Street efficient

[incubus]

How efficient your martial arts is if had to be used in the street?

[YODA]

Hasn't let me down as yet - maybe down to poor opposition though LOL!

[Guerilla Fists]

Looks like "very efficient" is dominating the poles. Surprise surprise lol. seriously though, who is gonna crap all over an art they've dedicated their time, money, and effort into?

[quartermaster]

i haven't used it but if i had no faith in what i do, i wouldn't do it

[Brad Ellin]

Is, have and hope never again to have too.

[Kwajman]

Well, we're into martial arts for different reasons also. Some for self defense, some for the workout, others for selfconfidence, things like that. So I'm not sure if we really know how our MA would do. Maybe we wouldn't want to find out....I don't know....

[totality]

some of us simply participate in MA so we can beat people up and not go to jail for it. keep that in mind, my friend. ;)

[Trent Tiemeyer]

I only fight 100 pound drunks.

[totality]

i thought you ate 100 pound drunks for breakfast? :D

[Trent Tiemeyer]

No, just what they bench press.

[kempocos]

It would be better to ask , have you used your art in the street?

my guess is more than half the VERY EFFICIENT folks would be very shocked at what a very intent aggressive person would do to thier well honned dojo drills.

[Brad Ellin]

If asking for confirmation, then my answer is still yes. It has, I have and hope to never again. That's not why I train, though it is a pleasant benefit.

[Adam]

You eat barbells for breakfast? Respect!

My art isn't effective for THE STREET, as it's very, very competition-orientated, but I don't mind. Self defense isn't a big issue for me anyway. (at least I hope it won't have to be)

I aim to be effective for the street as a person however. Doing an art which I don't believe is the most effective won't magically make me a lousy fighter.

[shipto]

I have voted never used, but sure it would work and I believe it would merely because part of what we are taught is very basic street stuff.

[Yan]

Well, I would say that kickboxing would be at least partially useful in a streetfight.

I think highly specialised arts like Kung Fu, Jeet-kun-do and the like would not be so useful, as well as a couple other striking arts which are more designed for different ways of fighting. Although I've never tried it myself it must be pretty hard to do a TK high kick to the head when someone's trying to punch your face in. Sometimes simpler is better.

Of course it goes without saying that any grappling artist would beat any striking artist of similar level in a close-up, one-to-one streetfight, if only because you can't hit people very well when you're flying upside-down towards the ground.

Of course this is only an opinion.

[Poop-Loops]

If you hit the guy fast enough, he can't grab your arm, can he? :)

Never tried it, but if it wasn't effective, it would be so popular, would it?

PL

[Beehe]

ok heres some words of wisdom if the person who attack me when i left class uses this board never attack some carrying a kendo stick and a staff he broke my staff :( then i beat the poo out of him with kendo stick it took me a week to make that staff:(
ohh well never pickl a fight with someone even if you think your better well any ways the moral too the story you dont have to use one wepon at a time you could have a sword and punch them still or a staff and a sword what ever you choose
PS: I won muuhahahahah:D

[LilBunnyRabbit]

Hmm...no answer that works for me. I know that the art works, but I wouldn't describe it as efficient, just effective.

[Rhineville]

Myself... ("sigh")
...in a street fight I'd probably need some help since I'm a bit short and don't have a lot of REAL fighting experience.
As for how Goju Karate-Do holds up...
... better than me.

[TigerAn1]

It would depend on the type of streetfight one was involved in and what the intent and mindset of the agressor was. I saw about a month ago the cops wailing on some big dude with their clubs and this cat would not go down! They were hittin' this guy in all the right places and it didn't even seem to phase him. Given that example- I'm not sure. BTW- the guy died from the injuries incurred from the cops. He was spaced out on PCP which is why he felt notta. I would think most individuals (criminals) bold enough to stick a knife in your face are probably (good bet) on something. I'd prefer to throw out some cash and put my knee's in the breeze..... C Ya- NOT.

:woo:

[Amakasashi]

I don't train to become an effective fighter, I train to try to grasp the spiritual nature of aikido. Though in any cause i am sure it would be very effective on the "street", though even if i were attacked i doubt i would use it do to principle. As far as someone punching really fast, we went over this in aikido trying to catch a regular punch is damn near impossible even for skilled people, even though aikido especially seems to grab the punch lets say it doesn't, it may direct the persons intent outward then towards the ground or follow the return path of the punch and sending his ki towards the ground then out. that is from my own experiences though.

