Silat ranking?

[Concept Styles]

Hi, I was told that Silat is one of the best MA's to do. I know that it's various styles has its history and roots in malaysia, Indonisia and parts of southern Asia and that Bruce Lee loved it so much he incorproated into his JKD. I'd like to take it up and I was curious as to whether or not it has a blet system or some type of ranking system. Like I said I know there's hundreds of styles and when I looked it up on the net some said yes there is a black belt but it takes on average 6 years to get (is this generally true?) and I read that in the Islamic style (if I remember correctly) you can't get up to black belt until you obtain a spiritual awarness. Any information would be greatly appriciated on this topic or any extra info on Silat. Thanks Alot!

[CQC]

Hi, I was told that Silat is one of the best MA's to do. I know that it's various styles has its history and roots in malaysia, Indonisia and parts of southern Asia and that Bruce Lee loved it so much he incorproated into his JKD. I'd like to take it up and I was curious as to whether or not it has a blet system or some type of ranking system. Like I said I know there's hundreds of styles and when I looked it up on the net some said yes there is a black belt but it takes on average 6 years to get (is this generally true?) and I read that in the Islamic style (if I remember correctly) you can't get up to black belt until you obtain a spiritual awarness. Any information would be greatly appriciated on this topic or any extra info on Silat. Thanks Alot!

There are many Silat styles, each with very different syllabus.So some will took years to finish the syllabus and some won't take that long.

Yes,nowadays, Silat also have its own belt systems.It may differ from each Silat styles.Some have up to seven ranking level,some only have three.

There are very few Silat styles that accept muslims only.I suggest you ask the ones who're in-charge with the class first.

Just an extra, you can go to wikipedia and type silat.Hope that helps

[tellner]

And some systems have no ranks at all. And that may be best. It's easy to get caught up in ranks and titles as ends in themselves and lose sight of what you're trying to do. It also leads to comparing yourself to others in an egotistical way.

[Gajah Silat]

Traditionaly Silat had no ranking system. It was within families or to people specifically selected. This was usualy a very secret affair!

Since it became more formalised, many larger schools adopted or emulated Japanese style grades & award belts.

We, don't have a belt system at all, and I believe this has some advantages. The 'one size fits all' approach is all well and good but as individuals we all have different strengths & weaknesses. You, therefore never end up in a situation where you must learn kata A before progressing to kata B.

For instance, you have the opportunity to progress in the areas of your strengths whilst also having the time to work on your weakspots.

Plus as Tellner rightly says, no belts-no egos, which can certainly be a blessing :D

[tellner]

When my teacher was looking for Silat he went to his first teacher (his grandmother) with every new possibility. She always had one question, "Stevie, can he fight?" If he didn't answer "Yes" she wasn't interested. Where he came from, what he did, the fact that he could trace his teachers all the way back to what the Angel With the Sword taught Adam back in the Garden didn't matter until he could give a positive answer to that question.

[Steve Perry]

Any information would be greatly appriciated on this topic or any extra info on Silat. Thanks Alot!

Ranking systems traditionally serve two purposes: One, to let students (and others) know what level of achievement has been attained. With colored belts, assuming you know what each one means in relation to the others, this is usually easy: A purple belt is not as deep in training as a black belt, in most systems.

The second reason, and what I have heard was the original one, was to allow a teacher with a very large class to instantly know who knows what. I believe it came from Judo.

[Orang Jawa]

Hmmm, in our silat tradition, we don't have a rank, we don't wear belt, let alone color belt, and most of all we don't wear sarong or peci :)
We don't have a large class, we only have 6 students, that's including myself.
Tristan

[tellner]

That's the difference between Old School and New School. The old Japanese martial arts didn't have rankings or colored badges. There were teaching certificates, but that was it. If you were in a class you knew who was who and their level of expertise.

Kano-Sensei developed the Kyu/Dan system during Japan's modernization. He was travelling around the country setting up universities - which is why he was "Professor Kano" and why martial arts teachers who barely finished high school calling themselves "Professor" is so ridiculous. He had people he'd never seen before coming into the Kodokan. The rough distinction of white, brown and black belts classified the students. Later, a French Judoka added the fruit salad. As Judo became popular worldwide other people starting with Karate and the new Korean MA followed his successful lead. Now "everybody knows" it's always been that way :bang:

Tristan, you are Old School through and through. You don't need the quick check to know how your students are doing. And new people? You probably just have to look at how they move to learn everything you need to. I can't imagine what good the pieces of cloth would do unless you decided that your ego was in need of serious stroking. Then you could get yourself a Paisely Belt and with a bunch of black stripes :)

[Ular Sawa]

Rankings always seemed too "western". You're either the guy teaching the class or you're in the class.

