Pen and Sword

[ladyhawk]

Is the pen mightier then the sword or do they support
and justify each other?

Thoughts anyone?

[LilBunnyRabbit]

Easy answer. Which would you prefer to be hit with?

As a metaphorical thing though its hard to say, I'd say that the sword is probably mightier, as the threat of the sword will overwhelm the pen any time.

[ladyhawk]

I kindda think we use them to justify our actions.

OK, we justify fighting as defending our constitutional rights
but these rights didn't actually become our rights untill they
were put in written words.

Then we go back in time to the 10 commandments and Thou shall not kill.
Written words that are difficult for the logical mind to justify with fighting.

An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth. (not sure if that is the exact wording)
but written words that speak for themselves.

[energyboost]

pen is mightier than the sword cause the pen signs papers that sends swords to war

[LilBunnyRabbit]

But the sword at the throat of the person who signs the papers holds much more power, since the signer is then under their control. And if you take the sword away and merely hold it in sight, you've still got the control. Eventually you can put the sword away and there will still be fear of it.

As for the pen, when its gone that's it.

[Spike]

The weilder of the sword will die eventually he may change the cause he fights sword, the sword can be bought, when words are written they are almost their forever.
The pen decides who gets the money, the sword will need money before striking

[Andy Murray]

The pen writes the orders the sword follows.

The sword may kill the writer.

Yet without the writer the deeds of the swordsman are never recorded, and without the swordsman there is little to write about?

[binski20]

The sword has but one use. The pen has shaped and expressed our thoughts and ideas about almost everything. In a literal sense, of course sword is dangerous, that's common sense. But what about the expression of the pen?? It too can be dangerous to some causes. Charles Darwin's words were expresses through the pen, and continue to battle religion. Words have been written and shared that have started revolutions. The bible continues to be one of the most influential books in history, and although it has instances of use of the sword it is the words that stay s strong. A sword can spread fear, a pen can shape a world.

[ladyhawk]

Words can and are interpretted differently and this sometimes creates conflict........enter the sword.

[TkdWarrior]

hmm i remember in magnificient butcher Sammo hungs master had one fighting scene with pen... :D i guess pen is mighter...
ok seriously enuff...
i think the things i wanted to say hav already said by sooooo venerables here ;) ...i'll keep quite who knows this keyboard can be mighteir too :D
-TkdWarrior-

[ladyhawk]

Speaking of keyoard, now a days many people are very brave hiding behind the keyboard. The sword shows it's true colors
and commits itself to it's cause.

[TkdWarrior]

so that means keyboard is mightier it can even hide u beind itself...
yay...
-TkdWarrior-

[ladyhawk]

Can the pen make a committment without being backed up by the sword?

[TkdWarrior]

Can the pen make a committment without being backed up by the sword?"

it all depends on who is holding it...
politically it cannot make without backing up..
theoritically it can make
practically it depends on person...
it's tough question...
i m just 21 yet...will not even gotta marry in next 4-5 yrs(at least)
then' probably i'll say about who's mighter... ;)
-TkdWarrior-

[Terry Matthes]

I think the pen can have more influence than the sword, because after the war is over it's up to the artist and authors to record history and from a few things my sensai has told me it's not always recorded as it happened. I would also consider the pen the art of diplomacy and nowadays I think the pen is stronger.

[ladyhawk]

TkdWarrior, my young friend,
don't depend on marriage to give you answers to tough questions.

[TkdWarrior]

lol ladyhawk...if u notice i was just tryin to be humorous...it's hard to be that way on net...
i m not depending on marriage anyway :D
if u put me as an example n i put my words(for pen) then i'll stay with my words forever...judging myself...i'll stick with my pen(who'll write words) too...
but we cannot define by personal views...
-TkdWarrior-

[Terry Matthes]

Is the pen and sword a comparison to intelligence and strength? If so I would go for the pen. I would rather outthink my opponent then outmuscle him, altougth for som reason I always try to use brawn over brains when I grapple, I really have to learn to stop that it just gets me tied in more knots then when I started :D

[Dragon_Princess]

I'd rather be hit by the sword than the pen, so I'd say the sword is mightier.

[LilBunnyRabbit]

Sounds fair. If you wanna test that then I'll bring my sword, you bring your pen. :D

[TkdWarrior]

lemme be the judge only fair play :D
-TkdWarrior-

[Dragon_Princess]

No. I have the sword. I think it's mightier.

[LilBunnyRabbit]

No no, I agree with TKD, you hit him with the pen, I'll hit him with the sword, then, if he's still standing, he can tell us which hurts most.

Well, you did want to judge.

[TkdWarrior]

"No no, I agree with TKD, you hit him with the pen, I'll hit him with the sword, then, if he's still standing, he can tell us which hurts most.
Well, you did want to judge."

smart a$$...:woo: :Alien: :eek:
-TkdWarrior-

[Dragon_Princess]

lol...Deal!!!