[aikiMac]

Originally posted by Amakasashi
As far as someone punching really fast, we went over this in aikido trying to catch a regular punch is damn near impossible even for skilled people, even though aikido especially seems to grab the punch lets say it doesn't, it may direct the persons intent outward then towards the ground or follow the return path of the punch and sending his ki towards the ground then out.
Ya, this is how I learned it too. Parry and redirect, and then go with whatever throw or projection avails itself. Hey, if the silat and kali and wing chun people can parry and redirect, then so can us aikido people. I haven't needed to fight (yet?) but some of my classmates have. Aikido worked for them, so I have hope.

[Albert]

Any style can be effective on the street. I was attacked by 5 older guys outside of a bowling ally once, and didnt manage to inflict much damage to any of them, but rather i kept myslef from being hurt. Eventually they fled after a good amount of fighting, because the cops had been called. The reason i didnt pummel the lot of them, was because at that time, it was the first fight i had ever been in, and my adrenaline got the best of me, i couldnt throw a single strike, but i was able to stop almost every attack from hitting me. It was a bit strange.

[shuyun3]

ive used mine in the street and it comes down to what works.

you can't wear your black belt there.

[Gryphon Hall]

There aren't enough options in the poll. I've used mine one or twice and I was good, and that was some time ago. I kind of dominated the fight, but even if my opponents were really good, being victorious only twice doesn't mean it will always be effective and efficient, right?

So, how about a "It has been one or twice in the past, but I'm not sure if it's efficient now" option?

Thanks.

[#1 Stutta]

I voted not sure b/c I'm not in Tang Soo Do anymore. I'm now in Tae Kwon Do. TSD helped me in fights, but I don't TKD will b/c it's more sport-oriented.

[Shaolin Dragon]

I have had a few instructors trained in Mok ka who used it in real situations (a number of them having been doorman) so I am confident that the style is effective. A more pertinent question would be "how effectively could YOU use your style on the streets?"
Having never really needed to do it I don't know what my answer would be; although in a sense it is still very effective as my training in avoidance and conflict resolution has worked well up untill now.

[Isabella la Red]

:D Had just finished a training and was on the way home when 2 guys one shorter than me and another like a giant jumped out and wanted my money ( which i had none at the time) dont remember how i did it just remembered the anger that raced through me about men being down right pric... when was the last time you heard of female muggers, or female rapests?
yeah anyway, while they were down and when i got the chance I ran like bloody hell, but felt great because Im here and there wasnt a finger laid on me.

[Kukishinden Ryu]

It is not allways the style itself but rather who is teaching it and how it is being tought. The art I am currently in has been affective so far :D

[ranger]

i answered very effecient becoz not only me but those that have been before me and after me have used it effectively. and i'm sure it could be used effeciently and effectively by those that will follow.

to add "In combat, one is required only that his art be practical and COMPLETELY effective CARING NOTHING for STYLE or PHILOSOPHY"

-- Obata

good day!:)

[surgingshark]

Kept me alive and well all seven times.

Although time #4 may not really count...they were both drunk to the point of collapse :P

[Sanitarium]

I think highly specialised arts like Kung Fu, Jeet-kun-do and the like would not be so useful, as well as a couple other striking arts which are more designed for different ways of fighting. Although I've never tried it myself it must be pretty hard to do a TK high kick to the head when someone's trying to punch your face in. Sometimes simpler is better.


JKD emphasises a simple yet effective set of moves.

[hedgehogey]

Yet JKD is not a set of moves.

[bigd]

very efficient! used it couple of times just hope i dont have touse it again

[b19vny]

Me personally, one-on-one, no weapons, in broad daylight, in the right clothes, with plenty of warning, in an open space against Mr Average . . . I'd give myself 60/40 odds.

Nothing to do with 'system' - everything to do with the person.

