Lau Gar Video Thread

[Banditshaw]

I've searched on Youtube and all through this forum as much as I can.
Can some of the UK Lau Gar players on this forum post some working links to some apps, forms, etc. on here if possible. The BKFA Site has nothing up either.

It would be cool to see some stuff since not much is available on the net.

Maybe Su Lin could make a resource of just UK Lau Gar videos.

It would be nice to discuss with you UK Lau Gar players and know a little of what's out there.

I did find this though.......it might be old news but t's the first I've seen.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk1Cx6J1VQ8
Any Comments?




Peace.

[jmd161]

Hmmm,


Through your link on YouTube I was able to find these.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZMrDqLMbSs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJgvtsv9lc


Can any of the UK Lau Gar people confirm, if this is indeed UK Lau Gar?


If this is indeed UK Lau Gar, I'd say it's safe to say it has nothing in common with Lau Gar Kuen, other than maybe being linear. The bow/salute is nothing alike and the bow/salute in those vids kinda bother me.

The bow is done to one side which is the right in both movements, i've never seen anything like that before. Usually a bow/salute is towards the front or done to the left, right, and center.


jeff:)

[jmd161]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk1Cx6J1VQ8
Any Comments?




Peace.


There was no intent what so ever in the performance. The movements were rushed and done kinda half assed. Might not have been intended to be posted on the internet?!?!?!


jeff:)

[Banditshaw]

There was no intent what so ever in the performance. The movements were rushed and done kinda half assed. Might not have been intended to be posted on the internet?!?!?!



jeff:)


That's what I thought as well......no intent whatsoever.

[jmd161]

Before anyone has anything to say about where's your vids of Black Tiger?


Here is a vid of our longrange Golden Buddha form known as Kam Kong Kune.


Sil Lum Hak Fu Mun (Shaolin Black Tiger) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg2aKZnaC00)


This was filmed during a walk thru, plus it has been edited, it's not the entire form. But you can see the techniques and how long Black Tiger forms are.


jeff:)

[Banditshaw]

UK Lau Gar must be from a different lineage than the famous southern Lau family. There is none of the normal southern flavor or characteristics within any of those forms. Plus from what I've heard Lau is supposed to be a Tiger based style.



jeff:)



There was a link I posted a while back on the lau gar vids thread of some Guangdong Lau Gar...it definitely had the five families flavour...too bad the user took it off youtube. I think Tartovski saw that as well cos I sent it to him....I lost it out of my file.

[jmd161]

Wow! I would have liked to see that...chances are if it was Canton (Guangdong) it might have been from the actual Lau family.


jeff:)

[Banditshaw]

Before anyone has anything to say about where's your vids of Black Tiger?


Here is a vid of our longrange Golden Buddha form known as Kam Kong Kune.


Sil Lum Hak Fu Mun (Shaolin Black Tiger) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg2aKZnaC00)


This was filmed during a walk thru, plus it has been edited, it's not the entire form. But you can see the techniques and how long Black Tiger forms are.


jeff:)



Thanks Jeff I really enjoyed that. I love the long arm techniques employed and the footwork involved too. Your right, there are a lot of similarities between Hung and Hak Fu Mun...maybe somw Lama o` Fut Gab as weln.

[j/d161]

There is this o|e also,bthe Lau`Gar sta`ts at 1(00 min +nto thervid.

H[URL=htfp://wwwlyoutube~com/watch?v=rgLKTXrsjN0Mhttp://gww.youtebe.com/gatch?v=`gLITXrshN0[/URLM


xeff:)

[jmd161]

Thanks Jeff I really enjoyed that. I love the long arm techniques employed and the footwork involved too. Your right, there are a lot of similarities between Hung and Hak Fu Mun...maybe some Lama or Fut Gar as well.


How did I miss this post?


Yeah there is a Lama influence on Hak Fu Mun as well. I would like to study Fut Gar a lil more, I saw a lil in Boston's Chinatown, but not enough to see it's influence on Hak Fu Mun. I was able to see it's influence on Hung Fut, though. I tried to learn the Fut Ga, but the sifu wanted to make me learn his lineage of Hung Gar first. I might be moving back to Beantown, so let's see what happens...


jeff:)

[Tartovski]

AFAIK there are 3 chinese Lau Gar vids on the net; All are of the same guy. The one that starts 1 min in, The "Five Animals" one (where he wears a red top?), And one weapon form:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9CODLID6BI&mode=related&search=

Of the UK Videos, there are a few more, and I think you've posted them all apart from these:

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/j.kelly627/videos/
(Scottish Club)

http://www.nccma.co.uk/videos.htm
(which is BKFA stuff, but sadly not complete videos)

[Su lin]

There aren't many examples on UK Lau on the net and those that there are have caused many a heated debate.

[Su lin]

I've searched on Youtube and all through this forum as much as I can.
Can some of the UK Lau Gar players on this forum post some working links to some apps, forms, etc. on here if possible. The BKFA Site has nothing up either.

It would be cool to see some stuff since not much is available on the net.

Maybe Su Lin could make a resource of just UK Lau Gar videos.

It would be nice to discuss with you UK Lau Gar players and know a little of what's out there.

I did find this though.......it might be old news but t's the first I've seen.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kk1Cx6J1VQ8
Any Comments?




Peace.

There is a resource for Kung Fu videos already,not sure Lau needs another thread to be honest. There aren't actually that many videos around and as discussed already in previous threads they arent all of particularly great quality.

[Tartovski]

However, they are of suitable quality as a way of comparing it to the mainland style...

[jmd161]

However, they are of suitable quality as a way of comparing it to the mainland style...


Yeah they are, and no there is no relationship between mainland Lau Gar and UK Lau Gar. By looking at the vids of UK Lau Gar the Southern flavor and characteristics just aren't there.

If they are related????


I'd say someone learned a few movements or a buch of part forms and then tried to fill in gaps. Which could also explain why UK lau Gar looks so different.

Then there's the fack that Jeremy Yau, could be a fake! There where many Chinese people that had little or no kung fu training that got rich or made good money off the public wanting to learn Kung Fu. Many had no clue what kung fu should look like or move, so it wouldn't be hard to fool the public.

jeff:)

[Su lin]

Ok ,since you all asked so nicely!

I will merge threads and do some tidying :)

[Su lin]

Done and done

Enjoy :)

(I may even get round to posting one up at some point :D)


Please can we keep it to Lau Gar and related vids and NOT Lau Gar Hung Gar form :)

[Su lin]

This is my final warning.

I have yet again had to split this thread because exactly the same debate has started again.

May I remind you that I will not have this happening again.If it does I am going to start deleting rather than moving threads and taking action. I realise that things do go off topic and return again in time, but I will not be ignored again. There are plenty of threads where this debate is going on.Discuss it there,please.

http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1186394#post1186394
I advise you ALL to read this.

[Bassmonkey]

Hmmm,


Through your link on YouTube I was able to find these.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZMrDqLMbSs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJgvtsv9lc




Cant believe i missed these! Sorry if anyone is a member of this club, but the first link of kay boon sau fa was so bad i almost broke the tos on swearing. Maybe its because i have practiced it so much.......but dear god!

As for the 2nd link, i have never seen far kuin done in person, but the it didnt seem....snappy, or accurate enough. Didnt seem to know what they were doing with the hands.

[Bassmonkey]

Sorry su.

Missed the above post by you also and therefore missed the link.

You can delete my previous post if you like.

Was interesting to see some videos though, kind of gives you the kick in the bum to train harder and perfect your technique!

[laugarfist]

http://www.nccma.co.uk/videos.htm
(which is BKFA stuff, but sadly not complete videos)

Not wishing to start an argument between BKFA/non-BKFA but these are the better vids to use as comparison even though they are only short.

I say this as Master Yau introduced Lau Gar to this country and as far as I know taught all of the higher up lau gar teachers including the ones that have now left the BKFA.

Don't :woo: me Su Lin but in response to the one who suggested Mater Yau is a fake... For all I know he may be claiming a lineage that is not his (but I do not believe him to be). His kung fu is very real and he is very skilled.

[Su lin]

I wont :woo: you (not yet anyway!:D)

I agree that the vids from those guys are of decent quality,even though they arent the full forms.

I also agree that Master Yau's Kung Fu looks very real and he looks to be a very skilled man too.

[SteelyPhil]

Hmmm,


Through your link on YouTube I was able to find these.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZMrDqLMbSs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJgvtsv9lc



I love the music to these 2.

[jmd161]

Never meant to imply that he is a fake, it's just something I alluded to. That there were known, so called masters that did this. UK Lau Gar seems to have a large following, is this do to a lack of other CMA styles in the UK?





jeff:)

[Su lin]

I think it was more a case of Master Yau bringing kung fu over here when it wasn't so popular maybe. There are many kung fu styles and clubs in the uk,Lau just seems to have caught on ,Master Yau must have just tapped into something that proved to be popular in the UK.

[laugarfist]

Never meant to imply that he is a fake, it's just something I alluded to. That there were known, so called masters that did this. UK Lau Gar seems to have a large following, is this do to a lack of other CMA styles in the UK?

jeff:)

Ah right, I don't get to wound up on message boards as meaning is often so hard to get accross clearly. And there are still well known masters who do this. Though more nowadays they seem to have a history, and skill, but are more content just to take money and give nothing of value in return.

Now there is a proliferation of Chinese martial arts in the UK but when Master Yau started he was one of the few and has managed to build one of the largest kung fu associations in the country. I think a part of this is due to the quality and standards put into place by the BKFA. For example no one in the bkfa can grade above brown sash unless they do it with Master Yau in Birmingham. And the black sash test seems to be getting harder all the time, ask Lau Guardian for the latest pass rates.

Add to that the fairly new Guardian structure and Lau Gar stands to remain of good quality evan after master Yau.

[Su lin]

Ok so back to the vids............. :)

[laugarfist]

Wow moderating us lot must be like hearding cats :D

I don't think there are many more vids out there.

