Video Clip- Jung Ki Hapkido Sampling

[jungkihapkido1]

For those interested, go to

www.jungkihapkidoamerica.com

On the main page near the center/bottom is a video clip sampling of some of the basic white and yellow belt Jung Ki Hapkido techniques.

[hollywood1340]

Thanks for the linke Master D'Aloia!

[JTMS]

For those interested, go to

www.jungkihapkidoamerica.com

On the main page near the center/bottom is a video clip sampling of some of the basic white and yellow belt Jung Ki Hapkido techniques.
You need to work on keeping your back straight. Pretty weak.

[Choiyoungwoo]

You need to work on keeping your back straight. Pretty weak.

I cannot assume how you were taught, so I won't comment on tech quality. but I will say that I have seen much worse from people who claim master ranks. so .... we ALL need more training. I understand enought Korean to know better but I can't resist, and only in jest..... so please don't take offense i'm sorry but

"JUNKY" hapkido :D :D :D :D

[Thomas]

I like the demo pretty well - looks pretty good and introduces/showcases a lot of HKD skills...

I don't think you can really tell a lot about an intructor or kwan from a few minutes of video though. For some reason, on video, I always look older, balder, and fatter.... :D :D

In "real life" I know Master D'Aloia is a top notch instructor who is very technically sound, very effective in what he does, and very is very good about "instructing" (making people understand). We had a get-together in New Jersey quite some time back and I was fortunate to be able to share with and learn from Master D'Aloia (and a bunch of other instructors too).

In my opinion, anyone who has the chance should check out his website, take a look at his posts on forums (and videos), and try to get a chance to meet him in person. He's really open about learning and sharing with anyone. (And I believe there's a big seminar this summer with his instructor).

Speaking of his instructor (GM Im Hyun Soo), I have to recommend his videos as well (referenced on the site). I've watched one and was very impressed. I find the Jung Ki Kwan to pay a lot of atention to precise manipulations, more so than some others do. Overall, well worth watching and listening to.

[jungkihapkido1]

Glad you enjoyed the sample clip. All are most welcome to attend GM Lim's Jung Ki seminars in July & August.
Hope to see you there!

[klaasb]

Whenever someone puts a clip of his own techniques up on the web, I find that very brave. Because you know that someone will find something negative in your technique and will only talk about that.
I also think that when somebody puts up a video of his own techniques on the internet, they can expect to be commented on it. So I don't think that Michael cares when we point out some of the mistakes that we see.

When I look at this particular tip, I also see some mistakes made. Just like people will see mistakes made by me in my techniques, I am sure. Nobody is flawless.

From my perspective (I don't practice his style and I can only judge from this video), Michael could certainly work on his balance more. Keeping his upper body more straight and try to keep your heels on the ground.
Details most of us have to work on day in day out.

Do I think that Michael has bad technique? Certainly not. Do I think Michael's techniques are flawless? Certainly not, but neither are mine.
Do I think that Michael was very brave by putting this up on the internet for us all to watch and judge. I certainly do!!

[jungkihapkido1]

Choiyoungwoo--May we inquire as to your martial arts background, style, rank, association, teacher, website if any?

[Yakka]

I totally agree with Klaasb, In every session that we train & spot for each others techniques in the dojang we can pinpoint certain areas that need to addressed, i.e. posture balance etc,. and I am sure that Mr.D'Aloia takes on board any minor critisisms with a positive attitude, it is all part of a learning curve, we can never stop learning, I too think he is brave to show his techniques to the world, I think his techniques are good.

[American HKD]

Greetings,

I might assume that some of you are not familiar with this style from the comment of HKD or Hap Ki Yu Sool.

Master Mike is one of the best and strongest technicians around. Being one who has trained with the JKK and Master Mike many times and has been on the receiving end his tech many times I can say there's nothing "weak" with him or the JKK led by GM Lim Hyun Soo.

With that said I don't think Mike intended to make a perfect film or edit out what wasn't perfect he was just going through a skills set.

Klaas would know many takes are probably needed to make a good demo film.