[Kenpo Kicker]

It all depends on the person in my stand up style (non-sport tkd). The traning is very different than alot of things I hear about tkd schools. The art is simple which is good. It punches, elbows, knees, and kicks which should be plenty to put togeither for stand up. I never tested on the street it so I put it should work. Kenpo worked for me and due to the heavy training that my school does I feel it is way more effective than the kenpo training I had. I also dunno if bjj is exactly street effective and again it depends on the person and training. The training is also intense. I don't think it would matter what art I took to make me street very effective as long as it trains me to strike hard (not like kung fu) and grapple.

It would depend on the type of streetfight one was involved in and what the intent and mindset of the agressor was. I saw about a month ago the cops wailing on some big dude with their clubs and this cat would not go down! They were hittin' this guy in all the right places and it didn't even seem to phase him. Given that example- I'm not sure. BTW- the guy died from the injuries incurred from the cops. He was spaced out on PCP which is why he felt notta. I would think most individuals (criminals) bold enough to stick a knife in your face are probably (good bet) on something. I'd prefer to throw out some cash and put my knee's in the breeze..... C Ya- NOT.

:woo:

Hey, I saw that! That was metro(nash) beating him to death right? I cannot remember. That was nuts.

[OBCT]

When confronted on my way home once, the last thing going through my mind was my style, or what i learned in class. Guy walks up to me, asks if i've got a lighter, i say yes being nice, put hand in pocket to get lighter and saw a fist coming towards me. Training would have taught me to put a sankyo or such on him, instead i sort of halfside stepped i got a head lock, then just dropped to the ground, then i put on a pin like in training.
My style didn't help, but the confidence gained from training did.
I also noticed in the rush of the moment, while he was pinned, the sense of power and i had a nasty temptation, to really mess him up, which would have been quite easy, I definately think my training helped me with my self discipline, because i wasn't affraid of him getting back up, if i was affraid, i'd have made sure he stayed down, and probably got myself arrested.
(I did dislocate his right index finger while pinned though, which i now feel guilty about)

[Shaolin Dragon]

I don't think it would matter what art I took to make me street very effective as long as it trains me to strike hard (not like kung fu) and grapple.


What makes you think kung fu doesn't teach you to strike hard? :confused:

[Kenpo Kicker]

What makes you think kung fu doesn't teach you to strike hard? :confused:

The training and type of punches they use. I use boxing style punches and they seem to not use punches I agree with. I hate hitting air and thats all my kung fu friends do.

[shootodog]

a well rounded fighter will have an advantage.

[Shaolin Dragon]

The training and type of punches they use. I use boxing style punches and they seem to not use punches I agree with. I hate hitting air and thats all my kung fu friends do.

So because your friends who do "kung fu" only punch in a certain way and don't train with resistance, you assume that all kung fu practitioners train that way?

Kung fu is an umbrella term for CMA - don't make the mistake of assuming that all of the styles within it train in the same way, or that all of the classes within those styles do either.

[Kenpo Kicker]

So because your friends who do "kung fu" only punch in a certain way and don't train with resistance, you assume that all kung fu practitioners train that way?

Kung fu is an umbrella term for CMA - don't make the mistake of assuming that all of the styles within it train in the same way, or that all of the classes within those styles do either.


I never seen a kung fu person do my sort of punches. If they mixed with boxing I would believe it. Kung fu isn't for me that is what I meant with my post. I'm saying they don't punch the way I want to punch (which is harder) don't put words in my mouth. I never even said my friends do not train against resisting partners (maybe your kung fu school does this since you are the one that said it not me). I'm resisting when I spar them so they do. I never stated they punch all the same either. Don't be so defensive plz.

[Shaolin Dragon]

I never seen a kung fu person do my sort of punches. If they mixed with boxing I would believe it. Kung fu isn't for me that is what I meant with my post. I'm saying they don't punch the way I want to punch (which is harder) don't put words in my mouth. I never even said my friends do not train against resisting partners (maybe your kung fu school does this since you are the one that said it not me). I'm resisting when I spar them so they do. I never stated they punch all the same either. Don't be so defensive plz.

I hate hitting air and thats all my kung fu friends do.

That implies that your friends do not train against resistance. In your earlier post, you specifically singled out kung fu as not teaching you to strike hard. I have put no words in your mouth.