I think its related to the topic to mention that the BKFA lau gar syllabus is copyrighted which may explain somewhat why there are not more vids. The syllabus is master Yau's so it is up to him what videos are produced for teaching. Still, that should not stop people doing clips of their forms etc?

Maybe I'll get the time to do a couple next week but don't hold your breath.

[fizz-lau]

re 1st clip he needs to get some life in to him, not snappy enough , not enough impulsion , far to weak looking imo :D

[Su lin]

I split this thread from where the discussion on the copyright etc begins.I think that is a perfectly valid debate, but one which should have its own thread rather than sidetracking this resource video thread. :)

[WotEvaYuKanDo]

http://www.ulinkx.com/video/362904

[laugarfist]

Yep as far as I know (and I know nothing about Hung Gar) that is the Dung Family version.

Cool form, it is one of those that I have learned and not practiced. :p

[Su lin]

I thought this was a Lau Gar video thread? ;)

[laugarfist]

I thought this was a Lau Gar video thread? ;)

A ha. Sneeky ain't we! :D

That is the Tiger Crane form that we do in the BKFA and while not on the Lau Gar syllabus is still taught and known (at least some what) by most of the guardians and higher grades.

It's a bit like the 5 animals form. Its their but again not a part of the official syllabus.

[Su lin]

Is it unique to the BKFA or been taken from another style completely?


Them pesky BKFA'ers! :p

[CFT]

I have read that one of the Lau Gar Guardians took the Tiger Crane form from Hung Gar and played it with a Lau Gar flavour. This is what the video should be demonstrating. This is actually an interesting point - the fact that there is a distinct signature to UK Lau Gar - which means that there is direction/systemisation of the style.

[Jamesm]

It would be interesting to see how they differ, and what Lau Gar "flavour" has been added.

[Su lin]

Cheese and onion flavour I am hoping :D


Seriously though,is it only seen by the Guardians and high ranking BKFA people?

[Banditshaw]

Well it is pretty much the same sequence of moves as the Hung Style. But the way it's played has no Hung flavour at all. No power in the hands and the footwork is to be desired. Basically interpretive dance emulating the classic form. It's not the first time that form has been butchered in such fashion. Sorry to come across as harsh but that's MY take on it. That is what happens when instructors teach a form from a style and don't understand the basic mechanics of said forms style.

[Su lin]

I'm just not quite understanding why it has been added to Lau Gar tbh and agree with Bandit in that to take a form from another style more or less wholesale without studying the other style just seems a bit odd tbh.

[laugarfist]

"Seriously though,is it only seen by the Guardians and high ranking BKFA people?"

No, you can learn it at any time.

"I'm just not quite understanding why it has been added to Lau Gar tbh and agree with Bandit in that to take a form from another style more or less wholesale without studying the other style just seems a bit odd tbh."

Not nessesarily added to Lau Gar. I actually said: "That is the Tiger Crane form that we do in the BKFA and while not on the Lau Gar syllabus is still taught and known (at least some what) by most of the guardians and higher grades."

It is the British Kung Fu Association, not the British Lau Gar Association so it figures we do more than just Lau Gar. As I have also said it is not the Hung family version of Tiger Crane.

Lauguardian probably knows more about it than I tbh.

[Banditshaw]

Well I also find it amusing that on the Lau Gar Video thread someone posts another styles form. Where are the Lau Gar forms? It's becoming apparent that no one wants to post them.
Speaking for myself, I'm not intending to slam anyones style or form. I am just curious to see some quality UK Lau Gar clips to get an overall gist of the style.

[Su lin]

I inadvertently started a whole new debate, oops! :o But yeah, I would rather this was kept to Lau Gar forms tbh .

[Banditshaw]

It's allright Su, as long as you can corral us back to the stable when we go too far out to pasture......

[Jamesm]

It is the British Kung Fu Association, not the British Lau Gar Association so it figures we do more than just Lau Gar.
This, to me is a very moot point that probably needs a proper debate in the lau gar lineage thread.

[Su lin]

Go on then Mr M! Or maybe we should start a Lau Gar Moot Point thread! :p

[Jamesm]

I think it would blow the MAP server!

[Qasim]

Nothing like it, UK Lau has to come from another Lau family or Jeremy Lau might be a fake, if he claims the same lineage as Canton Lau. The Canton Lau looks like what you would expect Lau Gar to look like.


jeff:)

Ok, humor the CMA newbie, what is UK Lau Gar?

[Su lin]

There's a thread on it somewhere in the Kung Fu forum.:) In fact, there are many many threads on it in the kf forum :D

[Qasim]

There's a thread on it somewhere in the Kung Fu forum.:) In fact, there are many many threads on it in the kf forum :D

Show me, show me!

BTW you're signature line shows that you've never been to Korea during Monsoon season. :D

[Bassmonkey]

Have found these, pretty sure they havent been posted as yet..... im shamed to say they look sloppy: (and its not my club by the way)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZMrDqLMbSs

This is the same guy and club but has: Far Kuin, Fai Loong Gee, Lau Gar Luk Hup Kuin, Bac Pye Jurn:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJgvtsv9lc

I have not yet seen these done in person (small class) but they all seem to lack.....well energy to them!

The guy seems to take more time with these. according to the description its all for a training dvd!!! :confused: :bang: :confused: :bang:

[laugarfist]

Have found these, pretty sure they havent been posted as yet..... im shamed to say they look sloppy: (and its not my club by the way)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZMrDqLMbSs

This is the same guy and club but has: Far Kuin, Fai Loong Gee, Lau Gar Luk Hup Kuin, Bac Pye Jurn:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJgvtsv9lc

I have not yet seen these done in person (small class) but they all seem to lack.....well energy to them!

The guy seems to take more time with these. according to the description its all for a training dvd!!! :confused: :bang: :confused: :bang:


I've seen these before and each time words just fail me to describe how bad they are.

I would say no offence meant (and it isn't) but I'm sure someone will take it.

[Cathain]

Yep, these videos have done the rounds before.
I can only really comment on the Kay Boon Sau Fa, but it looks poor even by my standards. The atmospheric background music doesn't manage to lend it anymore cred.

[jmd161]

I really don't know what to say of those video clips...


jeff:)

[Banditshaw]

The very reason why YOUTUBE is a blessing and a curse at the same time.

The instructors of those students should be whipped repeatedly for letting them post those examples. :(

[laugarfist]

I think those clips were of the instructors...

[Su lin]

Ah yeah they have been posted loads and discussed loads before ,they really aren't good examples and yes I believe they are mainly the instructor. :(

[Banditshaw]

LOL At first glance the guy doing the form looks like the guy in the Office Tv Series.....

[Qasim]

I really don't know what to say of those video clips...


jeff:)

Sure you do, just say it!!! :D

[Bassmonkey]

Ah yeah they have been posted loads and discussed loads before ,they really aren't good examples and yes I believe they are mainly the instructor. :(

Does the man know no shame!!!!!!

[Su lin]

Obviously not.

[laugarfist]

Here is a video clip of Lau Gar Luk Hap Kuen (right) and Bac Pye Jurn (Left) being demonstrated yesterday at the BKFA National Championships by the Lau Gar demonstration team. I have a clip of some weapon forms as well which I will upload to youtube soon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnuKNIMmImk

There was Master Yau's son doing Fai Long Gee (sp?) at the same time but I could only get two of them in the frame.

[Cathain]

Great stuff, I'll watch it when I get home this evening

[laugarfist]

Clive Thompson doing a spear form. Not sure if it was a Lau Gar one but will find out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kbh2PtWum7o

[Su lin]

Nice stuff there LGF! Was good to see the Lau Gar LHK done there,it's driving me mad at the moment.Were those 2 from your club?

[Tartovski]

Here is a video clip of Lau Gar Luk Hap Kuen (right) and Bac Pye Jurn (Left) being demonstrated yesterday at the BKFA National Championships by the Lau Gar demonstration team. I have a clip of some weapon forms as well which I will upload to youtube soon.

Cool! finally some reasonable footage of BKFA forms. I must say that compared to us LGLHK looks almost identical, but BPJ seems to have morphed some moves from how we do it. especially the stomping movements at abut 20secs - we remain staic for those arm movements and near the end (32secs in) where the blocks are really low, ours (and other clubs i've seen) are high blocks, similar to the start.

[laugarfist]

I wish. No, those are two of the Lau Gar Demonstraion team.

[laugarfist]

Cool! finally some reasonable footage of BKFA forms.

If anyone wants better I am open to donations towards a better camcorder :D

[Su lin]

I'm saying nothing about the background music :D

[Tartovski]

There's music? I think i blocked that out - normally wise I find.

So LGF : Any idea why the differences are there? Since both our club and the OSA split years ago from them, and both do the end blocks high, I think it's reasonable to assume that the blocks were changed after we left... any thoughts as to why Master Yau Adapted it that way?

[laugarfist]

There's music? I think i blocked that out - normally wise I find.

So LGF : Any idea why the differences are there? Since both our club and the OSA split years ago from them, and both do the end blocks high, I think it's reasonable to assume that the blocks were changed after we left... any thoughts as to why Master Yau Adapted it that way?

No idea. Doesn't look low to me but then I've always done it that way. Do you have a clip of how you do it so that I can compare?

[Tartovski]

Compare it to this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJgvtsv9lc

The blocks after the last kick (3:25 secs in) are definatley covering the body. Where as in the BKFA one (0.32secs in), they are much lower.

[laugarfist]

Still no idea. When did your club split off?

[Tartovski]

Kevin Brewerton split in 1987 I think, no idea about the OSA guys.

I see from your website that you've been training 10 years? That might explain it.

[laugarfist]

There was Master Yau's son doing Fai Long Gee (sp?) at the same time but I could only get two of them in the frame.

My bad. That wasn't master Yau's son at all. I got confused :confused:

[laugarfist]

Kevin Brewerton split in 1987 I think, no idea about the OSA guys.

I see from your website that you've been training 10 years? That might explain it.

I started in 1994 and am assured that Bak Pai Jurn has always been performed that way. Even my first Sifu used to perform it like this and he split off from the BKFA in the 80's.

