Ninjutsu Styles ?

[natxanadu]

Bujinkan, Jinenkan, Genbukan, or To-Shin Do

any comments on the various pro's cons of the various Ninjutsu Styles ?

[waya]

hmmmmmmmmmmm
Ok, To Shin Do is, in my opinion, basically Bujinkan under another name since that is Stephen Hayes' training. Genbukan I have heard some fair things of, but no direct exposure. Bujinkan I have exposure to and am still training although currently it is sporadic, but it is a very effective art.

Rob

[Darzeka]

I do Ninjukai Taijutsu - a derivative from the teachings of the "mountain freak" fighting monks of japan (the earliest reference to ninjas I think).

The art has been pieced back together from books, scrolls and direct teaching. It as a living art is constantly changing and after many years of training effectively results in a personalised fighting style.

Sadly there are only Dojos located in Japan, Singapore and here in Perth Australia.

When Japan was taken over by america and with the breakdown of the samuri class the then grand master moved to singapore to continue his teachings without interference. He taught the singapore military hand to hand combat for a while and later Shihan John Ang brought it here to Oz.

Thus it escaped the americanization brought into many of the japanese arts.

[khafra]

So, if I wanna do it Yamabushi style, I have to go down under? Man... That's a long bicycle ride.

[Solane]

Have a look at the "Doa3" & "Genbukan Bujinkan xxxkan" threads for links and explanations of the above.

[SliqueRICK]

the one i like most is a mixed art derived from sensei tews training in many arts including ninjitsu actually its a martial science www.totalwarrior.com

[SilentNightfall]

Actually, Mr. Tew has no training in any form of legitimate ninjutsu. He does, however, claim to teach an Americanized form of ninjutsu, which basically means it includes no real essence of the art. Again, I've training in Tew Ryu for a period and so I know both the background of the art and its teacher. But I also said it was a decent art compared to many in another thread.

[jbm]

Yeah ive seen that tew ryu stuff on that site an it doesn't look to bad but i would rather learn the true japanese ninjutsu straight from japan.

[SilentNightfall]

Then you'll definitely want to go with one of the "X-kans" then. Personally I'd recommend the Bujinkan as that is the path I chose with a variety of different reasons behind said decision. All three, however, are authentic ninjutsu.

[jbm]

arent their 9 bujinkan styles and if so are they completly different or are they somewhat similar? What is their reason for making all those styles under the same name?

[Brad Ellin]

There are nine schools within the Bujinkan. Hatsumi is Soke (head of family) of nine schools of martial arts, 3 of them being actual schools of ninja arts. Bujinkan translates (roughly) into "Training Hall of the Divine Warrior". As for his reasons, only he knows for sure, but don't you think it's easier to say "I study in the Bujinkan" instead of "I study -----list all nine schools here--".

[SilentNightfall]

As stated above, there are only three really true "ninjutsu" schools within the Bujinkan, though eight of the nine definitely have ninjutsu in them due to their lineages and the like. Then there is one "pure" samurai school, which is the Takagi Yoshin Ryu. If you'd like to know how the schools are interrelated and have come to include ninjutsu in their curriculum, with the exception of the above mentioned samurai ryu, I will take the time to post it here, however you may not fully understand such with no prior knowledge of the Bujinkan system and it's nine schools.

[Noryoku-Kage]

did you guys try the top level for ninja training the shinobi style its hard but the result is good

[SilentNightfall]

I'm interested in why you apparently believe that this "Shinobi Style" is above all other forms of ninjutsu available today. Are you saying that the training involved is much more comprehensive than that of any of the "X-kans?" If so, why is it that none of us have ever heard of this so-called shinobi art? :rolleyes:

[xplasma]

Shinobi Style isn't real, that kid made it up. See the Thread titled Shinobi style. Probably one of the Real Ultimate Power Freaks that like ninjas way too much. Hopefully none of us with flip out and kill him, considering according to him that is all ninjas do.

[SilentNightfall]

Yes, I already addressed this in the Shinobi Style thread. I merely wanted to post something here to make sure he saw my reply. And what do you mean ninja aren't supposed to flip out and kill everyone? You mean we're really not? Oh crap...

