwondo than you, so leave it to them to make conclusions about it. "Different-organization-bashing" is so easy, just say the things you know and nothing beyond that.

[Ragnarok2005]

Originally Posted by neryo_tkd

meaning in your school, but don't keep saying that it is so in the rest of the world.

No. Heard it from YOU and several others. All about what you do. And seen WTF schools and was very very impressed by their kicking, which I copy.

Was very much unimpressed with the patterns, the self-defence and the general understanding of Martial Arts and self defence.

[Thomas]

Originally Posted by southern jester

have looked over several tkd threads not seen this question. what differences are there between itf,wtf and ata tkd? took tkd classes years ago think it was wtf. it was like 25 years ago cant be expected to remember everything.

My personal opinion;

1. WTF - this is the style I am affiliated with and through which I hold rank. I've trained in the style in Korea and in the US in a few different schools. They use the Taeguek forms and a set of Black Belt forms... all of which tend to be fairly straight forward, simple in nature, generally symmetrical, and relatively short.

Generally I've found the WTF schools to focus on sparring drills and sparring (along with some step sparring, a bit of self defence, and patterns). Usually a good WTF school will produce pretty good strikers in a stand-up game and usually will have lots of access to tournaments and full contact (with limited targets) sparring.

For our own school, we supplement the self defence side with (Combat) Hapkido and do a lot of open sparring to allow for other targets and ranges. Individual schools will vary. Our school does both WTF and Chang Hon (ITF) patterns

2. ITF - we've had a few ITF black belts train with us over the years, some for extended time. ITF uses the Chang Hon forms (so does our school) which I find in general to be a bit more complex, longer, and not as symmetrical as the Taegeuk forms. As a student of the art, I find these patterns more interesting than the WTF forms.

In general, from the ITF black belts I've worked with, they seem to be a bit more focused on patterns, step sparring/self defence, and items other than sparring. The sparring tends to be more open, especially with punches to the thead, but I haven't found the level of contact to be very high usually. ITF has a biggger inherrant self defence program but I'm not sure how effective much of it is. (The founder) General Choi's Encyclopedia is a facinating read but much of the material, especially in the self defence side, wasn't that impressive to me personally

3. ATA - we've had a few ATA black belts with us for an extended time. In general, they had a very strong back ground in the basics and excelled in sparring (good hands and feet). They seemd to have come through a very good program focused on basics. They do the Song Ahm forms which tend to be much longer, complex, and more assymetrical than the ITF or WTF ones.

I've heard criticism over the ATA for excessive fees, mandated courses/extra fees, and a tendancy to not allow for any variation or exploration. However, my experience with ATA black belts has been very good.


In conclusion, I really wouldn't worry about the "name' of the federation. Go and check out local schools, tell them what you are looking for and see how they answer. Try out a few classes and join the group that fits you best.