[BackFistMonkey]

The only time I have had my wrist grabbed by someone who really meant to do something was when I was being put in handcuffs .

I think it is basically redundant to point out that nothing I saw I the second video would apply to any real life situation unless they are trying to stop you from pulling a knife or gun from concealment .

The first video is a mystery to me ... I see them doing things , some of which I liked a whole lot ... but none of it makes much sense in terms of fighting or self defense .

That all being said ... I guess it wasn't bad , if you like to play pretend .

Greetings,

I might assume that some of you are not familiar with this style from the comment of HKD or Hap Ki Yu Sool.

Master Mike is one of the best and strongest technicians around. Being one who has trained with the JKK and Master Mike many times and has been on the receiving end his tech many times I can say there's nothing "weak" with him or the JKK led by GM Lim Hyun Soo.

With that said I don't think Mike intended to make a perfect film or edit out what wasn't perfect he was just going through a skills set.

Klaas would know many takes are probably needed to make a good demo film.

It is not hard to get compliant training looking good on video .

[JimH]

I wonder if the video clip of the abduction of Carly Brucia at the Car wash in Florida would change peoples minds about wrist grabs???

If she had known a simple Break away she may be alive today.

Sorry I know many who have had their wrists grabbed in an attack and I and others have had people Grab shirt,jacket or collars during an attack,so because some never have the experiance,except for Police compliance, does not mean it does not happen in the Real world.

[JTMS]

I wonder if the video clip of the abduction of Carly Brucia at the Car wash in Florida would change peoples minds about wrist grabs???

If she had known a simple Break away she may be alive today.

Sorry I know many who have had their wrists grabbed in an attack and I and others have had people Grab shirt,jacket or collars during an attack,so because some never have the experiance,except for Police compliance, does not mean it does not happen in the Real world.

I really agree with JimH here. Also a wrist grab is a good starting point. Hapkido like many other martial arts is taught as a system. Another words you are not going to learn it all over night.

Belive it or not most defense vs. wrist grabs pricipals (Son Mok Soo IMHO) can be aplied vs. a punch and in many other situations.

It is good for a beginner to have a point of reference. In my school this is one of the beginning points of reference that we give them (defense vs. wrist grab).

[BackFistMonkey]

I wonder if the video clip of the abduction of Carly Brucia at the Car wash in Florida would change peoples minds about wrist grabs???

If she had known a simple Break away she may be alive today.

I cannot believe you went there .

You are comparing compliant wrist grabs being performed by full grown adult men wearing black belt to an abduction which ended in murder and rape of an eleven year old girl .

You think an eleven year old girl could escape a full grown male attacker set on raping and killing her with a wrist grab ?

Please let's not use her tragedy to try and sell compliant training .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJoID7VwRtM

She walked away with him looking nervous , no struggle , no screaming , no attempt to escape at all in that video , she was unaware of the dangers she was facing .

You could say a teep kick to his groin could have saved her life . Or had she had a knife , or a lead pipe . pepper spray , or razors tucked away in her mouth .

You can play "what if" all day .

Sorry I know many who have had their wrists grabbed in an attack and I and others have had people Grab shirt,jacket or collars during an attack,so because some never have the experiance,except for Police compliance, does not mean it does not happen in the Real world.

I have been grabbed in conflicts as well , but never by the wrist by someone standing directly in front of me who stood there compliantly .

[BackFistMonkey]

I really agree with JimH here. Also a wrist grab is a good starting point. Hapkido like many other martial arts is taught as a system. Another words you are not going to learn it all over night.
As I said I liked some of what I saw in the first video quite a lot . It was completely out of context but I could see where it applies in real life .

Belive it or not most defense vs. wrist grabs pricipals (Son Mok Soo IMHO) can be aplied vs. a punch and in many other situations.
I would have to see it to believe it . Most of the wrist grab stuff I have seen work only in that context .

It is good for a beginner to have a point of reference. In my school this is one of the beginning points of reference that we give them (defense vs. wrist grab).
It is an excellent drill (wrist grabs) to learn lock flows and escapes . I just believe to many Hapkido schools focus too much on this one small section ( grab my wrist ) of physical conflict .