Perhaps someone else has changed it ;)

[Tartovski]

I started in 1994 and am assured that Bak Pai Jurn has always been performed that way. Even my first Sifu used to perform it like this and he split off from the BKFA in the 80's.

Perhaps someone else has changed it ;)

It could be a north/south thing? Kevin was trained by Neville Wray, as was humphrey broome. And I'm pretty sure (though it's been awhile since I've seen Humphrey's lot perform it) they all did it with the blocks high at the end.

[Adinho]

Humphrey broome. And I'm pretty sure (though it's been awhile since I've seen Humphrey's lot perform it) they all did it with the blocks high at the end.

Well this is my first post and a controversial one at that but here goes when I trained with humphrey back in the day it has always been low block in BPJ but since he left the bkfa I am not to sure what he does now I havent trained in lau gar for a long time. There is no lau gar in brazil pity but soon I might be out of here whoppie

[Tartovski]

Can I ask when "back in the day" was for you? Might shed some light if we have a timeline.

It's all anecodotal anyway, but it is interesting.

[Adinho]

Can I ask when "back in the day" was for you? Might shed some light if we have a timeline.

It's all anecodotal anyway, but it is interesting.

from 1979 to 1992

[Tartovski]

blimey, very old school then. You must have been there when Master Yau made the additions to the forms/modified the syllabus in the 80's then?

Be fascinating to hear what you can remember... Where abouts did you train? I trained with Kevin Brewerton, but didn't start til about 1992.

[Adinho]

blimey, very old school then. You must have been there when Master Yau made the additions to the forms/modified the syllabus in the 80's then?

Be fascinating to hear what you can remember... Where abouts did you train? I trained with Kevin Brewerton, but didn't start til about 1992.


I trained with Humphrey like i said back in the day and yeah I can remember it all But there really is not point in discussing as I am not qualified You really should talk to one of the guardians as they really are in the know.

Check this out
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qY4tocGW15Q
outstanding capabilities

[laugarfist]

That is my Sifu doing the hitting and yes, it is horrible when he hits you like that.

[Banditshaw]

Ok nice short power, but did the guy who got hit have to over dramatize it like that :rolleyes:

It was a joke right?

[Adinho]

Ok nice short power, but did the guy who got hit have to over dramatize it like that :rolleyes:

It was a joke right?

Actually it was not a joke A friend of mine was there. This guy in question does full contact. And my friend who was there, who is big guy had it done on him and he ended on all fours with the pure power of that punch. If you understand fa jing you would understand the concepts.

Look at him after the punch where his diaphragm was put into spasm he could not breath and the instructor hit on conception vessel to take the spasm away.

oh dear here we again :p

[laugarfist]

Unfortunately I can't recognise the guy getting hit so I can't comment on him personally but most people seeem to fold like that to one of those strikes.

[Bassmonkey]

Booo The BKFA National videos have been removed :(

Any idea if they will be put back up LGF?

[laugarfist]

It was suggested I take them down. I will be able to do some clips of part of the forms though but not whole ones.

I try to avoid politics sigh.

[Banditshaw]

Actually it was not a joke A friend of mine was there. This guy in question does full contact. And my friend who was there, who is big guy had it done on him and he ended on all fours with the pure power of that punch. If you understand fa jing you would understand the concepts.

Look at him after the punch where his diaphragm was put into spasm he could not breath and the instructor hit on conception vessel to take the spasm away.

oh dear here we again :p


Well if you read my post I said ........

Originally Posted by Banditshaw
Ok nice short power

I saw the power in the punch. But not enough to convince me that those movements by the guy holding the pad were warranted. Especially in that much of an overly dramatic fashion.

Tell dude to keep his day job.
Leave acting to the pros.... :D

Now this is what confuses me....


Look at him after the punch where his diaphragm was put into spasm he could not breath and the instructor hit on conception vessel to take the spasm away.




:confused: :confused:




Whaaatttttt?

please enlighten the board how this is acheived?

[Bassmonkey]

LGF, that would be awesome, i really wanted to go but didnt have the dough (ha ha that rhymed!....i am SO alone :D ) Would it be possible for you to email me the videos at all?

Pretty please Mr Lau Gar Fist Sir :D :D

[Adinho]

:confused: :confused:




Whaaatttttt?

please enlighten the board how this is acheived?


If you have any understanding in traditional chinese medicine you would understand, I would of thought you would have covered this as you are learning a traditional style like hung gar.

The strike delivered is also known as sealing the breath or a symptom of it. The action of the palm strike hits the diaphragm that stops the spasm then running the palm up then down on the conception vessel runs the energy down to the Dante. I am not to sure how it works it just does.


And ask nicer next time and you might get a bit more information from the people who study this stuff in detail. :p

[laugarfist]

Well if you read my post I said ........



I saw the power in the punch. But not enough to convince me that those movements by the guy holding the pad were warranted. Especially in that much of an overly dramatic fashion.

Tell dude to keep his day job.
Leave acting to the pros.... :D

Now this is what confuses me....





:confused: :confused:




Whaaatttttt?

please enlighten the board how this is acheived?

Ask Lau Guardian, he is the one doing the strike and one of the most qualified to answer.

[2step]

i started my martial arts in lau gar, some of the sets shown in these videos are very poorly performed and overdramatised. the way i was taught to practise these sets was to imagine you were fighting a real opponent and keep the movements tight and controlled. nobody needs flowery punches. and yes i know i've talked the talk but not not walked the walk my club is currently setting up its own website with videos of some of the sets when its up and ruuning i wiil let you all know.

[Banditshaw]

If you have any understanding in traditional chinese medicine you would understand, I would of thought you would have covered this as you are learning a traditional style like hung gar.

I actually know very little besides some standard Dit Da massage and the like.
We focus on fighting and conditioning. We normally don't ''cover'' this till much later, if at all. Depends on the student and what they are interested in.
However I see very little TCM on display in the clip.
The strike delivered is also known as sealing the breath or a symptom of it. The action of the palm strike hits the diaphragm that stops the spasm then running the palm up then down on the conception vessel runs the energy down to the Dante. I am not to sure how it works it just does.


The thing is, in the clip he hits the pad not the body......
The palm slap to the diaphragm I see but not enough to convince me that it was a valid pressure strike.
Also I think you mean Dan tien.
Dante would be incorrect.
Your not sure how it works yet you make statements like you do. :confused: And ask nicer next time and you might get a bit more information from the people who study this stuff in detail. :p

who am I supposed to ask?
Not you surely...... ;)




No disrespect to the Instructors. I realise sometimes things are played up a bit when it comes to video. No big deal.

If someone can explain what is going on with confidence, I would be interested.

[Tartovski]

i started my martial arts in lau gar, some of the sets shown in these videos are very poorly performed and overdramatised. the way i was taught to practise these sets was to imagine you were fighting a real opponent and keep the movements tight and controlled. nobody needs flowery punches. and yes i know i've talked the talk but not not walked the walk my club is currently setting up its own website with videos of some of the sets when its up and ruuning i wiil let you all know.

Be interesting to see more LG forms on the net - let us know when the videos are up.

Sadly it seems the BKFA have zero interest in sharing videos of any of their forms. Did they give a reason to you laugarfist as to why you should take them down? I'd have thought showing BKFA forms would be a great advertisement to them...

[Tartovski]

I trained with Humphrey like i said back in the day and yeah I can remember it all But there really is not point in discussing as I am not qualified You really should talk to one of the guardians as they really are in the know.

I think you discussing it would be extremely worth while actually, be nice to get an independant view from back in the day. If you are uncomfortable posting here, send me a private message - i'd be facinated to hear what you have to say about the development of the syllabus.

[Su lin]

While I understand completely that Adinho may not be comfortable discussing things here, I just need to remind you of the tos and inviting outside contact:
1.3 Inviting outside Contact:
"Inviting" is termed as a post where you invite other members to contact you to find out more information, rather than post it in the forum. This is not allowed and any posts with emails or invitations to contact for more information will either be edited or deleted entirely.

[Tartovski]

"Inviting" is termed as a post where you invite other members to contact you to find out more information, rather than post it in the forum. This is not allowed and any posts with emails or invitations to contact for more information will either be edited or deleted entirely.

Um. I haven't done that? That seems to apply to where I (as the poster) am inviting people to contact me for info, presumably via external emails.

I've simply asked someone to PM me. Surely that isn't a TOS breach? Otherwise what on earth is the point of the PM function? You can use it, but you can't ask someone to use it...

[herbert]

Be interesting to see more LG forms on the net - let us know when the videos are up.

Sadly it seems the BKFA have zero interest in sharing videos of any of their forms. Did they give a reason to you laugarfist as to why you should take them down? I'd have thought showing BKFA forms would be a great advertisement to them...

A strange one really, but BKFA have always been reluctant to release any video, especially on the web. Yet are preparing a full set of dvd's with the syllabus up to black.

Master Yau used to say that you should not show video or even sell video/dvd's as you "cannot learn from a video. if you want to learn Lau Gar then go to a recognised instructor who is qualified to teach".

Personally I agree that you cannot learn the subtlties from a video, and I understand that the dvd's are designed to "give guidance in correct form" rather than be for home learning.

I would love to post film of all the Lau Gar forms I know plus the ones i'm working on, but i'd probably get into trouble. That and the fact the rest of you would probably just give up training once you'd seen them done so well! :D :D

[Bassmonkey]

I think that the DVD thing is a 2 edged sword.

On one hand its useful if you are attending classes regularly and you are using them to help you train between lessons (would help if you instructor is BKFA as the DVD's will clearly be BKFA syllubus etc..)

On the other hand if someone just buys them for training without supplementing them with actual training then it probably wont be worth the purchase.

[Su lin]

Um. I haven't done that? That seems to apply to where I (as the poster) am inviting people to contact me for info, presumably via external emails.

I've simply asked someone to PM me. Surely that isn't a TOS breach? Otherwise what on earth is the point of the PM function? You can use it, but you can't ask someone to use it...


