Good black belt/Bad black belt???

[davefly76]

Ok, there seems to a thing on this forum about the standard, good and bad of kuk sool black belts.

Some members seem to think that the standard is slipping and that it has become all too easy to reach black belt as kuk sool becomes more and more popular, and some think that the standard has remained the same although with more bb's comes more good and more bad students.

So, what do you think makes a good or bad kuk sool black belt and why is the standard better or worse?

:)

[Unknown Entity]

Not everyone is going to be able to kick high or do acrobatics etc.

It should be the case though that to attain your black you should be able to perform the required syllabus with correct technique and precision. I don't care whether or not my students can kick 10 feet off the ground or 10 inches off the ground so long as they can perform the techniques correctly.

A black belt should not just know the physical aspects of there art but know the history and the theory behind it.

They should know there syllabus inside out.

A black belt should be one who sets an example for students in and out of the dojang as well as being humble in everything they do and not arrogant.

There are loads more but this will get the ball rolling hopefully.

[Dr Doberman]

I think that a good black is someone that has trained hard to get to where they are. It's someone who, no matter what level they are at or what goals they've achieved already, they're always trying to achieve a higher level. They should attend class regularly, and be someone your instructor/school can rely on. One major factor in being a good black belt - IMO, is to have an open mind & repect for all other students. Too many black belts develop massive egos and treat lower belts verly poorly. Personally I think it takes more than good kicks/forms to make a good black belt!

[Wolf]

yeah, what he said. Besides having good technique, the next biggest quality to me is HUMILITY!! It is important to have the understanding (especially at first degree) that there is always a lot of improvement that can be done. I like to consider myself pretty good at what I do, but I understand that I have a long way to go still. Heck, I know a colored belt or two that have better technique than me in some areas. Understanding those things should help the blackbelt push to to improve his/herself always. To further reiterate what has been said, respect for everyone, not just those of a higher rank is extremely important too.

[IBelieved]

I agree with all that has been said about knowledge of the syllabus, ability to perform it, humility, etc. But I'll add one -- controversial, I expect -- quality: the ability to fight. At the end of the day, this is martial art. As much I like the other aspects, if you can't fight then it amounts to dance and talk.

[psbn matt]

I agree with all that has been said about knowledge of the syllabus, ability to perform it, humility, etc. But I'll add one -- controversial, I expect -- quality: the ability to fight. At the end of the day, this is martial art. As much I like the other aspects, if you can't fight then it amounts to dance and talk.

although i agree with you, you shouldn't exclude people who are just interested in the art aspect of martial arts and not the fighting (martial), people practice ma for various differant reasons, and you can be a great martial ARTIST without being a great fighter and there is nothing wrong with this. someone who can perform a hyung beautifully and make a crowded room fall silent in awe is an outstanding ma even if in sparring they get there arse kicked by a white belt.

[Unknown Entity]

Not everyone who studies martial arts wants to learn how to fight. I can see your point though. We are studying a fighting art but not everyone today wants to learn to fight.

A large amount of people today practice martial arts as a hobby to keep fit etc.

[IBelieved]

although i agree with you, you shouldn't exclude people who are just interested in the art aspect of martial arts and not the fighting (martial), people practice ma for various differant reasons, and you can be a great martial ARTIST without being a great fighter and there is nothing wrong with this. someone who can perform a hyung beautifully and make a crowded room fall silent in awe is an outstanding ma even if in sparring they get there arse kicked by a white belt.
I have met many people who aren't in it for the fighting. I never enjoyed it that much myself, in fact, I usually put it out of my mind in favor of the beauty and artistry of performing hyung. However, I am not only an old guy, I'm an old school guy and I come out of a time where fighting ability was the bottom line. To paraphrase my first instructor, knowing how to fight is as important as knowing how to walk. To skip it means that you are not well-rounded.

I'm not saying that you have to like it, much less excel at it, but you must not be a "paper tiger blackbelt" either. As someone who has actually used martial art "skill" outside of a dojang on more than a couple of occasions, I'll add that I am extremely grateful for my "it's on now" training because it gave me the confidence to stand up when that was necessary... even though I still think that fighting outside the school is foolish, it is sometimes unavoidable and so its best to prepare yourself.

[davefly76]

although i agree with you, you shouldn't exclude people who are just interested in the art aspect of martial arts and not the fighting (martial), people practice ma for various differant reasons, and you can be a great martial ARTIST without being a great fighter and there is nothing wrong with this. someone who can perform a hyung beautifully and make a crowded room fall silent in awe is an outstanding ma even if in sparring they get there arse kicked by a white belt.

thats exactly what i think. too much emphasis is put on the abilty to fight. personally i wouldn't call kuk sool a fighting art, in the sence that *most* people don't practice it to become a good fighter. i look at fighting arts as being muay thai, boxing, judo etc, in that the majority of people who practice those do so to win fights (all be it, in a controlled environment).

:)

[ember]

I do agree that sparring is an important part of training. IMO, the only reasons not to spar (in the general sense) are medical.

I have met many people who aren't in it for the fighting. I never enjoyed it that much myself, in fact, I usually put it out of my mind in favor of the beauty and artistry of performing hyung. However, I am not only an old guy, I'm an old school guy and I come out of a time where fighting ability was the bottom line. To paraphrase my first instructor, knowing how to fight is as important as knowing how to walk. To skip it means that you are not well-rounded.

I'm not saying that you have to like it, much less excel at it, but you must not be a "paper tiger blackbelt" either. As someone who has actually used martial art "skill" outside of a dojang on more than a couple of occasions, I'll add that I am extremely grateful for my "it's on now" training because it gave me the confidence to stand up when that was necessary... even though I still think that fighting outside the school is foolish, it is sometimes unavoidable and so its best to prepare yourself.

[ember]

At the risk of opening another can of worms...

I'm starting to think that a good black belt is simply someone who continues to practice. Conversely, a bad black belt would be someone who decides that 1st degree was the goal, and stops practicing.

[RaccoonWrangler]

I'm starting to think that a good black belt is simply someone who continues to practice. Conversely, a bad black belt would be someone who decides that 1st degree was the goal, and stops practicing.

I agree, Ember. The prevailing opinion among most of the non-martial arts people I talk to (there's got to be a nickname for those not of the Arts, too bad 'Muggle' has already been taken :rolleyes: ) is that Black Belt is the be-all, end-all. A lot are aware that there are higher levels of BB, but they don't really think 'real people' can achieve that sort of training, just super-athletes and monks who can afford to do nothing but MA all day long.

It is kind of sad that someone could go through more than three years of training and still have the same opinion as one of the Great Unstretched. (Okay, that nickname is pretty lame :rolleyes: )

[JKN-Taylor]

A good blackbelt, IMO, would be good at both aspects of Martial Art (or at least not neglecting either). A mediocre BB would only be good at one or the other and refuse or not feel the need to be good at both. A bad blackbelt probably wouldn’t care.