The second video shown was obviously some sort of testing or grading ... for a BLACK BELT , the entire thing was compliant and based on wrist grabs .

[JTMS]

As I said I liked some of what I saw in the first video quite a lot . It was completely out of context but I could see where it applies in real life .

I would have to see it to believe it . Most of the wrist grab stuff I have seen work only in that context .




Well sir, based on your comment I would have to say that you have not seen much then (not trying to be rude). Or at least not enough to understand how ho sin sul techniques are connected and a basic principal or technique can work in many many situations.

It takes a little while, but if you stick with most hapkido curriculum long enough you will see many parallels in the techniques as they cross over form different types of attack to another.

[JimH]

Defenses against the grab,be it to the wrist,the chest ,the lapel,the shoulder,are all defendable with similar techniques as the delivery of the punch because the punch on the way in is the same delivery as the grab.
.................................................. ........................
Looking at the video of Carly,do you not believe that at any point she could not have broken away and run?

A kick initiates a confrontation,if it does not work she is in trouble as she has agitated the situation,a pull away or break away if it fails is just an attempt to get away,and will most likely not upset the attacker as a deliberate strike will.
.................................................. .................................................. ..
I was in a fight with a guy who was facing me ,cursing me as I was Bouncing and he shot in and grabbed my left wrist ,with his right hand to pin it to my waist as he attempted to punch with the other hand.
(I was pointing at him with my right hand and arm slightly extended)
I just pivoted around to my left on my left foot,coming parallel with him,facing the same direction as he, and he no longer held me,nor was he in postion to strike me.
As I pivoted my left foot went behind his right leg with a drive/push forward tipping his balance backward,my elbow pushing him back and down.with a strike to the sternum.
.................................................
Another time in a club,while bouncing,I was standing facing away from the bar talking to someone with my left arm at my side bent forearm on the bar.
A patron walked up,on my left side facing my left side profile,acted as if he was going to order,reached with his left hand grabbed my left forearm above the wrist,setting me up for an attempted punch to the side of the head,as soon as he grabbed I stepped slightly forward ,turning into him at angle and regrabbed his arm,taking him down with an arm bar,the punch never hit me,he was laying where I had been standing.

Yes people do go for wrist grabs ,or similar type attacks (maybe grabbing the forearm instead of the wrist) and I know that Aikido,Hapkido,Jujitsu, type techniques,done against a resisting, intent person do indeed work.

[nj_howard]

The second video shown was obviously some sort of testing or grading ... for a BLACK BELT , the entire thing was compliant and based on wrist grabs .
Actually, it wasn't. As the initial post said, this is a sampling of this kwan's techniques. The curriculum demonstrated in that setting includes defenses against many different types of attacks.

Jim and MSM, IMO you're both making very good points, but I fear your recent contributions are running into a wall of preconceptions.

[BackFistMonkey]

Actually, it wasn't. As the initial post said, this is a sampling of this kwan's techniques. The curriculum demonstrated in that setting includes defenses against many different types of attacks.

Jim and MSM, IMO you're both making very good points, but I fear your recent contributions are running into a wall of preconceptions.

So the dude at table taking notes wasn't ... funny it looked like every grading I have seen .

[BackFistMonkey]

Well sir, based on your comment I would have to say that you have not seen much then (not trying to be rude). Or at least not enough to understand how ho sin sul techniques are connected and a basic principal or technique can work in many many situations.

It takes a little while, but if you stick with most hapkido curriculum long enough you will see many parallels in the techniques as they cross over form different types of attack to another.

Maybe you missed where I said that I liked some of what I saw ... but that it was shown completely out of context .


Looking at the video of Carly,do you not believe that at any point she could not have broken away and run?

It looked like she could have .. even without training . She went willingly and without a struggle just looked very nervous and apprehensive .

[nj_howard]

So the dude at table taking notes wasn't ...
Wasn't what?

You're not making much sense.

[JTMS]

You're not making much sense.


uhhhh. I think that is the most obvious statement ever made on MAP lol!