[Noryoku-Kage]

hey guys shinobi are simple ninja like you but they have an harder training its only that

[SilentNightfall]

Harder training? How so? Care to explain? And just wondering, but how exactly do you know how hard we train? On top of that, do you realize that there is no difference between the shinobi and the ninja? They are the same thing. Just two names for one entity.

[Noryoku-Kage]

yeah but here are the story of the shinobi

History:

Long before Hiteh's Night, the ancinet empire of Aurim ruled most of
Taladas. Though its culture differed from that of far-away Ansalon, much of its government was similar to the feudal system, with the various noble families known as the Samurai. The Taguchi Family had long held its position as a valuble Family in service to the Emerald Throne through its sophisticated intelligence system, a system that operated openly for 400 years before the War of Taguchi's Honor, sometime around 650 PC. The defeated Taguchi Family, and their allies, were defeated. The leaders of the Taguchi family and the other rebellious lords were executed, with those of the Tagughi line given the worst punishment in the Empire: Death unto the Third Generation. The Taguchi lands were seized and divided among the Emperor's staunchest supporters, with the family being exiled from the Samurai caste and forced to become Eta, the lowest class among the Empire's citizens. Their secret agents, the Shinobi, were also ordered to surrender themselves and all their secrets to the Emperor's forces, but only a handful came forward or were captured. The rest melted into the background and became lost to history.

But the Shinobi survived. Their secret arts and remaining allies in the other families protected them until they merged with the shadows of the underworld and disappeared. Through oral history, recruitment and clan isolation, the Shinobi continued as they had before, with a new emphasis on the warrior arts to defend their obscurity and commit assassinations, a profitable business. Their knowledge of Illusions and the myth of their terrible wrath and skill also helped their survival. They continued to exist in their covert world, and always held a special hatred for the Emrald Throne.

[Noryoku-Kage]

how long do you train

[Brad Ellin]

I've been training 21 years. And you? Who is your teacher? Who is/was his? Or have you totally confused an RPG for reality?

[SilentNightfall]

Once again, this is definitely a made-up history for an RPG realm. Quite creative, actually. :D But Kage-san...this is not real life history. This is made up for a game.

[jbm]

Yeah there is a popular game out on ps2 called shinobi.:D

[Freeform]

BBBBBBAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWHHHHHHHH!!!

Sorry, I thought I'd stumbled unto the games thread there for a second!

Col

[Brad Ellin]

You're right Freeform, if I had not been following this thread I would have thought the same thing. His "history" sounds just like an advertisement for a game.

See you in less than 2 weeks Josh!

[Noryoku-Kage]

i was joking shinobi was some kind of theif our royal spy that wasent seen by no one they was so good that they was invisible

[jbm]

I beleive you should have put that on the jokes thread, Being that you have wasted everyones time and energy. But I hold no grudge against you, apalogies excepted. :woo: :D

[havoc123]

I have been triaing in Genbukan ninpo for only about 3 weeks but i am very compassionate about what i do, any way i was wondering what is the difference between the ninpo styles. I mean is there any real self-defence or tecnical stuff or is it just the different family heads?

Also how do u edit ur signature... pathetic right, lol

[xplasma]

Originally posted by havoc123
I have been triaing in Genbukan ninpo for only about 3 weeks but i am very compassionate about what i do, any way i was wondering what is the difference between the ninpo styles. I mean is there any real self-defence or tecnical stuff or is it just the different family heads?

Also how do u edit ur signature... pathetic right, lol

1. you can edit you signurate in your user cp
2.Where do you study? I am in New York or Maryland (depending on the time of year)
3. Genbukan, which I study as well, it is an off shoot of the Bujinkan system. He left because of the "Micky Mouse" Hatsumi has become with giving away ranks, and he has very little control of his sysetm so the majority of the Bujinkan Dojos out there are crap. Genbukan techiques are more traditional and truer to the ancient Ninpo. We also train harder. Tanemura Sensei still has a lot of control over the system and Shodan is Genbukan still means soemthing. Unlike Bujinkan who has a few Shinhans is every city.

[waya]

Originally posted by xplasma
1. you can edit you signurate in your user cp
2.Where do you study? I am in New York or Maryland (depending on the time of year)
3. Genbukan, which I study as well, it is an off shoot of the Bujinkan system. He left because of the "Micky Mouse" Hatsumi has become with giving away ranks, and he has very little control of his sysetm so the majority of the Bujinkan Dojos out there are crap. Genbukan techiques are more traditional and truer to the ancient Ninpo. We also train harder. Tanemura Sensei still has a lot of control over the system and Shodan is Genbukan still means soemthing. Unlike Bujinkan who has a few Shinhans is every city.