I'm not arguing ,I'm just pointing out the tos. I don't see why Adinho should have an issue with posting his experience on the main board.

[herbert]

I think that the DVD thing is a 2 edged sword.

On one hand its useful if you are attending classes regularly and you are using them to help you train between lessons (would help if you instructor is BKFA as the DVD's will clearly be BKFA syllubus etc..)


You walked into a big one there!!!

But i'll let it go. ;)

[Bassmonkey]

ha ha, yeah on reflection and re-reading that.....lets just say someone else got to my keyoard? :D

[Su lin]

A strange one really, but BKFA have always been reluctant to release any video, especially on the web. Yet are preparing a full set of dvd's with the syllabus up to black.

Master Yau used to say that you should not show video or even sell video/dvd's as you "cannot learn from a video. if you want to learn Lau Gar then go to a recognised instructor who is qualified to teach".

Personally I agree that you cannot learn the subtlties from a video, and I understand that the dvd's are designed to "give guidance in correct form" rather than be for home learning.

I would love to post film of all the Lau Gar forms I know plus the ones i'm working on, but i'd probably get into trouble. That and the fact the rest of you would probably just give up training once you'd seen them done so well! :D :D


I can see the point with the DVD thing really, that you shouldn't be learning from them. I can also see that they are quite handy to have as a point of reference,but surely it is better to refer to a teacher than a dvd? Yes it would be interesting to see, but I wouldn't be prepared to pay that for a dvd really.

[Su lin]

ha ha, yeah on reflection and re-reading that.....lets just say someone else got to my keyoard? :D


5 minutes on the "can of worms opening thread" step for you my lad! ;)

[Bassmonkey]

Yes Su, sorry Su. :(

:D

I kind of meant to say what you said.....just erm...well...didnt.

[Su lin]

I didn't see your post till I had posted my post :D

[Su lin]

Thread re-opened.

The debate about Lau Gar in general has been moved here. (http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73980)


I placed this video thread in the Resources section so it could be just that,a resource and discussion about Lau Gar VIDEOS. The general debate now happens at the above thread.Any continuation of that discussion here will be removed.

[Tartovski]

Ok then, can I ask on this thread if LGF was ever given a reason that he can't post full video's of the BKFA forms on the 'net?

and secondly to that - is he now going to post up edited versions? Since the BKFA is the main teacher of Lau Gar in this country, it seems a shame that we can't discuss video's of it because there aren't any!
Well, apart from the ones here we've already covered:

http://www.nccma.co.uk/videos.htm

[laugarfist]

I'll answer any way and Su can beat me later.

I like to check with people if they are happy for me to post clips of them. Some weren't so I took them down (should have checked first) and didn't post the others.

Yes I might be able to do some very short clips when I have the time.

[Tartovski]

I'll answer any way and Su can beat me later.

me too, get in line! ;)

I like to check with people if they are happy for me to post clips of them. Some weren't so I took them down (should have checked first) and didn't post the others.

Ah right. your earlier post of "I try to avoid politics" made it sound like it was a political reason for taking them down, not that individuals had objected. Anyway, be great to see whatever you can post up.
[/QUOTE]

[laugarfist]

sloppy English on my part.

[Tartovski]

Another mainland video here:

5 animal form.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EuCH1AKV6s

Does it look like the UK Lau Gar 5 animals one?

[Tartovski]

Oh, and some random BKFA dude:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIX8GohqAr0

Look closely, you'll see Lau Gar!

[Su lin]

Ahhhh that's Shaolin Pav aka Mr Brightside who got banned recently for multiple accounts! He trains with the BKFA in Birmingham.

[Tartovski]

Oh, right! blimey. small world!
shame he didn't put up full vids.

Speaking of which: Laugarfist, you ever hear back about reposting your vids?

[Su lin]

Aye! I warned and warned him, nice young kid and obviously really into training.
Thoughts on the forms you saw Tart? I think the main difference between the way we do it is our stances tend to be longer and lower, and Finger movement of the Dragon is done way more slowly in our place.

[Tartovski]

Aye! I warned and warned him, nice young kid and obviously really into training.
Thoughts on the forms you saw Tart? I think the main difference between the way we do it is our stances tend to be longer and lower, and Finger movement of the Dragon is done way more slowly in our place.

Have you been copying us? ;)
That is pretty much my thoughts. The FMOTD form in that clip looks "choppy" to me, we do as one flowing movement.

[Su lin]

Ha ha :D Perhaps we have!

Yep we do too, we do it very slowly and the amount of time I have had to spend making it flowing.

[Tartovski]

other thing we do is pause when we pull our guard in on Far Kuen before exploding out into the bridgehands/rolling punch combo. He seems to bounce.

[Tartovski]

Just trying to sort out the camera really. it's a static digital camera with a video mode, not a video camera proper...

I think the image quality is ok, though the blur is bad, as you can see on all the wrist-twisting stuff.

Anyway, enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qP4qLslf1IQ

[Su lin]

Woo hoo at last we see the great Mr T :D

Nice work. Few differences with the way we do it, can't go into it now due to work internet nazis!

Nice to see someone getting into a low stance though!

[CFT]

Nice to see you Mr. T !

Did Su change her post? I thought I'd read that her school didn't let the hands go outside the shoulders. Would make sense to me, if an attack came outside the gates then there is no need to move across.

How does gei boon sau faat feed into the next stage of LG practice (e.g. jorn sau).

[Su lin]

Sorry yes I did mention that but ballsed my post up :D Our hands don't move any further out from the shoulders, we tend to keep it pretty compacted.

[Su lin]

I didn't have you down as a bearded fellow Tart :D

[CFT]

I didn't have you down as a bearded fellow Tart :DCouldn't see a ponytail or sandals though! :p

[Tartovski]

Sorry yes I did mention that but ballsed my post up :D Our hands don't move any further out from the shoulders, we tend to keep it pretty compacted.

Ah fair enough. We do it (or at least i do) to show that you cover the whole area and take an on-target strike outside your own body to block it/move them off balance. ie you wouldn't block something that was outside your body, but you would move something to the outside!

That said, it was all down in a rush, so probably isn't the best example. one thing i noticed is the camera angle makes it look like the strikes are above my head, not inline with it (ie the strikes would be delivered to the opponents face).

The beard is new-ish... not sure about it too much! ;)

[Su lin]

Ahh I see what you mean!


And beards are good! :p Apart from huge big fisherman type ones! :D

[Tartovski]

Actually, rewatching it, my arms are a tad wide!

I guess this is due to me not practising it on my own for ages, but showing others how to do it. (ie i'd much rather someone started going too wide and narrowed it down, rather than the other way and got hit!)

[Fire-quan]

Just trying to sort out the camera really. it's a static digital camera with a video mode, not a video camera proper...

I think the image quality is ok, though the blur is bad, as you can see on all the wrist-twisting stuff.

Anyway, enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qP4qLslf1IQ


That's a good low horse stance you have there Mr. T... and nice hand work too!

Best tip - tidy that god damn room! Then you can dot he rest of the form there too!! :)

[Su lin]

I agree with FQ! (Did I just say that!!!! ;) :p ) about the room!

But yeah,I notice from the other Lau Gar vids we have seen, there aren't many low stances around, especially on our friend Pav's. Anyone who does BKFA Lau go into low horse stance for kbsf?

[Tartovski]

That's a good low horse stance you have there Mr. T... and nice hand work too!

hang on, what's this? Someone has posted a Lau Gar video and it hasn't been slated by all and sundry? Madness!!

But cheers!

Best tip - tidy that god damn room! Then you can dot he rest of the form there too!! :)

UGH. YES MUM! ;)

It's our spare room, so full of stuff (including the PC). Since I was just seeing how the cam worked, i couldn't be arsed moving to a different room. Though since it looked ok, I thought I'd post it up.
Next time I'll make sure i've got a wide space, and i'll do my make up and everything, ok?

[Fire-quan]

hang on, what's this? Someone has posted a Lau Gar video and it hasn't been slated by all and sundry? Madness!!

But cheers!



UGH. YES MUM! ;)

It's our spare room, so full of stuff (including the PC). Since I was just seeing how the cam worked, i couldn't be arsed moving to a different room. Though since it looked ok, I thought I'd post it up.
Next time I'll make sure i've got a wide space, and i'll do my make up and everything, ok?

Good - then come round and tidy my room!

[Tim T]

have posted a draft version of our clubs new Lau Gar promo video in the kungfu video thread. :)

[Bassmonkey]

Anyone who does BKFA Lau go into low horse stance for kbsf?

Ok a little late i know, but i have a reply :)

As a BKFA'er (Hides under desk whilst typing) I can confirm that in my club we have a nice low stance for KBSF.

Our wonderful instructor (please note sarcasm) puts a wooden pole accross our thighs whilst we do it to make sure its low. Idea is to obviously stop the pole from rolling off!

Hope that helps all

C60

[Bassmonkey]

have posted a draft version of our clubs new Lau Gar promo video in the kungfu video thread. :)

Link Please :D

C60

[Su lin]

I just skim read Tim's post as "our clubs new porno video!" :eek: :o

[Tartovski]

You, my dear, have a dirty mind.

Well done!!

[Su lin]

:o What can I say :D Apart from,don't forget I was born and bred in Blackpool! :D

[Tartovski]

Good Lap-dancing clubs there, apparently.

[Bassmonkey]

Hey Tart,

How come your version of KBSF was so quick?

In fact, why is it whenever a video of it does crop up, thats it done really quickly.

Im not in anyway critisising it (or spelling correctly apparently) just curious.

Thanks all

[Tartovski]

Hey Tart,

How come your version of KBSF was so quick?


Like it says, it was just a quick camera test, so pretty rushed. Should probably be a tad slower.
That said though, it is a reasonably quick form. At least, I've always done it (and seen it done) at a fairly swift pace. Bare in mind, quick though that vid is, I could easily do it twice the speed.

[Mr. O]

and if you were in the OSA you could do it at least 700 or 800 times that speed! :D

[Bassmonkey]

Ha ha oh i know it can be done really quickly. I can myself but i try to keep it relativley even pace and smooth.