I am not trying to be defensive, simply trying to help improve your understanding of another MA - which after all, is what MAP is all about. You are making a sweeping generalisation about a style (and I will defend any style against which such generalisations are made) based on a limited experience of training with some friends.

[Colin Linz]

Shorinji Kempo built its reputation early on because of Doshin So and his student’s work in eliminating the Yakuza from Tadotsu. These battles were sometimes fought in streets, does this count.

[Kenpo Kicker]

That implies that your friends do not train against resistance. In your earlier post, you specifically singled out kung fu as not teaching you to strike hard. I have put no words in your mouth.


I am not trying to be defensive, simply trying to help improve your understanding of another MA - which after all, is what MAP is all about. You are making a sweeping generalisation about a style (and I will defend any style against which such generalisations are made) based on a limited experience of training with some friends.


Well they do spar. I rather hit pads than air that is what I was refering too. They do not work out enough. Oh well they hit the mook which I don't agree with but it's cool. They talk alot about bs energy, and I have yet to see what they claim. That is the way schools over here work. When the kung fu guys over here spar they do not make contact to the face. This is from 3 different schools and 2 different kung fu styles. Now the boxing punches I learn in kickboxing blow their kung fu strikes out of the water. That is my experience. I even spar their way with no pads. I would train in it but it just plain sux (it's near my tkd/bjj/kickboxing school). I have watched their classes. This could just be lausy schools /shrug but I bet there are alot of em. There is even a crappy mma gym near me. The kenpo I took had kung fu strikes in it, but also had standard punches that are needed. I know the kung fu punches man more so wing chun though (I don't use them since I like full motion BOXING style punches not kung fu punches that come from the waist). That is what I meant by the post that arts that strike hard such as muay thai, kickboxing, boxing, kenpo, tkd, and ect. There are different ways to strike. My kung fu friends are not insulted that I say their punches lack power since that is not their goal. Kung fu is known as a soft style as I hear (there movements and strikes) and tkd is known as rigid by them I guess.


edit: Basically I do not agree with the philosophy and they have never proven to be hard strikers like boxers or kickboxers.

[ranger]

i thought this thread was about if you THINK your art or system is efficient not debating if a style or system is inferior becoz of this and that. i've encountered white eye brow style of kung fu and its powerful and fast and thats just one style. i do hebei hsing-i and i use it in sparring a lot.

[Albert]

i say you fight one of your friends kenpo kicker, and see just how hard they dont hit. eh..?

[Kenpo Kicker]

i say you fight one of your friends kenpo kicker, and see just how hard they dont hit. eh..?
Why would I fight my friends?

[incubus]

Came back to check a thread I had started some months ago. Cool to see all this interest. MAP is a great site and now that I am back using it, I will not leave it again.
Although I have never used my MA in the street yet, I am sure that it all depends on one's preperation and on his confidence in what he knows.

[Sonshu]

I think it would work well and field trials to date are very good.

Pressure testing is the key but if you go to the mill to many times (so the saying goes).

Still louts in clubs etc are most of what I train to deal with and it has shone through in these situations.

[Ghost Frog]

Some of what we learn is street effective, some of it not. At least, not for me- it may be different for others. I used to think that the only way to find out if a technique was effective was to spar with it, to practise it against an opponent who was resisting, but I've found that that's not entirely accurate, the reason being that the situations that women find that they have to use stuff are not the same as two men squaring off for a 'straightener'.

The limited number of techniques I have used 'in anger' have been of the 'finger jab to the throat' variety, that seem quite weak when you try them on training partners, but buy you a good few seconds to run away when they're used on someone who's not expecting it. Also, quite a few of the escapes from someone grabbing you or pinning you down have proved to be useful and effective.

I'm sure some of these wouldn't work on the proverbial '300lb bouncer' of Royce Gracie, but the difference is that most men who behave in this way are pretty cowardly, and quite weak. They don't expect you to do anything, so if you do, it takes them by surprise. I find it hard to land a good punch on my training partners when I'm sparring them, whereas the only time I've punched someone I knocked him a few feet backwards, though I'd only been training for a bit. Luckily, the bouncers then jumped on him.

I still believe that the most important things you get from training are better fitness, being comfortable with being in contact with and knocked about by other people, and an awareness of body movement. Overall, the best thing I've learnt from our club is to walk tall and not to be afraid, which is the most important thing for a woman to learn.