[BackFistMonkey]

Wasn't what?

Taking notes and observing . What do you think he was doing sitting behind the folding card table ?

[Thomas]

The only time I have had my wrist grabbed by someone who really meant to do something was when I was being put in handcuffs .
In the Hapkido schools I have trained in, we have done a lot of "wrist grabs" (same side, cross hand, inverted, etc. etc.) and yes, I think it can look like far too many techniques for a situation that may not occur "all the time". As an instructor though, I like to start with wrist grabs because they are an easy and convenient starting point. Students learn to apply the technqiues, along with the appropriate balance, movement, footwork, pressure, etc to make it work against a relatively compliant partner.

Once they get the hang of it, they should be able to escape wrist grabs, but far more importantly, they should then start learning to apply those same techniques, modified as need be, into other situations. Most of the techniques we use are introduced from wrist grabs defenses... and then applied in other situations.

I think it is basically redundant to point out that nothing I saw I the second video would apply to any real life situation unless they are trying to stop you from pulling a knife or gun from concealment .
In my opinion, the second video shows some of the basic applications to other situations. It also highligts Hapkido's level-of-force options, where he moves from striking (various levels, open and closed hand) to breakaways and locks and throws, as well as demonstrating defensive postures (moving offline etc.) as well as manipulating distance.

The first video is a mystery to me ... I see them doing things , some of which I liked a whole lot ... but none of it makes much sense in terms of fighting or self defense .

I like the first one personally - GM Lim is showing the proper mechanics of the arm, the hips, the movement, etc. In essence, he is introducing all the "little details" that will make the technique work. Just like when you teach someone to throw a punch, you don't just throw them onto the floor in a full contact match and hope they learn how to punch. You probably spend a bit of time showing them how to make a fist, how to throw it, how to use the body,where to target, how to move, how to set up the next step and so on....


That all being said ... I guess it wasn't bad , if you like to play pretend .
There are schools that "play pretend" but also at some level, you need a certain level of pretend and compliance to introduce skills, much as I mentioned above in punching. Students who learn to punch generally start off punching the air (pretend), then focus mitts or bags (pretend), then a partner who goes slow with them and works some drills (compliant, eventually moving up to more and more resistance.

There are some schools that never progress beyond compliance, but there are others that do.


It is not hard to get compliant training looking good on video .
True - that's why it's better to check out a school's training in person in a class before deciding how much or little compliant non-alive training they do. In the video clips above, the first one is an introductory clip on basic mechanics and the second looks like a basic level demonstration with a compliant partner. I doubt that's all they do though.

[BackFistMonkey]

In the Hapkido schools I have trained in, we have done a lot of "wrist grabs" (same side, cross hand, inverted, etc. etc.) and yes, I think it can look like far too many techniques for a situation that may not occur "all the time". As an instructor though, I like to start with wrist grabs because they are an easy and convenient starting point. Students learn to apply the technqiues, along with the appropriate balance, movement, footwork, pressure, etc to make it work against a relatively compliant partner.

Once they get the hang of it, they should be able to escape wrist grabs, but far more importantly, they should then start learning to apply those same techniques, modified as need be, into other situations. Most of the techniques we use are introduced from wrist grabs defenses... and then applied in other situations.


In my opinion, the second video shows some of the basic applications to other situations. It also highligts Hapkido's level-of-force options, where he moves from striking (various levels, open and closed hand) to breakaways and locks and throws, as well as demonstrating defensive postures (moving offline etc.) as well as manipulating distance.



I like the first one personally - GM Lim is showing the proper mechanics of the arm, the hips, the movement, etc. In essence, he is introducing all the "little details" that will make the technique work. Just like when you teach someone to throw a punch, you don't just throw them onto the floor in a full contact match and hope they learn how to punch. You probably spend a bit of time showing them how to make a fist, how to throw it, how to use the body,where to target, how to move, how to set up the next step and so on....



There are schools that "play pretend" but also at some level, you need a certain level of pretend and compliance to introduce skills, much as I mentioned above in punching. Students who learn to punch generally start off punching the air (pretend), then focus mitts or bags (pretend), then a partner who goes slow with them and works some drills (compliant, eventually moving up to more and more resistance.