Cheers tart was just wondering.

[Tartovski]

and if you were in the OSA you could do it at least 700 or 800 times that speed! :D

Lol! They are of course uber ninja's of speed and death...

I'll try and redo a vid of it not rushed when I get the time. TBH though I really want to video JS, just to show my mate who's done WC.

So Mr. O, now you are back, any chance of seeing you doing some forms?

[Su lin]

I found a vid of me doing Finger Movement of the Dragon on the beach last summer.Ewwwwwwwwwwwwww I still have a lot of work to do on it.

[Su lin]

And you had to bring OSA up didn't you! Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, they suck! :p

[Tartovski]

http://www.kungfu-kickboxer.co.uk/martial_arts_videos.php?video_name=Demo_06

BKFA club doing a demo.
I'm assuming the timings of Far Kuen are due to it being a demo, I've never seen long pauses like that before.

Any idea's what the form is that starts at 3.35?? Tiger/Crane?

[laugarfist]

http://www.kungfu-kickboxer.co.uk/martial_arts_videos.php?video_name=Demo_06

BKFA club doing a demo.
I'm assuming the timings of Far Kuen are due to it being a demo, I've never seen long pauses like that before.

Any idea's what the form is that starts at 3.35?? Tiger/Crane?

Yep it looks like the pauses are there for the display.

Tain't Tiger Crane as I know it but it could be a different version. Does look Hung Gar though.

[laugarfist]

Watching the lion dance clip on there reminds me that Northern Dragons have beaten them 3 times in a row. :D

Will this year be the 4th? :yeleyes:

[lauguardian]

it isnt Tiger and crane its a wu shu southern fist form

[Mr. O]

Ha,t hats good. Yeah Far Kuin is for demo puposes there. Good to see the good ol purple stick defence there too!!

[Mr. O]

Lol! They are of course uber ninja's of speed and death...

I'll try and redo a vid of it not rushed when I get the time. TBH though I really want to video JS, just to show my mate who's done WC.

So Mr. O, now you are back, any chance of seeing you doing some forms?

LOL, Amen to that! and for everyone who thought it was lost

The real kay boon sau fa :confused: (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=8100140)

@Tarty, as for vids, possibly, depends on the powers that be really!!

[Tim T]

possibly, depends on the powers that be really!!
lol, what on earth do you mean :D :confused: ;)

[Su lin]

LOL, Amen to that! and for everyone who thought it was lost

The real kay boon sau fa :confused: (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=8100140)

@Tarty, as for vids, possibly, depends on the powers that be really!!



Lol :D The funky music really doesn't make the form any better. :p

[Mr. O]

yeah the funky music that I have stuck in my head!! ARGGGGGGHHHH!

[Su lin]

I didn't have it on for long enough for it to get stuck :D

[Tim T]

Im going to upload the video of Leigh and Tarty doing Fai Long Gee later when i get in, but there will be no funky music unless specifically requested :)

[Su lin]

I Demand Funky Music Timothy! :d

[Tartovski]

Ha,t hats good. Yeah Far Kuin is for demo puposes there. Good to see the good ol purple stick defence there too!!

Do you normally touch the floor with the butterfly opens wings move? Seems they are doing that in the demo, and again, I've not seen that before.

[Mr. O]

Do you normally touch the floor with the butterfly opens wings move? Seems they are doing that in the demo, and again, I've not seen that before.


We have always touched the floor! You're supposed to "bounce" not sit and stop! But you see people stopped because they dont practice Wu Dip Ma enough!

[Su lin]

We sit and stand when doing it too. I find the sitting down and getting up a really good exercise actually and sometimes just continually do that for a while,till I can do it nooooo more :D

[Mr. O]

its good for hip flexibility. Master yau says its used for lowering yourself quickly, I do know some other useless toot about what the stance was used for too!

Good exercise is to sit in it, stand and twist and land in it the other way round, making sure your bum bum is on the flor and you aint cheating sitting on your heel!

I can drop into it anymore because of my knee op, my knee would rip out if I did it quick now :cry:

[Tartovski]

Um, my bad. I meant do you touch the floor with your hands, they seem to be doign that in the demo. Sorry I wasn't clear.
I know you are supposed to touch the floor with your butt...

its good for hip flexibility. Master yau says its used for lowering yourself quickly, I do know some other useless toot about what the stance was used for too!

Go on, tell us more useless toot! Is it the guards position stuff?

[Su lin]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh I seeeeee! :D


No,we don't touch the ground with our hands.




And yes to more useless toot :p

[Mr. O]

Um, my bad. I meant do you touch the floor with your hands, they seem to be doign that in the demo. Sorry I wasn't clear.
I know you are supposed to touch the floor with your butt...



Go on, tell us more useless toot! Is it the guards position stuff?

no, i think they did that under duress rather than because the were meant to!

Ahh, you've heard my useless toot before then about "Warriors seat". Imnot telling you then!

Oh all right then. So the legend goes.....................

The stance was used for guards on night duty, one becasue its quite hard to fall asleep in that position and two (i find this a bit dodgy) they could sit with their swords tucked under their arms (arms folded like in the set). and they could see reflections in the camp fire of anyone a-sneakin up behind em. Then they'd rise up super fast chop the intruder in half and sit back down the other way. Or something like that anyhoo....................

[yeeu kui]

http://www.kungfu-kickboxer.co.uk/martial_arts_videos.php?video_name=Demo_06

BKFA club doing a demo.
I'm assuming the timings of Far Kuen are due to it being a demo, I've never seen long pauses like that before.

Any idea's what the form is that starts at 3.35?? Tiger/Crane?

Who cares. Why does everyone use the WFH theme?
It's been done to death!

was that the Chin Na Doi Chark set performed too?

[Su lin]

Because otherwise they aren't doing the real kung fu :D:D




It does get somewhat tiresome though!

[Chimpcheng]

Who cares. Why does everyone use the WFH theme?
It's been done to death!

Only true, authentic and t3h d34dly kung fu is allowed to use that theme.

Heck, I play it when making sweet, sweet love... :D

[Su lin]

:ban: :ban: :ban:

I sometimes listen to it before I go training. :o

[Chimpcheng]

What? It beats Marvin Gaye... :D

Anyway, stop going off topic you! :woo: :D

[Qasim]

Who cares. Why does everyone use the WFH theme?
It's been done to death!

was that the Chin Na Doi Chark set performed too?

It's inspirational! It can never be done to death. However, it doesn't fit everyone/system. I can't imagine someone doing Tai Chi to this during a demonstration. :saz:

[Su lin]

You expecting Saz to come along and do a tai chi demo to wfh then? :D

[Qasim]

...Heck, I play it when making sweet, sweet love... :D

Oh, you're twisted! :cool:

[Qasim]

You expecting Saz to come along and do a tai chi demo to wfh then? :D

Heavens no! :rolleyes:

[Sub zero]

LOL, Amen to that! and for everyone who thought it was lost

The real kay boon sau fa :confused: (http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=8100140)

@Tarty, as for vids, possibly, depends on the powers that be really!!


Hrm. Does anybody else "wave" at the end of kay boon sau fa? :D
We do a tigers claw to eyes/under jaw. Or is this guy just being rubbish?

Thanks,
Jamie

[Cathain]

Hrm. Does anybody else "wave" at the end of kay boon sau fa? :D
We do a tigers claw to eyes/under jaw. Or is this guy just being rubbish?

Thanks,
Jamie

No, I think the "wave" (a block?) is the way that the BKFA do it.
I think the Fu Jau is a SLG variation, that's my guess anyway.

I thought the same when I first saw it.

[laugarfist]

Fu Jau or wavy hands? Depends what you are doing with it.

Performance wise tends to be wavy with me.

[Sub zero]

No, I think the "wave" (a block?) is the way that the BKFA do it.
I think the Fu Jau is a SLG variation, that's my guess anyway.

I thought the same when I first saw it.

I learned this set long before the split and i don't remember it changing or anybody telling me to change to a tiger claw i've always done it. Maybe it's just a north/south divide thing? or club to club? any of you southerners have any ideas? :D

Thanks,
Jamie

[Cathain]

Fu Jau or wavy hands? Depends what you are doing with it.

Performance wise tends to be wavy with me.

So you learned both ways?
Wavy for performances and Fu Jau for.....?

[Sub zero]

ah thanks laugar fist. So maybe just a personal preference thing. Hey Cathain.Where do you train/who's your instructor?

[Cathain]

Hey Cathain.Where do you train/who's your instructor?

Hi Sub zero, I train under Jim McLeary.
We were based in Motherwell until last week. We're now up at Wishaw.
It's a good club, and we get the opportunity to do a bit of grappling under our assistant instructor fairly regularly too.

Where do you train?

[Sub zero]

Well i use to teach at the dunfermline club and then train at the dundee club for a while at uni. Just got back into MA. Started Back at ju jitsu but haven't gone to my old kung fu club yet.don't even know if it's sitll going :confused:
I remember jim from the instructors seminars but he probably won't remember me. Good instructor you're lucky to be at that club.


Thanks,
Jamie

[Cathain]

Well i use to teach at the dunfermline club and then train at the dundee club for a while at uni. Just got back into MA. Started Back at ju jitsu but haven't gone to my old kung fu club yet.don't even know if it's sitll going :confused:
They are showing classes for both Dundee and Dumfermline on the website, but I don't know how up to date that info is. Our clubs info has been updated fairly recently by the looks of it (within the last few months at least) although it's incorrect as of last week, as mentioned.
Perhaps you could get contact details from the site - http://www.scotlandlaugar.co.uk/Contact/?

I remember jim from the instructors seminars but he probably won't remember me. Good instructor you're lucky to be at that club.


Thanks. I don't really have much previous MA experience (done kickboxing for a while several years back) but the instruction compares very favourably to what I've experienced in the past. I also like how the applications are explained clearly as well. I definitely have no plans of giving up anytime soon. :)

Hope you manage to find something nearby and start back at Lau Gar again.