[PenNe]

In Silat of the modern school, the rank and level is apply because to diferentiate between the "Pesilat" who learn the syllabus and to measure how efficient he knew what he learn in syllabus. But the "Pesilat " should not just depand on what he learn in syllabus because enemy don't tell us what the buah he gonna use to hit and orderly proper as in syllabus. lLearn from the "guru" how to face the real enemy. But the syllabus is very important,because it is the basic in Silat. As example, we cannot build a house without the foundation(base) is made rite? That's the simple analogy to inteprate the basic, not only in Silat but every martial arts. :)

[Orang Jawa]

I can't imagine what good the pieces of cloth would do unless you decided that your ego was in need of serious stroking. Then you could get yourself a Paisely Belt and with a bunch of black stripes :)

Ach Todd, my ego in dire need of shock and awe! My low self esteem need to have a sexy pieces of cloth on my waist. I don't know about Paisely, though. I preferred pink and red stripes...Ow baby!

I'm not against people who give or received ranks/tittles, I'm not critized people who give a certificate. And I'm staying away from saying that it was wrong to charge for a belt test. Its just "different" from the way I was learning.

Now, I'm going to buy silk pajama to match my belt :)
Tristan

[Jebat]

I've done several martial arts styles, ones with and ones without belt systems. If I wanted to learn something and it involved one of those belt systems, then I accepted it without compaining. However, I do think it's totally useless. Often it just provokes people to be arrogant and disrespectful thowards others. And another thing: having a grading is with most martial arts such a joke. Push ups and situps and some kata or sequence? What does that prove? Most black belts are dangerously overestimating themselves. Go and get yourself a door-job at a club or spend some time in a wrong neigborhood and you'll know what I mean. Or rather, dont!
Anyways, I've gone through the belts too. It doesn't matter. If you want to learn and there happens to be a belt system, then so be it. But if I can choose, it will be without.......






Ranking systems traditionally serve two purposes: One, to let students (and others) know what level of achievement has been attained. With colored belts, assuming you know what each one means in relation to the others, this is usually easy: A purple belt is not as deep in training as a black belt, in most systems.

The second reason, and what I have heard was the original one, was to allow a teacher with a very large class to instantly know who knows what. I believe it came from Judo.

[rizal]

Concept styles,
In Silat, as in other MAs, rank is simply a tool to measure your progress. Yet there are many ways to measure it. For instance, you may not reach top ranks because you don't know some techniques (either because it is hard to learn or simply your body can move naturally with it). Yet, you can still be a good practicioner of silat.
One of my friends studied Silat for years and yet he still not qualified as an instructor in his style. But I spar with him often and his ability to combine 1-2 techniques into multiple variants makes him a good pesilat in my eye.
Again, rank is not important. It all depends on what your goal is. If you want to be a good pesilat, then seek out good teachers and learn from them.
Except if you want to be Guru Besar or Pendekar Besar, then rank is important. :D

[Pekir]

Hormat,

In my school we once defined a ranking system, we've never used it and as far as I'm concerned never will. We might be somewhat old school too but in general you get to learn new stuff when you are ready for it. Much of the time in the regular sequence of the curriculum but not necessarily.

I also trained Kempo for about four years. Though it was a great school and my fellow students were great too (and a lot of them still considered good friends) there was one thing I disagreed with, the ranking system. I didn't like to take their exams so after four years, judging by the two tiny red stripes on the belt, I still walked around as a pretty junior student. I didn't care that much although being proficient already in my original silat style. The ranking system did keep me from learning interesting more senior techniques though, at least I got pretty proficient in the techniques I did get to learn :)

What bothered me most however was that a great number of the students who were up for exams changed their training routine. Instead of training only once a week (sometimes hardly that) they started training three times a week for some months. They graduated and after that they went back to training at a minimum or less frequence. The lack of comprehension of what they 'learned' showed almost immediately. The result was that quite a few people would rise through the ranks who in my modest opinion at best could performtechniques but not really understand the application. Martial arts in this way becomes more of an recreational thing, which is fine to me if someone chooses so but is it still martial arts?

I believe that a martial artist who lacks his training or abilities should also be de-graduated if it leads a level wich is actualy less than the apparent graduation he once earned. I've never seen this happen.

This personal experience is surely not common for all schools that use ranking systems. The commercial neccesity of the concerned school however might make it hard to permanently judge their students and act accordingly.

Sampai bertemu lagi

Pekir