Looking for Custom Tambo

Correct as I am the mod round here. This is a weapons forum and as such I encourge the wholesale slaughter of charlatans for one good reason. Weapons training is extremely dangerous and it should NOT be given the same tolerance as empty hand fakes. Therefore anything you post under the weapons sub-forum will be under far more scrutiny than other sub-forums.

The Bear.

 

ARRROOOOGGGAAAA ... Fraud ALERT, Fraud ALERT!!!!

Bingo, the magic words have been spoken and thus Pat O'Malley's comments have all just been justified.
Sorry mate you've just been had!!!!

I especially like the children's parties and can guess who the clown will be.

The Bear.

 

Except the Koryu forum... try jumping in there with a created art and see what happens! Fun for the whole family....

 

You seem to be more worked up about this than I am.

Seeing as how you're not a mod, why bother telling me any of this? Take a page out of your own book and let staff do their jobs.

I don't recall pointing out a problem with your posts in particular. I have found your posts overly-reactive, but not really rude. I've been very clear and direct in what I have a problem with and what I don't. I suggest going over my posts again in detail if you're that concerned about it.

Fascinating. I plan on picking up sword training at some point in the future, so know I am paying attention here.

I've met him a few times. He really is an exceedingly nice guy.

I replied to your earlier post. Did you have any feedback on my reply?

Thank you. That actually helps me understand the reaction better. I don't normally post in the weapon forum.

Keep reading...I spoke incorrectly and said as much.

ETA:
As for Soshi Jason, he's an open guy and is willing to answer questions/concerns. As I said, he's on Facebook. Hit him up. Airing stuff here does no good. Speak to the man himself.

 

I'm telling you because you keep gibbering on about the ToS and trying to use it to control the debate, you might want to note that those comments of mine were in response to yours asking me if I'd read what you'd said about the ToS.

Now I'll say one last time if you have a problem in that regard then report the post, rather than trying to detract from the issues at hand.

Good luck in your training and I mean that with the utmost sincerity because you'll need it from the looks of it.

 

No thanks. My time is taken up enough with the delusionals in the forum.

The Bear.

 

Control the debate?
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

I am not an arrogant person. I seek to control nothing. I simply think it's reasonable to expect members, and mods, to abide by the TOS on some level.

Debate does not include insults, degrading remarks or childish comments meant to make light of the subject or the participants. What has happened here for a large part is not debate and is even a poor excuse for discussion.

There have been members in this thread that have conducted themselves with honor and still maintained their positions. I challenge the rest of you to emulate these members if at all possible. To not do this muddies any hope of legitimate discussion.

I have not reported posts in this thread (at this point I'm thinking maybe I should have...I dunno) in an effort to keep things going without tattling.

As for gibbering, how are you not gibbering? You are keeping this thing alive at least as much as I am. If you want it to stop, then stop replying. Simple. I don't ask you to, but if you are serious about not contributing to the ruckus, you will.

I am a former reporter and an IT person. It is ingrained in me to be accurate and to solve problems. I have been confronted with a good bit of inaccuracy (in how my posts have been interpreted) and problems as well. Problems mainly in communication...NOT information shared. As long as people continue to insist on being inaccurate and communicating badly, I will keep replying. And I will do my best to keep things civil. And light hearted God willing...

 

Just saying, if your remarks were serious I think you'd want to actually follow up. It would only take a few keystrokes really. Otherwise it just looks like driveby posting.

 

All I will say is teaching weapons to someone is a serious business and should never be taken lightly. Teaching weapons to the general public when you have no idea what you are doing is dam right foolish and dangerous.

Monkeywrench if you think CN weapons are the real deal. Promise me this. Never and I mean never try to use what they teach you because it will get you killed for the people teaching have not got a scooby dos idea of what they are doing.

They are complete and utter rubbish. Dangerous and taking you for a ride.