[Mr. O]

Kay Boon Sau fa.

I tell the kids you're waving bye bye at the person you've just flattened!

It was initially taught as a double punch block (more of a redirection than a full on block, its too weak).

However, we learnt it as an eye rake. Steve burton sghowed me it as a throat breaker, by sticking your thumb around the back of the windpipe and twisting in the same manner! Much more practical IMO!!

[Cathain]

It was initially taught as a double punch block (more of a redirection than a full on block, its too weak).
That's what I suspected.

However, we learnt it as an eye rake.
Ditto. Followed by plucking the eyes out.

Steve burton sghowed me it as a throat breaker, by sticking your thumb around the back of the windpipe and twisting in the same manner! Much more practical IMO!!
Interesting variation :)

[Tim T]

wer taught that the wavy bit it grabbing someones top twisting and pulling, the wave is only symbolic of this movement.

I like the throat breaker idea better though ! :)

[Mr. O]

dunoo where these chaps have popped up from but they are another splinter Lau Group!

Knife Defence (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVdgTkmhWRo)

2nd to 3rd degree duel form stick defence only (somewhat bastardised too) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jW5Ox3iuYLc&feature=related)

[quanto]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfWSHa84sCg

[laugarfist]

It looks like he is trying to fight an invisible dwarf.

[laugarfist]

Just found this on Photobucket

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s265/bonkstral/th_laugarsword.jpg (http://s154.photobucket.com/albums/s265/bonkstral/?action=view&current=laugarsword.flv)

Don't know wo is doing this. They put the emphasis on different bits than I do.

[Tartovski]

It looks like he is trying to fight an invisible dwarf.

I don't normally critisise other forms, mainly as I know the way I do them is different from other here... but I kinda agree. he seems to be blocking/striking very low.

Any idea who it is/what society?

[laugarfist]

I don't normally critisise other forms, mainly as I know the way I do them is different from other here... but I kinda agree. he seems to be blocking/striking very low.

Any idea who it is/what society?

http://www.bcka.org.uk/intro.htm

[Freud > God]

I am so thankful they were not in the BKFA, that Bac Pye Jurn was once again performed to a very bad standard indeed. He has no idea what he wants to do with the techniques, i mean there comes a point where you need to ask yourself would this work? If the answer is NO, then its not rocket science your doing something wrong.

[ndabaningi]

It's easy to be criticial on Internet forums such as MAP and pour scorn on a persons efforts when they know no better. As a riposte I would quite rightly expect somebody to say if you can do better lets see it. That aside and without comment myself on any of the videos shown, I would consider the acid test to be.
If the forms demostrated were shown on either Hong Kong or Chinese TV, what would they make of it. Would there be universal approval and recognition of the skills clearly demonstrated (irrespective of style) or would there be dissapointment.
I think to understand this point you have to travel and see how things should and can be done.

[Freud > God]

It's easy to be criticial on Internet forums such as MAP and pour scorn on a persons efforts when they know no better. As a riposte I would quite rightly expect somebody to say if you can do better lets see it. That aside and without comment myself on any of the videos shown, I would consider the acid test to be.
If the forms demostrated were shown on either Hong Kong or Chinese TV, what would they make of it. Would there be universal approval and recognition of the skills clearly demonstrated (irrespective of style) or would there be dissapointment.
I think to understand this point you have to travel and see how things should and can be done.

dude if that was shown in Hong Kong man they would be so ashamed. An acid test is not needed, we can judge ourselves that form was not good.

[CFT]

It looks like he is trying to fight an invisible dwarf.Lau Gar, or any Southern CMA, should have upright posture! What is going on in that performance?

[ndabaningi]

dude if that was shown in Hong Kong man they would be so ashamed. An acid test is not needed, we can judge ourselves that form was not good.

Quite

[Mr. O]

that bac pye jurn is not the best, his stance is all over the shop a good sweep and he'd be floored!

I think the dude doing the dao set is one of Brian Nelson's (North Wales Lau Gar) students, his highest grade I think. It certainly looks like him! I fought him years ago in a points comp, he beat me 1 - 0! lol! I then fougt Brian, he beat me 10 -1, im sure he can fly! lol!

The dao looks differently emphasised looks more technique orientated whereas we do it a bit more agriculturally i.e. chop off as much as possible whilst maintaining good technique!!!!

btw hong kong is boss!!!

[Freud > God]

Yes, some people were doing forms very similar to that i.e BCMA. Master yau today on the brown sash course picked up on it, bascially saying block more out since that was far to close to the body, don't lean forward since you sacrifice balance and a few other points.

[Tartovski]

We tend to keep a lower and wider stance, and bend slightly at the waist to get the blocks low without over balancing.
ie a bit like in fei loong gee.

[Tartovski]

He has no idea what he wants to do with the techniques, i mean there comes a point where you need to ask yourself would this work? If the answer is NO, then its not rocket science your doing something wrong.

I'd add a caveat to this.
I think we have to admit that some of the techniques are basically impractical at best. I don't see why we should pretend that 100% of any form easily translates to real combat. Just take the jump kick as an example: can it look effective? yes. Is it likely to be effective? probably not.

[ndabaningi]

The common postural position in Lau Gar that occurs throughout the syllabus is referred to a 'waist of a bear, back of a tiger'. Not something that is emphasised too much with beginners perhaps; who say in the 'bow and arrow' stance would be required to achieve a much simpler structure. I would say very evident as an example in the opening two moves of Fay Loong Gee. Without this posture, Lau cannot be properly practised as it is intended; certainly at a more senior level.

[ndabaningi]

We tend to keep a lower and wider stance, and bend slightly at the waist to get the blocks low without over balancing.
ie a bit like in fei loong gee.

The common postural position in Lau Gar that occurs throughout the syllabus is referred to a 'waist of a bear, back of a tiger'. Not something that is emphasised too much with beginners perhaps; who say in the 'bow and arrow' stance would be required to achieve a much simpler structure. I would say very evident as an example in the opening two moves of Fay Loong Gee. Without this posture, Lau cannot be properly practised as it is intended; certainly at a more senior level

[Freud > God]

I'd add a caveat to this.
I think we have to admit that some of the techniques are basically impractical at best. I don't see why we should pretend that 100% of any form easily translates to real combat. Just take the jump kick as an example: can it look effective? yes. Is it likely to be effective? probably not.

If applied correctly there is a time and a place for jump kicks. Nevertheless maybe all the tecniques don't translate into real combat but you should still have an application and know what you are using it for in the form, like master yau said yesterday to those who wern't visulising 'you are doing what i call Martial Movement not actually Martial Art.' Honestly when you fight you apply a small amount of techqiues which you find most effective, but your forms are still a training drill and you should make the most of them.

[Tartovski]

I agree there is a time and place for jump kicks - on a display team. ;)
I don't want to get into a huge argument on this (I've changed) but i can't see a single situation where a jump kick is goign to be the better option. And if anyone mentions "mounted warriors" I will kill them to death...

That said, I agree with you regarding having intention with your moves. I reckon I can justify pretty much every move in every form as a strike or block or both. That doesn't mean I think you will use them in a "real fight" but I think it helps the forms to know what they could be for.

ndabaningi: can you explain bear waist tiger back? i've never heard that expression before.
With regards to the 1st two moves in FLG i do them with a waist level and forward, with a slight bend in the upper back.

[ndabaningi]

ndabaningi: can you explain bear waist tiger back? i've never heard that expression before.

Briefly, I would describe it as solid of stance, well rooted, a firm fix at the waist however the back arches and rounds with the stomach in and tight. In application, I would say it's a refinement for delivering power, and focusing techniques from a more central position. There are issues with weight distribution, balance, stability and centre of gravity. Beginners typically train everything using their left and right side of the body. I would expect a beginner training basic walks for example to deliver everything from their hips, 'magnified' moves so that they can grasp the fundamentals of what they are doing. Later the hands draw more to the middle, like Spear hand and Punch for example. This posture as I have described allows speed and power from a shorter distance equal to the longer moves. In Fay Lung Gee, the application wouldn't change as the moves are still the same, however the effect should be more substantial.

Advanced applications are more centralised or core.

[Tartovski]

I think that's a much more detailed account of what I said above. cheers for that.

[Mr. O]

http://www.bcka.org.uk/intro.htm

this is alex barrowmans club, 6th dgree black sash and Lau Gar Guardian!!

[ndabaningi]

this is alex barrowmans club, 6th dgree black sash and Lau Gar Guardian!!


What am I looking for, it's just a normal web site.

[Mr. O]

i have looked and cant find the form, however this vid is on youtube! If you can stomach the gratuitious use of the Mortal Kombat movie theme track then watch it. This club appears to put Kickboxing before Kungfu...............

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L3xA3ZutM-s

[Su lin]

Damn! it's no longer available.What a surprise :D

[Tartovski]

this is alex barrowmans club, 6th dgree black sash and Lau Gar Guardian!!

So presumably their forms should look akin to the BKFA ones?

[quanto]

Damn! it's no longer available.What a surprise :D

The black sash form is still up
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfWSHa84sCg

[Su lin]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......... .


Hmmmmmmmmm.:whistle::meditate:

[Mr. O]

So presumably their forms should look akin to the BKFA ones?


presumably..

[ndabaningi]

I can see this getting interesting

[Tartovski]

I can see this getting interesting

I doubt it. I think it just goes to show that the BKFA clubs are as varied in the way they do their forms as the non-BKFA ones.

[Mr. O]

I cant, ill just call it as I see it. Its not a very good performance of Bac Pye Jurn, most people have stated what the problems are bkfa and non bkfa alike. All the people I have seen practice it differently than that performance!!

if i didnt know who the club was I would have said it was a splinter club tbh, and this is the reason why the syllabus dvd's are being released. There are that many clubs now in the country that there are going to be differences. But this is a way to pull the reigns in so to speak! If you dont do it like the dvd then its not going to be right!

