The 9 schools of Ninjutsu?

Discussion in 'Ninjutsu' started by Bozza Bostik, Nov 20, 2012.

  1. Bozza Bostik

    Bozza Bostik Antichrist on Button Moon

    Ok Ninjas....come out of hiding and help me with this basic question. :)

    Ninjutsu has the 9 ryu...I get that...but quite simply, how are they taught? Is it like a progression thing and you learn one/some and then move on to the next? A bit like progressing through kata. Are some ryu more advanced than others?

    Or do they teach bits from each all at the same time?

    Or are individual techniques made up from the various ryu?

    Hope that makes sense...I'm really just curious to know.

    Thanks!
     
  2. hatsie

    hatsie Active Member Supporter

    I think it depends which org. Your In and your relationship with a teacher qualified to instruct the ryuha
     
  3. Sylvain

    Sylvain Valued Member

    Well, people more knowledgeable will correct me, but I would start by saying that only 3 of the schools cover ninjutsu. Then for the learning process, what is mostly taught is the bujinkan ninpo taijutsu, a mix of the 9 ryu. Now, some teachers do teach some of the school elements, but the only way to learn it thoroughly( I believe), is to learn from the japanese shihan, or a select few students they taught it to.

    Edit : talking for the bujinkan of course
     
  4. gapjumper

    gapjumper Intentionally left blank

    IMO (but hey, what do I know?):

    In general (in the Bujinkan) the 9 schools are not really the "subject" of Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu. They are the influences, maybe even foundation(?). Kata from them are used to demonstrate, teach, reinforce ideas and principles. However this does vary. Some groups use more or less kata than others. Even when kata are used extensively it is not usually in a ryu-ha progression. Kata are very useful for spotting flaws in your technique. if your priciples are wrong (distance, balance, posture etc etc) then the kata will not flow or work and feel awkward. Get these things right and kata "come alive". (I'm waffling now)

    It's a difficult thing to try to explain, and reading my post so far, I'm not even sure I agree with it! People sometimes think too much about this and get lost. (Kinda like I'm doing writing this :eek:).

    In Japan, with a good relationship to a senior teacher, you can get more thorough ryu-ha training. Sometimes in a structured progression. Sometimes not in the original order.



    I hope I've made sense. People will disagree with this, but then again so do I! It's my best attempt at this time in the morning before I've had my latte.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  5. Bozza Bostik

    Bozza Bostik Antichrist on Button Moon

  6. gapjumper

    gapjumper Intentionally left blank

    That site is not bujinkan, but an offshoot who strangely decided to keep the name.

    Although some of the history stuff is reasonable, the figting methods of this group bears pretty much zero resemblence to Bujinkan, Genbukan, or Jinenkan. Instead being a mix of Brian-jutsu (mish mash of lots of arts except taijutsu) and reliance on strength and force.

    And if that doesn't bring the BBD lurkers out of hiding, nothing will!
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  7. kouryuu

    kouryuu Kouryuu

    Even their grading certificates are still titled Bujinkan but as gap says, they are NOTHING to do with Bujinkan and haven't been since 1991
     
  8. gapjumper

    gapjumper Intentionally left blank

    I'm pretty sure there couldn't be any, say, knife fighting vids on youtube from them...:hat:
     
  9. Sylvain

    Sylvain Valued Member

    If I'm not mistaking:
    Togakure ryu
    Kumogakure ryu
    Gyokushin ryu

    Erf just though the link, the title is wrong, those are the nine school for which Hatsumiu owns Sokeship, not all are ninjutsu.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2012
  10. Pankeeki

    Pankeeki Valued Member

    While 3 ryuha have ninpo or ninjutsu in their name. The other schools coming from the Toda familie also have ninpo or ninjutsu elements.
    For instance Koto Ryu and Gyokko Ryu are seen as the foundation for Togakure Ryu and also sometimes called ninpo. Same goes for Gikan Ryu.
    The ryuha from the Toda familie are in my opinion all Ninpo related. The ryuha have been in the Toda family for more then 6 generations.
     
  11. kouryuu

    kouryuu Kouryuu

    Hee hee
     
  12. skuggvarg

    skuggvarg Valued Member

    Agree with Pankeeki,

    Just wanted to add that Takamatsu may also have learned ninjutsu from other ryu ha than those from the Toda family most notably the Gikan Ryu and Kukishinden Ryu. The only ryu-ha that seems to not have had any connection (as far as we know) to ninjutsu would be Takagi Yoshin Ryu from the Mizuta line.

    Regards / Skuggvarg
     
  13. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    I don't see how Kukishin ryu is ninjutsu but maybe that's just me.

    Gyokko/Koto Ryu are supposed to be the fighting arts the ninja used but that is a bit difficult to pin down. Which ninja, in which area during what periods? Looking at the lineage leads one to draw some conclusions but that is not hard proof. For the majority, the only art that contains ninjutsu that they will be exposed to is Togakure Ryu, with the aforementioned two ryuha.
     
  14. Pankeeki

    Pankeeki Valued Member

    Takamatsu sensei saw Kukishin Ryu also as ninjutsu or as having a ninjutsu component.
    There are letters about that written to the Kuki family by Takamatsu sensei.
    Hatsumi sensei has copies of the letters. Its part of a bigger story but I don't know too much about it.
     
  15. Please reality

    Please reality Back to basics

    I've heard that too. Have you seen the letters?
     
  16. garth

    garth Valued Member

    At one point Takamatsu was going to call it Kukishin Ryu Ninpo IIRC according to Amatsu Magazine, and at least one scroll of the Kukishin/Kukishinden has Ninpo techniques.
     
  17. skuggvarg

    skuggvarg Valued Member

    Takamatsu sensei had a lot of things going on obviously. There has been lots of talk regarding the alleged letter to general Kuki regarding his proposal to "up date" the kukishin ryu jujutsu by adding striking (totejutsu). Suffice to say its hard to know what the intentions were without in depth knowledge about the on goings of the KukiĀ“s and Takamatsu.

    Regards / Skuggvarg
     
  18. Meitetsu

    Meitetsu Valued Member

    I thought there were 49 Ryu of Ninjutsu?
    [​IMG]
    there is even a map of them!
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2012
  19. Lucretia

    Lucretia Valued Member

    Brian-Jutsu... :D nice...but, surely it's Brianjitsu?

    Luke.
     
  20. Lucretia

    Lucretia Valued Member

    Not seen that map before, shame I cannee read it :D
     

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