Ask them to pit their skills up against real weapons practioners. Bet they will use some lame excuse not to participate. But if the do I will give you odds on they will have heir asses handed to them on a plate.

I say again being taught weapons by people who don't know what their doing is dam right dangerous to you and all those who learn this rubbish from them.

And they have lied to you convinced you they are why they are not. Sounds like a martial version of the moonies. At least the McDojo's have half an inkling of what they are doing and know where each bit comes from. At least their up front about their scams.

 

Yeah but you don't know the sheer quantity of these types out there. It would be a full time job. It's not just your charlatans out there believe me. There are thousands of people getting ripped off. We have a looooooooong history of it here. You're just the latest unfortunate to stumble by thinking they are getting gold when they are getting turds.
Martial arts ain't religion and it ain't opinion, every art has to follow the same basic principles and when they don't, it shows up like neon to those who do understand them. I am sorry you believe otherwise and I hope you never have to rely on what you have been taught.

The Bear.

 

Painting a turf with gold nail varnish and polishing it means all you got is a polished turd

 

Well, I don't carry my (brand new!) tambos with me when I go out, so no chance I will use my "techniques" in the wild. Don't worry!


I heard back from my guy that I mentioned before. I only met him a few months ago, so I dunno what his background is really. Just that he spent some time in asia and trained quite a bit and has spent time training military back in the states in recent years. Here's his reply and yes I linked him to the thread:

I can invite him here to comment if you guys want. I don't think he'd have a problem coming here. Heck, he may already have an account.

Cheers and for what it's worth, I'll try to make allowances for the boorish behavior you guys prefer. I'm like that in "real life" myself. I'm always the clown wherever I go...especially in the dojo. I will warn you tho dear reader, you may not like the monster that becomes unleashed!
:evil:

 

This is a public forum, people don't need an invite to respond. If he wants to he can.

Yeah sure. Dream on.

The Bear.

 

Aha. One of my freinds who knows everyfink will come and tell you. I couldn't care less if you told me the six million dollar man said so. I don't believe you. You have shown us time and time again that you can't answer direct questions and when you do you come out with so much crap even the trash can rejects your spew.

If this guy had half an ounce of sense he would tell you to take up martial arts. If he thinks what you do is the real then the god help the poor man.

How many times is it now that you've whimpered that your not replying your going and taking your ball with you. 3, 4, 5?

You know what. Your a troll. Granted a sneaky one but a troll you are. Why well you have already shown you already knew the answer to the original question and since then all you have done is put up the worst martial arts (and I use that tem lightly) videos we could ever wish to see.

And now you supplying us with unknown expert witnesses?

Troll plain and simple. Bring your experts one I don't care I will call him a liar too.

 

Then I'll see if I can illustrate a little more for you. While there isn't any footage of Jason and Yamagata Ryu that I can find (unless you know of some?), I can use a similar situation as an illustration. I'm doing this while begging the forgiveness of member of another forum, who recently posted a clip of himself from a number of years ago:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Z2q9hQHRGg"]Milt Guinette IAIDO - YouTube[/ame]

The resultant thread is here: http://www.martialtalk.com/forum/showthread.php?98759-An-Afternoon-of-Sword..., including my critique of the video itself. Take a moment or two to read through it.

Now, I'm not saying that these issues are necessarily present in the teachings of Jason Backlund, however after reading some of Jason's forum postings, I wouldn't be looking for real sword training as understood in the JSA. For sword training, lineage is very important, otherwise who knows what you'll get?

Ah, but that's really irrelevant. Nice doesn't mean anything to do with martial validity, legitimacy, or ability. I, for instance, am not nice. I'm generous, I care about my students and training partners, always strive to give them my best, but I'm not nice. There are a range of reasons for this, but one of the chief ones (from an instructors, or martial artists point of view) is that it gets in the way and is counter-productive. I don't need to be liked... then again, I follow Machiavelli's take on a lot of things....