[quanto]

I cant, ill just call it as I see it. Its not a very good performance of Bac Pye Jurn, most people have stated what the problems are bkfa and non bkfa alike. All the people I have seen practice it differently than that performance!!

if i didnt know who the club was I would have said it was a splinter club tbh, and this is the reason why the syllabus dvd's are being released. There are that many clubs now in the country that there are going to be differences. But this is a way to pull the reigns in so to speak! If you dont do it like the dvd then its not going to be right!

It wont make one bit of difference everyone will say theirs is the right way BKFA or Non BKFA the fist syllabus video shows that with the first form performed in different ways.
If you were non BKFA and learnt a form a certain way would you change the form to look exactly like the BKFA dvd?

[Mr. O]

it will for bkfa clubs, I know first hand of the plans for quality control which is intended for the bkfa after chats with one of the guardians! Even down to now if you plan to open a club you have to score above a certain percentage in your black sash gradings to be able to teach. If you want to teach and dont have the required grade score you'll need to take your grading again until it is acceptable!

anyhoo, this aint the right response for the thread in hand!!

[Tartovski]

TBH i'll be interested to see how the new DVD's compare to the forms in the old ones. I'm willing to bet the forms have elvolved a bit in the last 20years.

Not that I really care - it's BJJ all the way for me at the moment.

[Freud > God]

TBH i'll be interested to see how the new DVD's compare to the forms in the old ones. I'm willing to bet the forms have elvolved a bit in the last 20years.

Not that I really care - it's BJJ all the way for me at the moment.

lol well i been at uni for a bit and not seen much lau gar debate, might aswell start some. IF u think its BJJ all the way dude u probs never trained ur lau gar properly!! still i need to come on one of these MAP meets and spar u, show how to do lau gar temple martial arts style (the proper way).

[Tartovski]

IF u think its BJJ all the way dude u probs never trained ur lau gar properly!! still i need to come on one of these MAP meets and spar u, show how to do lau gar temple martial arts style (the proper way).

Um... am i not allowed to state a preference? I enjoy BJJ more, and therefore I can't be bothered with Lau Gar much anymore.
Anyway, i'd love to spar you if/when we get the chance. I've not done stand up for ages, so could be interesting!

Back to the thread - I wonder how consistent it's possibly to be with a organisation as big as the BKFA? And is that consitency even a good thing? Surely interpretation of a form is part and parcel of being a good martial artist? Even if i tried, my form is never going to look exactly like Jeremy Yau's as I'm guessing we have very different body shapes.

[Freud > God]

Um... am i not allowed to state a preference? I enjoy BJJ more, and therefore I can't be bothered with Lau Gar much anymore.
Anyway, i'd love to spar you if/when we get the chance. I've not done stand up for ages, so could be interesting!

Back to the thread - I wonder how consistent it's possibly to be with a organisation as big as the BKFA? And is that consitency even a good thing? Surely interpretation of a form is part and parcel of being a good martial artist? Even if i tried, my form is never going to look exactly like Jeremy Yau's as I'm guessing we have very different body shapes.

Yeah if we spar will be combo of stand up and ground rules, only fair. Anyway i agree all comes down to consistency, just look at other organisations e.g the state of JKD, i only would trust a handful of people to teach me. WIth the BKFA the problem was such big expansion in a short time and much of that had a emphasis on kickboxing for the $$$. Although at the time they had great fighters, these days there kickboxing isn't that great compared to say a thai boxer. If it was a strong traditional emphasis like they are trying to bring back then things could have been very different. Will be interesting the standard in the BKFA in the next 10 years. I think the fact master yau does the brown sash courses (when he can) is good, problem is he will say something but how much will people remember. I think a DVD (which is so close 2 being completed) which is very detailed is the best way forward.

[SpikeD]

Yeah if we spar will be combo of stand up and ground rules, only fair. Anyway i agree all comes down to consistency, just look at other organisations e.g the state of JKD, i only would trust a handful of people to teach me. WIth the BKFA the problem was such big expansion in a short time and much of that had a emphasis on kickboxing for the $$$. Although at the time they had great fighters, these days there kickboxing isn't that great compared to say a thai boxer. If it was a strong traditional emphasis like they are trying to bring back then things could have been very different. Will be interesting the standard in the BKFA in the next 10 years. I think the fact master yau does the brown sash courses (when he can) is good, problem is he will say something but how much will people remember. I think a DVD (which is so close 2 being completed) which is very detailed is the best way forward.

Do you know when the DVD is due for release? Will it be an all encompasing disc that covers beginner through to black or will it be split in to grade levels? Sorry to bug you for this info but you seem to have some knowledge on this.

[Freud > God]

Do you know when the DVD is due for release? Will it be an all encompasing disc that covers beginner through to black or will it be split in to grade levels? Sorry to bug you for this info but you seem to have some knowledge on this.

All i know on the DVD is that its been made and finished for a while but some fool in the association isn't happy with the background. Errrm i personally doubt it will be detailed and my guess is it will be untill black, i do hope it is really detailed with some good narration on what exactly one should be doing with the certain tecnqiues, if its not i think i will suggest it for the next one (if there ever is another). I think John Russell is doing jorn sau but not 100% sure and somebody told me master yau is doing fai loong gee but again i dunno how true it is. It can't be too long i mean how hard is it to make a dvd?

[Mr. O]

bloody hell pav you're trying to stir some stuff up here hey!? personally id avoid calling the guy who aint happy with the background a fool! you may not know how many silent members are on here, but I know of a fair few from the temple gym. And also from the dvd production team too!!!

Also the doovdes are gonna be in quie a bit of detail! as i understand it, the first is white and blue sash stuff together, also coupled with exgtra training stuff, iron shirt gear, then the rest will be in individual grades with exgtra training stuff in each one!

the first is due for release during the nationals i think, so towards the end of next month!!

i agree with interpretation of forms, but the thing i think needs controlling is for example when movements are changed eg, a spear hand becomes a tigers claw (in some clubs but stays the same in others) or suchlike. these are the things which need addressing!

also for some more interest, we did a demo yesterday in preston uni for the confucious institute infront of ambassadors from beijing who were flown over especially for the grand opening ceremony. I believe someone stated the acid test was to perform infront of chinese to see if they approve? these guys are responsible for promoting chinese culture etc for places around the world, so one would presume they have seen a fair bit of kungfu. Also many practised too.

We were extremely well recieved even to the point of the top guys coming to congratulate me on the performance (stating we were very strong, which did wonders for my ego! lol) and the president even asked (demanded lol) that I visited them in beijing to train!!

Also I must say a big thankyou to Dave Eccles and Mike Townsend (laugarfist) from manchester / accrington Lau Gar for helping with the demo too!!

[Freud > God]

bloody hell pav you're trying to stir some stuff up here hey!? personally id avoid calling the guy who aint happy with the background a fool! you may not know how many silent members are on here, but I know of a fair few from the temple gym. And also from the dvd production team too!!!

Well i do apologize, although the standard of Kung Fu in the DVD should be top notch i must confess the background lighting should take equal importance, since without it it would really make the techniques look ineffective and make for a terrible DVD....I don't think anybody should ever make a DVD again with a unsatisfactory background. WAR DVD BACKGROUNDS!! :bang:

Although that person could be anyone and i'm sure his a nice guy, to me it is a little bit pedantic. But then again im not much of a director myself so what do i know...

In your guys opinions how critical is the background in a kung fu video??

[SpikeD]

As far as background/lighting goes i can only imagine that the result is it either detracts from the focus of the film (The sifu demonstrating) or obscures it by being too bright/dark or similar.
As to the dvd, thanks for the info, a single dvd for each grade orange and up! i hope they are not going to be charging £25 per dvd as i think that will just encourage illegal copying, I know i would struggle to find £175 for a complete set of discs to black. Also it would then open the debate floor up to accusations of money making. I reckon a £7.50
dvd to association members and £10 to non members would be a resonable price.

[Tartovski]

As far as background/lighting goes i can only imagine that the result is it either detracts from the focus of the film (The sifu demonstrating) or obscures it by being too bright/dark or similar.

Seconded. I did a stage fighting course where the final performance was shot in an empty theatre. I foolishly wore my normal training gear which is black. the basic theatre is black.
damn.

Also it would then open the debate floor up to accusations of money making.

The BKFA is a profit making organisation, so I don't see why it would get accused of that - it already does make money - that's the point!

[Greyghost]

lol well i been at uni for a bit and not seen much lau gar debate, might aswell start some. IF u think its BJJ all the way dude u probs never trained ur lau gar properly!! still i need to come on one of these MAP meets and spar u, show how to do lau gar temple martial arts style (the proper way).


BWAHAHAHAHAHA......

[Su lin]

Awwww I LOVE these lau gar debates :D These days I just prefer to sit back ,read it all and relax. :D

[Lau Gar Kuen]

The examples you would have seen on the net is not official Lau Gar and usually done by inexperienced martial artists. As far as I'm aware there is no BKFA endorsed videos on the net.

Master Jeremy YAU is not a fake I assure you. Nor is he related to or claims to be of direct lieage of the Canton Lau. He learnt the style from his grandfather Yau Luk Sau who studied under Masters: Tang Hoi Ching and Wan Goo Wing.
Master Yau then but the style to the UK in 1961.

[Su lin]

No way!!!! Thanks for sharing :)

[Tartovski]

The examples you would have seen on the net is not official Lau Gar and usually done by inexperienced martial artists.

Really? even the one of a blacksash from a club set up by a guardian? interesting theory.

Master Jeremy YAU is not a fake I assure you. Nor is he related to or claims to be of direct lieage of the Canton Lau. He learnt the style from his grandfather Yau Luk Sau who studied under Masters: Tang Hoi Ching and Wan Goo Wing.

But he does claim his lineage starts with three-eyed lau, just as the canton lau does (they both claim to be the lau gar of the five southern styles).

And he also has no evidence to back that claim up apart from his own word.

[Su lin]

..........and so the cycle begins again :D

Anyway,what do you know Tart, you BJJ nuthugger you !!! :D

[Fire-quan]

We were extremely well recieved even to the point of the top guys coming to congratulate me on the performance (stating we were very strong, which did wonders for my ego! lol) and the president even asked (demanded lol) that I visited them in beijing to train!!