There are some schools that never progress beyond compliance, but there are others that do.



True - that's why it's better to check out a school's training in person in a class before deciding how much or little compliant non-alive training they do. In the video clips above, the first one is an introductory clip on basic mechanics and the second looks like a basic level demonstration with a compliant partner. I doubt that's all they do though.

Well that makes sense , thank you for your time and honesty Thomas . My expirence ( for the most part ) in Hapkido have been almost purely of the bolded type of school .

My thing is that I constantly see compliant training and nothing other than that except for the occasional ProHapkido or Sport JJ tourny with Hapkido guys in it . I know some schools must train their students correctly ... but it seems to be a minority .

[8-step4u]

I believe that most ways of training can be beneficial. With MA you need to understand the fight in the system that you are taking and try to utilize what is being taught.

[Alain]

I'll share a little about wrist grab techniques. The curriculum I teach is based on the KHF curriculum as I learned it in Korea. (With some modifications and add ons based on other training and experience) I teach 30 hoshinsul techniques to white belts. These are the same that were taught in Korea. All of them are from a wrist grab. I tell my students the same thing my instructor in Korea told me - learn these very good and later it will be easy.

Once you can perform a joint lock properly from a wrist grab, you can apply it in different situations with very little modification. In the curriculum I teach, the same locks come back around from different attacks and grabs.

I take the same approach when teaching in my dvds. I often teach the technique from a wrist grab first, because it is a good basic starting point to learn from. Then I go into variations of the lock from different attacks and situations.

I also point out that you don't necesarrily use locks in the middle of a fight. When punches are coming in on you, you need to keep from getting hit and hit back. However, a lot of situations are not full blown fights. Many times someone does grab you in some way or another, or puts their finger or hand on your chest to back you up, etc. In those situations, locks can be very effective if you put them on with speed, surprise, and correct technique.

Locks are techniques of opportunity. When the opportunity is there, and you apply them with speed, surprise, and correct technique, they can be very valuable. They are not the be all and end all though. That's why we learn all the other skills as well. (They are one of my favorite areas of Hapkido study though, and that's why I like doing the joint lock dvds and seminars)

Here's another interesting point about the curriculum I teach. I said that as a white belt all the techniques are from a wrist grab. That is the last time you do same side wrist grab techniques... Untill first degree black belt. Guess what? At black belt level you go back and learn a whole bunch more from the same side wrist grab. Learn the basics of the locks, and then move on to doing them in different situations....

Yours in Training,

Alain

www.burrese.com
www.aikiproductions.com

[nj_howard]

...you don't necesarrily use locks in the middle of a fight. When punches are coming in on you, you need to keep from getting hit and hit back...

...Locks are techniques of opportunity. When the opportunity is there, and you apply them with speed, surprise, and correct technique, they can be very valuable. They are not the be all and end all though. That's why we learn all the other skills as well.
Thank you, sir, for pointing that out. You, and the others of us who have invested significant time training in sound Hapkido, definitely know that.

On the other hand, it sure seems that a fair number of people who criticize wrist locks think that us Hapkido guys don't know any other techniques, don't know how to strike, how to parry / redirect incoming strikes, etc... some seem to think that we only know how to execute wristlocks from same-side wrist grabs... and that we think that good fighters who are trying to punch us will lunge at us and leave their punching arms extended for an eternity, so we can get a wrist lock on them.

As I tried to point out above, wristlocks are just one element of the curriculum that this clip is based on. The Jungkikwan curriculum is based on principles that involve unbalancing the attacker and taking his center. Sometimes the principles are applied through wristlocks. Many times they are applied through other techniques. At higher levels the principles can be applied through softer hand and arm manipulations that aren't technically locks, but are very effective at unbalancing the attacker severely. The principles are practiced against quite a variety of grabs, holds and other attacks, including boxing-style punches and knife attacks. It just happens that those principles are often best introduced via wrist grabs.

Thanks again for your insight.