Overcoming soreness in isometric stretches

[Van Zandt]

I was going to save this for my forthcoming book, but anyhoo...

Soreness is a common problem for many people who attempt isometric stretches. The main cause of this soreness is that the muscles are not yet strong enough to do them. Some people, however, experience soreness simply because they haven't tried them before but may already have sufficient strength to do them long-term.

So how do you tell if the soreness you're experiencing is down to lack of strength or lack of experience?

Well, the formula I use personally and teach to others is as follows:

1) Attempt the isometric stretches.
2) If you are not sore in the days following, crack on.
3) If you are sore afterwards, rest until any signs of discomfort have disappeared. This might take a few days.
4) Try the isometric stretches again.
5) If you are still sore, repeat # 3.
6) Repeat # 4.
7) If you are still sore after the third application (following sufficient rest between workouts) then I'm afraid you don't yet have the strength to do them. Go work on your squats, lunges, deadlifts, pulldowns and flies. If you don't feel soreness after the third application, congratulations; you just got broken in by the Isometric Stretching Fairy. Here's a tissue and a cigarette. :evil:

Why? Because my research has shown that typically three applications (with sufficient rest between workouts) is enough to adapt to the strains of isometric stretches and reduce the onset of soreness.

Soreness after three applications is an indication that your overall strength is not sufficient.

Go on, give it a try and report back your findings here.

[KAMAU]

thankyou kindly for yet again more top info, iv just been give the Nod on a january gradeing (wahoo!) my flexabilty to sides is wanting and its only been the last few months Iv not been extremly sore after normal training, I'l give this ago if I succeed in the next few weeks/months with the early morning stretching practises discribed in your other penned threads and again thanx for shareing the know-how

bests Paul

[Van Zandt]

No problems Paul, hope it helps you. :cool:

[KAMAU]

its going pretty good Van Z' well lets say a lot further along the road then I would have been. tyvm........Iv been thinking on a box stretcher the 30/40 quid type but a really heavy coffee table to grab and a thick carpet for resistance seems to be haveing the gradual effect im quite pleased with, must confess to missing a few early morning stretches and iv deffinatly felt the consequences. cheerz again, if its of intrest il keep things updated in a journel start of the year and try to carry it on hopefully up to my BB gradeing late next year, fingers crossed;)

gamsa hami da

[Van Zandt]

Cheers Kamau. Please do keep us updated on your progress and good luck with your black belt grading.

[ArthurKing]

Can i just ask forsome advice Van Z? I've been doing dynamic stretches followed by passive stretching for about 5 weeks now, twice per day as directed by your fabulous sticky. My problem is that although i seem to be making progress (front splits and kicks are generally longer and more comfortable than ever before), generally i seem to be losing some dynamic flexibilty in training and my legs get tired and a little sore very quickly. Also my side splits are longer when assisted (sitting) but definitely harder/shorter/more difficult when standing (unassisted).
I'm 45 years old and generally fit, i do a lot of walking and some running (not running since starting this program) and also i've recently injured my knee and think this may also be related to stress created by the dynamics?
I know this is a lot to get your head round but any thoughts?
ps i don't do any isometrics or weight training at the moment.

[YouKnowWho]

You can also use the "reverse psyclology" to help your stretching.

- You lay down on the ground.
- Ask your opponent to hold on your legs as tight as he can.
- You try to separate your legs as hard as you can.
- When you feel so exhausted by trying to "separate" your legs, your opponent let go your legs.
- You now can feel so good by doing a perfect front and back split.

I''l call this "reverse psyclology" training. Whatever that you are not allow to do, if you can do it, you will feel great about doing it.

You can also use the "door frame" to help your stretching. Both hands hold on the door frame, one leg on the door frame, use your hands to pull your groin area to be close to the door frame.

[Van Zandt]

ArthurKing,

Thank you for your kind words regarding my other thread. It's great to see you've been making progress and I'll certainly try to assist you with your questions on this thread. But before I can give any advice, I have a few questions for you if that's ok?

1. You said you start to lose dynamic flexibility. When does this occur? Is it at the end of your martial arts class (ie after kicking) or the dynamic stretching phase of your workouts?

2. What activities cause you the most soreness, where do you feel the soreness, and how soon after the activity does it appear?

That should do for now. I'll help you find solutions to your other problems once we sort out the first two :cool:

[ArthurKing]

HI Van, this is how it happens, i do my Dynamics first thing in the morning, generally speaking, my legs are not sore at the beginning. Very quickly though i get twinges of sharp (not very sharp) at the top of my left thigh and usually also in my right knee. This is uncomfortable but not crippling and usually i can get all the way through all my reps reasonably comfortably. Usually i then do some Kata/Combination practice and this is where my problems start- at this point my legs feel weak and i find it quite hard to do my techniques with much vigour. Then i do Static stretches- front splits (ok, little pain in left groin/thigh as before but ok). This seems to be making slow progress and i have recently started using a weighted bag to push me further. Then Sitting assissted side splits ( i pull myself against some 'railings', usually quite hard and hold for 30-60 seconds), this is the one that mostly hurts my inner thigh. I sometimes attempt standing side splits next but they really are worse than they have ever been. After 3 hours or so i'm pretty well recovered, sometimes a little sore in the thigh.
My problem is that when i train in the dojo some of my kicks are definitely worse/not so high- particularly chambered kicks like the roundhouse where i just haven't got the strength to keep my knees up (mind you i never have had and think this might be a strength issue).
My chief concern is this- if i keep pushing my stretching in this way and keep losing mobility/flexibility, am i damaging myself? How do you know when pushing hard is pushing too much? Could my age be a factor in this?

[Van Zandt]

Sorry I didn't get back to you.

Very quickly though i get twinges of sharp (not verysharp) at the top of my left thigh and usually also in my right knee.

Which exercise does this sensation occur?

Do you have any previous injuries in these areas (thigh/knee)?

How many times a week do you strength train?

Sorry for answering questions with questions. We'll get to the bottom of it eventually!

[ArthurKing]

Cheers for getting back Van Z, i am not doing any strength training at the moment, aside from a few lunges/squats as part of warming up in the Dojo, usually once a week. The sharp pain seems to be in the tendon at the top of my left thigh and begins pretty well at the start of my sets of Dynamics but is particularly acute with side splits(sitting). The pain in my right knee comes on about the same time but tends to hang around for longer. I did fall/twist my right knee recently and that may be the cause of that pain) but i have no previous injuries and have always been remarkably trouble free in the legs/hips department. I have been making my Dynamics a little less 'enthusiastic' in the last few days and that seems to be helping with the general fatigue but i suspect i really need to do some of the 'Bill Wallace' leg work?

[Van Zandt]

The sharp pain seems to be in the tendon at the top of my left thigh and begins pretty well at the start of my sets of Dynamics but is particularly acute with side splits(sitting).

Given that you don't do a dedicated strength training routine, I would suspect the cause might be weak hip flexors (iliopsoas). These videos should help:

YouTube- Superfoot Wallace training for high kick with the chair

YouTube- How to Strengthen the Hip Flexor

I did fall/twist my right knee recently

Rather than speculate if there is damage to the joint, I would urge you to visit your doctor ASAP to get it checked out.

[Javi]

thanks for the advice. how long would you recommend holding the isometric stretches for? I've been following the Thomas Kutz DVD which is pretty intense and I do typically get some soreness. Could time in the stretch have an influence on this or should it not matter according to your criterea?