[Lucharaan]

[QUOTE=Yan]Well, I would say that kickboxing would be at least partially useful in a streetfight.

I think highly specialised arts like Kung Fu, Jeet-kun-do and the like would not be so useful, QUOTE]

Isn't Jeet kun do good for street fight? I thought that's why it was made?

[ThaiMantis]

i was a kicky thai boxery punchin type 18n year old who was pretty full of it, i met a tall (6 ft 4 inches tall) lanky 14 year old who had been training in chinese kung fu for some time. he was my girlfriends younger brother.

i was pretty confident and fairly good, 6 ft, 12 & stone and pretty good shape, and so thought i might have a mess about with the kid and show him what's what.

imagine my surprise when time after time we clashed, i found myself overwhelmed by a clashing smashing blur of arms culminating with my hands safely out of the way as his fists smashed into my face (pulled, mercifully, as it was eye strikes with nasty pointy fingers, throat gouges, things called gau choys or something like that and a force and power with totally outstretched arms that i just couldnt comprehend.

the only thing i could realistically do was hold him off with long range roundhouses, which u could never really hurt him with, and occasionally could slip a thai style knee or elbow (singular) before the distance closed & the result was the same. the 14 year old Mantis took me out in seconds.

i wasn't having this, so I persevered at this for months in a skeptical fashion. ..the result always pretty much the same.

the bruises to my forearms from savage & violent arm clashing were amazing, as were the injuries even when he was trying to "pull" the final impact not to damage me too much. split lips, small impact bruises from the phoenix eye fist on my face, arms neck, etc, where from time to time he accidentally did connect slightly with it.

if he'd actually been slamming them home, i'd have been blind, concussed, teeth missing, jesus, i dread to think.

...all in all it was pretty embarrassing. :o ...it was my first real lesson in humility, and not making assumptions about peoples styles.

we became lifelong friends from that point on.

these days i understand all of that a whole lot better, and IMO I would have to say some kung fu fighters can hit really, really hard, and in a far more devasting way than boxing punches.

[Paratus]

I think how efficient my art would be on the street would depend on the situation. I'm fairly confindent I could difuse 1 person without much difficulty. That, would also depend on the person attacking me.

I don't know, I usually approach things with a "I'll believe it when I see/expirence it" mentality. So do I think my art would do well in the street? I'd say so if it was a petty fight of someone untrained trying to start trouble, but much more than that I couldn't say for certain.

Maybe I'm just a pessimist :D

[Sonshu]

I'm sure some of these wouldn't work on the proverbial '300lb bouncer' of Royce Gracie, but the difference is that most men who behave in this way are pretty cowardly, and quite weak. They don't expect you to do anything, so if you do, it takes them by surprise. I find it hard to land a good punch on my training partners when I'm sparring them, whereas the only time I've punched someone I knocked him a few feet backwards, though I'd only been training for a bit. Luckily, the bouncers then jumped on him.



This is often due to sparring not having the full commitment of wanting to knock the hell out of your partner. Which is good.

I often find sparring I am not as good as I would be in an out and out fight but then again its because I do not over commit on the punches.

[Stormrider]

Its held up fine the couple of times I had to use it. But that being said I don't practice TKD with the olympic rules and full pads unless I am going to fight in a tournament very soon.

[gaz shaw]

i've never needed to use it (and dont really want to, because no matter how good i am they may be better and/or armed) but i feel i could defend myself against most people if i was attacked (and i bet i am faster than them as well)

[Trinity]

I have used my self sefence in situations and it works. Though i believe self defence and fighting are two different things if i have a one on one with somebody I fight differently to when some body attacks me for no reason out of the blue. There are fighting styles and self defence styles they are different, though they can both be used for delf defence the true self defence styles in the write situation are superior the same as a lot of ring styles or the punch and kick type of styles are better in a one on one fight.

[Iai-do master]

goshin jutsu is a very good fighting style. I love it becouse the blocks are also said to be strikes becouse of the breaks and hyper extens!!!!!!!!

[RFWright]

First question...Yes
Second Question...[QUOTE=kempocos]It would be better to ask , have you used your art in the street?... Yes.