Not wanting to speak for Paul, I might say that the range of training you mention isn't too broad, really. I've already mentioned my thoughts on Mr Cates (the connection to Ronald Duncan, amongst other things), and the occasional seminar on a topic or two, combined with only a couple months of Judo won't necessarily school you to tell good from bad. Add to that that the instructor can easily "fudge" the line between a good instructor (charismatic, good communicator) with a bad art, and a bad instructor with a good art quite easily. I've seen plenty of "bad art" instructors who talk such a good game that they can convince a lot of people. Again, that is a general statement covering a range of systems out there, such as the one I mentioned a post or two back....

Firstly, airing things here can do good, as this is more likely to be picked up in a websearch, rather than a facebook page of the instructor himself. Next, honestly there isn't any need to hit him up for anything. As Bear said, if we did that for everyone that came along, we'd never get any time for anything else...

To be frank, he's absolutely correct: he doesn't know what the issue is. It's not semantics over the term Hubud.

Hubud is not a sweeping action, it is a specific continuous training drill developed and employed (and found only) in the FMA systems. It is an argument of technique, as much as of terminology. Not calling it Hubud when training it doesn't change what the drill is, nor where it is taken from. In fact, calling it Hubud is fine, labelling it as Wing Chun isn't. That was the point that Pat was making, really (as it showed a lack of understanding of the systems that Cuong Nhu draws from, which itself was another red flag about the art). So your friends argument is rather invalid, and misses the point. As I said earlier, the concept of "nothing new in martial arts" doesn't apply in this instance.

The second paragraph (principles), frankly, misses the point again. There's a fairly vague reference to "replicas of techniques (in Chinese martial arts)", but I can't think of many actual examples myself. And I have no idea what he means by "Taoist systems"... probably things like Xing'i, Bagua etc, but if he does, his definition is a little out.

And, finally, the last paragraph (double weapons)... frankly, it has nothing to do with anything whatsoever. He seems to be arguing that double weapons usage is perfectly valid, as he was taught a form of double weapon use, which is not the argument at all. We accept the legitimacy of double weapon use, a number of posters in this thread specialise in such. I, along with at least two other posters in this thread, train in a system famous for it's founders use of two weapons at once... although if used in a way even vaguely reminicent of the clips seen, the system would never have started, as the founder would have died with a confused look on his face.

So whether or not he was taught Bat Charn Dao as double weapons means nothing when it comes to the Cuong Nhu usage of double stick, really. And, I'll state for the record, that if you used Butterfly Knives the way that the sticks are used in the CN clips in a Chinese school (Wing Chun, as that's where they're found...), you'd have them taken off you.

 

By Jeyzus, you have that right!

 

Ha, it does get fun when that happens, huh Steve?

One thing I wanted to add in regard to the answers that Monkeywrench has been getting from his instructors, is that the authority of position can allow many suspect things to get accepted by students, whether they had any validity or credence at all. For example, a number of years ago, Stephen Hayes and Hatsumi Sensei were talking about all the "instant ninja masters" that turned up in the US after Hayes started on the promotion trail... so they thought about the possibility of coming up with a new art, called "Iguana Kenpo", with a range of darting movements with their head, and say that it was an old, secret school, using their position as established authorities to give it credence. And, honestly, if they chose something a little more credible, it wouldn't be hard to do.

My point is that you need to look at who is answering, and whether or not their answers pass muster on their own merit, or if it's accepted only because a seeming "authority" is giving it. And when everyone not of the lineage sees the same issues, and the answers given by the "authority" don't get, that may be something to consider.

 

Pat, I say this with all due sincerity:

Go stuff yourself.

 

ok I think this has gone on enough. Unless you have anything more to add then I think we start winding this up.
It's not Pat's, Mine or Chris Parker's fault you've fallen into one of the oldest MA traps out there. So you've been told and it's up to you to decide what if anything you want to do about it.

The Bear.