Heh... those polite Chinese. At least they didn't say you were handsome.

[Freud > God]

[QUOTE=Tartovski;10549857]Really? even the one of a blacksash from a club set up by a guardian? interesting theory.
QUOTE]

Yes but it wasnt the guardian doing the form, it was a black sash of his and we all know you can buy one of those these days. Just because your a guardian does not mean you are a great teacher of the martial arts, not everyone who has a good skill level neccesarily has what it takes to transfer their knowledge upon to their students. I had secondary school teachers from oxford and cambridge who were useless because they could not teach.

[Tartovski]

Yes but it wasnt the guardian doing the form, it was a black sash of his and we all know you can buy one of those these days.

Really? Cos I thought all black sash gradings were over seen by Jeremy Yau himself... That speaks volumes for the BKFA if what you say is true.

Just because your a guardian does not mean you are a great teacher of the martial arts, not everyone who has a good skill level neccesarily has what it takes to transfer their knowledge upon to their students.

Good point. Though I'd like to think someone who was supposed to be guarding the quality of a style could pass it on.

Are you sure you like the BKFA? according to you it's a mcdojo where the teachers are crap! ;)

PS if you want to see what you might be up against, check out my video link on the BJJ forum - fear my 3 loses! ;)

[Freud > God]

Really? Cos I thought all black sash gradings were over seen by Jeremy Yau himself... That speaks volumes for the BKFA if what you say is true.



Good point. Though I'd like to think someone who was supposed to be guarding the quality of a style could pass it on.

Are you sure you like the BKFA? according to you it's a mcdojo where the teachers are crap! ;)

PS if you want to see what you might be up against, check out my video link on the BJJ forum - fear my 3 loses! ;)

Yes i like the BKFA but there you go yet again twisting my words, the teachers that teach me are of a high standard (i.e they actually teach kung fu unlike these non-bkfa organisations), their teachers Master yau, Morag and John Russell all can be proud of having such strong Kung Fu. It just happens much of the BKFA put an emphasis on kickboxing and not kung fu, although not a mcDojo there kung fu skills are not at the level of somebody like master yau (who said himself he wants his students to be better than him). There are a handful of instructors who are very skilled at kung fu in the association, its ashame you will never learn from them.

But so you know where i stand and we can avoid confusion i think where you have trained are indeed mcDojo's (probarly because you cannot handle the real deal) even this Wuma guy i don't rate (i think he didnt get a high grade in lau gar). Master Yau has taught some pretty skilled martial artists, seek those out, train at their dojo's and learn some real lau gar kung fu.

I think the confusion comes because the videos of Lau Gar on the net i have been very critical of, i do not feel they do justice for the system and you're very confused supposedly empirical mind has automatically assumed i am generalising to the entire BKFA, which i am not. ALso when i do say something is terrible such as much of what is shown in the BKFA i am bascially saying it is not to the level i would wish it to be, it does not mean it is not good. E.g That video of Bac Pye Jurn i think was poor but thats because it isn't done to what i consider black sash standard, that same standard could be what somebody else views as good. Very subjective opinions.

Oh and when i said we can buy a black sash these days, dont just look at kung fu any style whatsoever in the west one can take lessons if they have the money and pass. If you deny that then you are a fool because its so obvious.

Apologies if i have been offensive but i doubt you will take it to heart, i will check out your videos

[Su lin]

Oh do get over yourself Pav. Stop claiming Tart couldn't take "the real deal", for goodness sakes stop with the sweeping generalisations, you are doing yourself no favours!

[Freud > God]

Oh do get over yourself Pav. Stop claiming Tart couldn't take "the real deal", for goodness sakes stop with the sweeping generalisations, you are doing yourself no favours!


I will be honest with you Lou i dunno the meaning of the phrase ' get over yourself' need to look that one up...sorry

I will stop when he stop's claiming i think the BKFA is crap and full of McDojo's, i think some clubs are very good. Most of it isn't i.e maybe 65% as a guess but that still leaves 35% of top notch kung fu schools in the BKFA. I think he was the first to make the sweeping generalisations.

[Tartovski]

wow 35% of an organisation is good - what a great recommendation. :/

Anyway, going back to me calling the BKFA a mcdojo: we were talking specifically about one video and one blacksash form. You stated quite clearly in reference to that video that "anyone can buy a blacksash" which presumably means in the BKFA (if not, why say that about a BKFA blacksash) which would make it a mcdojo - especially as the only person promoting to blacksash is Jeremy yau isn't it?

Also you specifically said that guardians aren't neccesarily good teachers. fair enough. but given that guardians are appointed by jeremy yau (presumably) then he must think they are worthy of that title. surely therefore if they arent great at passing on the style, it's his fault?!

[CFT]

A lot of internal inconsistencies that Tart has pointed out:

1) This is a BKFA club headed by a Lau Gar guardian.
2) This is a BKFA club headed by Lau Gar guardian; a LG black belt promoted by Jeremy Yau.
3) This is a BKFA club headed by a Lau Gar guardian; a LG black belt promoted by Jeremy Yau demonstrating Lau Gar forms poorly.

There is no available excuse.

1) Is isn't a non-BKFA McDojo
2) It isn't the kickboxing stream of BKFA

How can standards be poor amongst the Lau Gar guardians? How can only 2 guardians be held up as the standard? It is pretty poor that the 'inner circle' that sets the standards is found wanting.

[Switch2]

A lot of internal inconsistencies that Tart has pointed out:

1) This is a BKFA club headed by a Lau Gar guardian.
2) This is a BKFA club headed by Lau Gar guardian; a LG black belt promoted by Jeremy Yau.
3) This is a BKFA club headed by a Lau Gar guardian; a LG black belt promoted by Jeremy Yau demonstrating Lau Gar forms poorly.

There is no available excuse.

1) Is isn't a non-BKFA McDojo
2) It isn't the kickboxing stream of BKFA

How can standards be poor amongst the Lau Gar guardians? How can only 2 guardians be held up as the standard? It is pretty poor that the 'inner circle' that sets the standards is found wanting.

Just a poorly thought out response, from an inexperienced low grade student at the end of the day.

The Guardians were put in place to maintain standards.
This is the standard.

[Freud > God]

wow 35% of an organisation is good - what a great recommendation. :/

Anyway, going back to me calling the BKFA a mcdojo: we were talking specifically about one video and one blacksash form. You stated quite clearly in reference to that video that "anyone can buy a blacksash" which presumably means in the BKFA (if not, why say that about a BKFA blacksash) which would make it a mcdojo - especially as the only person promoting to blacksash is Jeremy yau isn't it?

Also you specifically said that guardians aren't neccesarily good teachers. fair enough. but given that guardians are appointed by jeremy yau (presumably) then he must think they are worthy of that title. surely therefore if they arent great at passing on the style, it's his fault?!

Tartovski the 35% good is better than the 0% out of the BKFA. Also 'presumably' there you go again presuming, now if science assumed things would it be where it is today? Learn the art of science and please don't just presume...

I made a general comment that you can 'buy' a blacksash, its much easier to get them in the west people are interested in your money and that goes for any art now if you don't know that then oh dear we have some problems.

The guardians job is not just to teach there is much more to it then that but that is irrelevant, not much point me wasting my breath telling you about the real standard of kung fu in the BKFA i would much rather show you one day. But before you are critical of master yau please take a lesson with him because again you should just not assume anything surely you need evidence, direct experience to form an opinion? or would actually experiencing his teaching be wrong?

If you take lets say kyuokoshin karate or Jeet Kune do or even wing chun do you think 100% or 90% of schools teach the real thing? Only a few worthy instructors will learn the full proper art not all of them, i should not have to explain it...its just common sense.

Any way im going to have to reply to ya tommorow, its freshers week and i'm off to gatecrasher, inabizzle.

[quanto]

[QUOTE=Freud > God;10549963]Yes i like the BKFA but there you go yet again twisting my words, the teachers that teach me are of a high standard (i.e they actually teach kung fu unlike these non-bkfa organisations), their teachers Master yau, Morag and John Russell all can be proud of having such strong Kung Fu. It just happens much of the BKFA put an emphasis on kickboxing and not kung fu, although not a mcDojo there kung fu skills are not at the level of somebody like master yau (who said himself he wants his students to be better than him). There are a handful of instructors who are very skilled at kung fu in the association, its ashame you will never learn from them.

Morag??? doesnt rate high in my book pretty low if Im honest.
Alex barrowman the guardian in question has great traditional skills and i would rate his teaching and understanding in kung fu quite high amongst those within the BKFA.You need to go and see what he can do before you generalise as to his skills that he can pass on.
You've you named your top two who are your bottom two guardians?

[Switch2]

I made a general comment that you can 'buy' a blacksash, its much easier to get them in the west people are interested in your money and that goes for any art now if you don't know that then oh dear we have some problems.
You know that Chinese MA systems do not typically use belt systems and that the Black Belt was introduced in Judo only 60 years ago?



The guardians job is not just to teach there is much more to it then that but that is irrelevant,
The official 'party' line, is that they are there to maintain standards.
If you think they are failing in that, then you should bring that up with Jeremy.

not much point me wasting my breath telling you about the real standard of kung fu in the BKFA i would much rather show you one day.
What an arrogant statement.
Keep training, you might be capable one day!.

But before you are critical of master yau please take a lesson with him because again you should just not assume anything surely you need evidence, direct experience to form an opinion? or would actually experiencing his teaching be wrong?
Can't speak for anyone else, but I've trained with Jeremy more than once and he's no 'Master'.

If you take lets say kyuokoshin karate or Jeet Kune do or even wing chun do you think 100% or 90% of schools teach the real thing? Only a few worthy instructors will learn the full proper art not all of them, i should not have to explain it...its just common sense.
Have you ever tried either?

[KFjim]

He he he he......Lau Gar threads are better than anything on TV.

For some reason they seem to be able to bely the laws of time, and seem to be circular in nature methinks!

Just how it appears on the outside :)