That's quite a bold opinion.... But to the best of my knowledge, there are no Americans who have yet been given the title of Shihan... And there are not (and this is fact) high ranking instructors in every city (closest to me is 200+ miles and he is under 3rd Dan). Also, have you ever experienced Bujinkan training so that you can form a serious opinion (especially one so blatantly insulting)? While everyone is entitled to an opinion, blatant insults are not acceptable. I believe an appology would be in order.

Rob

[xplasma]

actually I have had 3 months of Bujinkan Training. I never comment about an art I never expirenced.

When I was in the Baltimore Area I was in range of about 4-5 10th dans. and a lot of their student were 3rd dans and higher. In addition within a hundred miles or so was 2 or so American Shihans. So that were my expirence comes from.

That expirence has only confirmed in me that Genbukan is the only true way of the ninpo warrior.

[pest]

i heard that Shinobi is another name for Koga...is this true? what is Koga?

[SilentNightfall]

I can't believe the threads have digressed back to X-kan bashing yet again. Funny how much the old "Genbukan is more true to ancient ninpo" opinion comes up. Now, this is obviously a matter of opinion, but do recall that ninpo was and still is ever-changing and made to adapt. Thus, there is no true way of conforming to the way ancient ninpo was. Besides, Tanemura simply teaches in the old style that Hatsumi-sensei used to. He was a student of Soke Hatsumi's before he broke off so he had to get his material and teaching style from somewhere. Now while we in the Bujinkan are encouraged to simply adapt to a situation and applhy principles, the Genbukan members seem to stress sticking to technique and using a more aggressive nature. Genbukan is not, however, characteristically harder in its training. It all depends on where you train. For instance, our good friends in the Bujinkan down south in the grand ol' state of Texas might be able to tell you what hard training is all about. Up here in Pennsylvania, my training with Papa-san is more geared towards light touch and such. Helps one to learn to lose tension, which I feel is greatly important above almost all else. It's all a matter of opinion. Of course, if I want hard training, there is a Bujinkan dojo that is 15 minutes further from me than Papa-san's so don't say that Genbukan dojos train harder. This would be too big of an assertion for you to back up.

As far as crap instructors, yeah, every art has them. I've always said to search out a good instructor. Make the effort. I'm happy where I am. I don't worry about how many bad instructors are out there. I'm only concerned with the ones that I train with, which happen to be great. Ah well... Just my usual rambling. Jaa mata.

[Kat]

SlientNightfall, I agree,Ninjutsu Bujinkan and Genbukan within Australia also seems at the bay of Political Arguments/bitching and wingeing much to its determint as a style.

I have had experience with Bujinkan through W Roy when I was younger then Bujinkan "proper" then a Genbukan Rep.I beleive each one taught an excellent practical method and principles of self defense and more,but the main simularity was their common need to bitch about the other organisations.So as an individual who can't stand that sort of sh it, I went back to Wreslting Boxing and Bjj,sure its not the same,but the boys just do it,and don't care where you come from.
Its sad to see a Jap TMA go the same way as many Chinese TMA and dissolve into Lineage wars.
In the end its up to the Individual to feel comfortable about his needs and goals and finding instruction that is compaditble with this. You have to make it work for you.
No offense meant,opinion of someone not intensely involved with any particular Xkan.
Thanks

[|-KINJO-|]

Originally posted by Darzeka
I do Ninjukai Taijutsu - a derivative from the teachings of the "mountain freak" fighting monks of japan (the earliest reference to ninjas I think).

The art has been pieced back together from books, scrolls and direct teaching. It as a living art is constantly changing and after many years of training effectively results in a personalised fighting style.

Sadly there are only Dojos located in Japan, Singapore and here in Perth Australia.

When Japan was taken over by america and with the breakdown of the samuri class the then grand master moved to singapore to continue his teachings without interference. He taught the singapore military hand to hand combat for a while and later Shihan John Ang brought it here to Oz.

Thus it escaped the americanization brought into many of the japanese arts. -->

I would like to know, the location of this ninjitsu school. can anyone provide me with further details of the school in Singapore?