[wayofthedragon]

I think the saying, the pen is mighter than the sword means that..........hmmm
ok, look at it this way. You can do a lot with the pen, well if you have athourty that is. You can make a decree to have people killed, you can even make a decree to to ban all swords from the area:D Yet with a sword you can cause hurt to someone, however with the pen you can make a law that who ever uses a sword to cause harm to someone must be put to death, so then then pen can be very powerful in that way, but ofcourse only a person in power has such power with the pen. Also, You can do a lot with the pen. You can persuade people through your words, ect.....It's just to much to explain. I think the pen can be just as mighty or even mightier if you know how to use it properly, of course you wouldn't fight someone with a pen if they have a sword physically. That isn't what that means. This saying has great significants

[Cain]

Most here assume a pen is needed to weild the sword, I disagree, a sword is much mightier than the pen [yeah I know I am challenging a politically correct answer ;)]

A pen just writes, signs papers etc, but a sword does it, you can write "cain will not hurt me" and have me sign it, but it won't stop me from using the sword :D

Just some thoughts...

|Cain|

[YODA]

Psssst.... Cain ...... your talking cr4p :D

[Cain]

Tell me about it ;)

Not exactly in my best mood rite now :D

|Cain|

[YODA]

Originally posted by cain_charlie
Tell me about it ;)

Not exactly in my best mood rite now :D

|Cain|

Me and you both buddy :woo:

[LilBunnyRabbit]

Yet with a sword you can cause hurt to someone, however with the pen you can make a law that who ever uses a sword to cause harm to someone must be put to death

How d'you put them to death without a sword?

[Darzeka]

You can strangle them? stone them? hang? use the axe?

As I see it the sword means direct power. The pen control.

I had a slight epiphany realting to this after seeing the matrix.
You can have all the power, swords, guns, ability to become invisible, etc, etc. but if I have a small bomb hardwired into your head that will go off if I die then I have control.

Control is the ability to force someone into a decision by making all other choices less attractive than the one you want them to make.

We usually see this applied through the use of a pen signing orders which is why the pen is the symbol of this control.

This can be related directly to fighting in the normal "David and Goliath" fight. One person is hugely muscled and strong and wants to hurt the other, normally proportioned person. There will always be a few ways to hurt, immobilise, kill humans so you just need to find a way to create the oppotunity to get to these.
The "David" figure needs to create a situation where the "goliath" figure will be forced into an action that will give "David" the desired outcome - survival. There are an infinite number of ways this could be possible but the idea is what you need to worry about.

Learn to control the situation not hack it up with your sword.

[ajacxxion]

The most powerful and effective martial artists incorporate completely all aspects of both the pen and the sword.

Think about what each stand for,
the pen stands for ideas, thinking, culture, society, ultimately relationships with other people. The pen can state facts, and it can also influence and create, with the mind of it's wielder. All of these things are essential to ART. Relate this to the artist in the term "Martial Artist".

the sword (depending on individual philosophy and moral alignment)
may stand for justice, and therefore cultivation of the self and the rest of society, and this also relates to relationships with other people. This means cultivation of the self because that is a prime goal of the martial arts. Justice relates to cultivation of society. Violence can act as an equalizer (when used properly); for example when people who are not moral take advantage of those who are moral, martial arts can be used to alleviate this problem with society. And so the sword is the martial part to "martial artist".

I believe this question of whether the pen is stronger than the sword or not lies at the fundamental heart of Martial Arts, and I think that the answer to this, and the real question is:

Is considering the strength of the pen compared to the sword more important than using both the pen and the sword to accomplish the goal of cultivation for the self and society?

It is not more important, rather, the important thing is that we use both to cultivate effectively.

This is what a true martial artist does..... I think.....

[middleman]

Which is more 'powerful', Yin or Yang?

My thoughts on Pen and Sword have been expanding lately, with the assistence of this nice forum, and other 'studies'.

It seems to me the Samurai took up pen to BALANCE the sword.
Sword can represent the 'active outter' - Yang
Pen represents 'passive inner' - Yin

If the pen is used as an inner meditative practice, poety, calligraphy, etc, while the sword is an active outter practice, balance can be achieved, Tai Chi.

What Think Ye?

middleman

[Kinjiro Tsukasa]

The sword can kill your body, but the pen can destroy your reputation for all eternity.

[middleman]

When one lives in balance, yin and yang can be trancended and eternity can be 'known' to be no other than 'now'.

[KenpoDavid]

Ideas will, in the long run, be more powerful than force. somebody who believes enough in an idea cannot be persuaded by force, whereas people without a strong belief are easily bullied.

or, as Machiavelli wrote "It is better to be loved than feared."

[middleman]

Thanks KD,
'A Course in Miracles' explains that an idea, unlike a physical thing, which when shared is divided, increases when shared. Is 'reality' a shared idea? Is it a 'realitivity' cause we don't all share the details of this so called 'reality'?

[booksie_girl]

The pen

A sword can force people to your way of thinking, but people forced are not truly convinced. A pen (words) can change a person's heart, and not just affect their sense of self-preservation.

Also, a sword can kill you, but words can convince you to kill yourself.

[imawimp]

The pen is mightier then the sword, BUT - the sword speaks louder at any given moment.

Properly applied either can be used to ruin your day.

[Knight_Errant]

'The pen is mightier than the sword' assumes that you and others can actually read...

[booksie_girl]

:( Not nice. I is doin my bst. Not mi falt if i cant red an rite wel

[Knight_Errant]

Anyway, the pen is better because it's a concealable weapon, much less obvious than the sword...

[middleman]

A beauracrat used his pen to sign a law allowing cameras on top of traffic lights in MD. Now if you don't make the yellow(which I understand they have shortened the time), you get a nice fine in the mail.
The Sword represents the spirit, and the pen the letter. The spirit AND the letter are important(in our present stage of growth), however Paul said, "The letter killeth and the spirit giveth life."
So in this senerio, the pen killeth, and the sword giveth life.
(Glad I didn't use a pen to write this!)?