Christianity and Goths

[Sgt_Major]

5) A hot christian gothic girlfriend.



is that not a contradiction in terms?????

Surely the 2 do not go hand in hand?

[CraigLeeJKD]

why would you say that?

[bum-eyes]

Goth is not a religion. It's a sub-culture. A bit like punk.

What is goth? (http://www.goth.net/goth.html)

I hope this clears things up.

[neb]

The common Goth is anti-social to anyone but more goths, they try to be non-conformist for the sake of it though are just conforming anyway, they do many things like smoking which is not respectful of the body (it should be sacred as the Bible teaches us) and dont value life as the Bible also teaches us. Basically they dont live by christain beliefes one bit - if they did they wouldn't... (see above).

[bum-eyes]

That's a whole lot of steriotypes. Goths do not smoke any more than anyone else, and what makes you think we don't value life? We are often antisocial among non-goths because we don't relate as well with those people. How social would you be in a room full of goths?

[iamraisen]

How social would you be in a room full of goths?

Not very. i'd tell them to cheer up and stop listening to cradle of filth!

btw im only kidding except for the cradle of filth part. oh and the cheering up ;)

[slipthejab]

LOL!
The old goth's still around eh.

*slip thumbs through his albums looking for his old Christian Death records.
:D

[bum-eyes]

To quote the page I linked to earlier:

"Many different musical tastes exist (and not all of them goth, there is a HUGE 80's following in the goth scene for some reason)."

And the reason is that 80's music is bloody good.

[Sgt_Major]

To quote the same page:

Goths are free thinkers, people who do not accept the moral rules of society because they're told 'This is just how it is' or 'This is what God says!'

Surely, as a Christian, that is what you are meant to do? I'm not being offensive, but when I walk down town and see all the goths hanging out round the city centre, Im sorry, but christianity is the last thing I'd associate with them.

[iamraisen]

To quote the page I linked to earlier:

"Many different musical tastes exist (and not all of them goth, there is a HUGE 80's following in the goth scene for some reason)."

And the reason is that 80's music is bloody good.

i was only kiding mate. im a metal head through and through i am just not predisposed to wearing black :eek:

[Sgt_Major]

i was only kiding mate. im a metal head through and through i am just not predisposed to wearing black :eek:


lol, it was very funny too! :D

[bum-eyes]

To quote the same page:

Goths are free thinkers, people who do not accept the moral rules of society because they're told 'This is just how it is' or 'This is what God says!'

Surely, as a Christian, that is what you are meant to do? I'm not being offensive, but when I walk down town and see all the goths hanging out round the city centre, Im sorry, but christianity is the last thing I'd associate with them.There's a difference between what God says and what people say He says. I follow my understanding of the Bible, taking it about as literally as I can, except for where it is clearly symbolic(the Beast, for example). I don't see any reason to accept another man's interpretation of the Bible as better than mine, as we are both merely human.

I don't deny that most goths do not act in a christian manner, as most goths are not christians.

[leeless]

Goth is not a religion. It's a sub-culture. A bit like punk.


To go further than that. "Gothic" (the word used in the initial quote) is a style. It can be just a look, with no cultural attributes. A gothic Christian then uis perfectly feasible.

[jonmonk]

I don't deny that most goths do not act in a christian manner...Which is what?

[bum-eyes]

Which is what?Maybe my mind's slowing down a bit after being awake for too long, but I don't understand that post.

[pgm316]

LOL!
The old goth's still around eh.

*slip thumbs through his albums looking for his old Christian Death records.
:D

Sandals and guitars, can't beat it! ;)

[bum-eyes]

Sandals? Guitars?

All I ever wear on my feet are boots. And socks. I don't have a guitar nor do I know how to play one but I would much to get hold of a good leftie guitar to learn on.

Dude, enough with the steriotypes allready.

[jonmonk]

Maybe my mind's slowing down a bit after being awake for too long, but I don't understand that post.What is the Christian manner?

[Moosey]

How do goths feel about emo kids stealing their 'look'? i.e. the black eyeliner and nail varnish, long hair, peircings etc? Do you see this as an expansion or a corruption of goth?

Back in the day, emo kids used to disguise themselves as skate-punks or wear big glasses and tank tops (a'la Weezer) but now they're encroaching into goth territory!

[bum-eyes]

What is the Christian manner?The way we are supposed to act according to the Bible. Loving and forgiving even your enimies, avoiding drunkedness, etc.

[pgm316]

Dude, enough with the steriotypes allready.

Isn't that what the threads all about? :D

I really think its daft to judge whether someone is christian or not on the way they look.

[Sgt_Major]

agreed, it IS daft. But its not looks I talking about, its principles. Anti authoritarian, and faith in a God, they contradict

[bum-eyes]

How do goths feel about emo kids stealing their 'look'? i.e. the black eyeliner and nail varnish, long hair, peircings etc? Do you see this as an expansion or a corruption of goth?

Back in the day, emo kids used to disguise themselves as skate-punks or wear big glasses and tank tops (a'la Weezer) but now their encroaching into goth territory!I can't speak for all, but I see imitation as flattery. EVERYONE should wear black.

[jonmonk]

The way we are supposed to act according to the Bible. Loving and forgiving even your enimies, avoiding drunkedness, etc.
Then I guess if the Bible doesn't tell you what clothes to wear or what music to listen to then there's no problem.

[Moosey]

agreed, it IS daft. But its not looks I talking about, its principles. Anti authoritarian, and faith in a God, they contradict
I dunno, I reckon if the Bumster is genuine in his belief in God and doesn't let anyone bully him into thinking otherwise, then he is being independent minded. You don't have to be an anarchist to be determined to be yourself.

[bum-eyes]

agreed, it IS daft. But its not looks I talking about, its principles. Anti authoritarian, and faith in a God, they contradict
I'm not against divine authority. God has power anyway, so I might as well listen to Him. It's the authority one man has over another that pisses me off.

[jonmonk]

I'm not against divine authority. God has power anyway, so I might as well listen to Him. It's the authority one man has over another that pisses me off.Lol! I'm afraid there will always be people in authority mate. This world wouldn't function otherwise.

[bum-eyes]

I dunno, I reckon if the Bumster is genuine in his belief in God and doesn't let anyone bully him into thinking otherwise, then he is being independent minded. You don't have to be an anarchist to be determined to be yourself.1) Thanks for a great nickname. I feel like getting it tattood.

2) I agree with your post entirely. Congratulations.

3) I don't have to be an anarchist to be an individual. But I am anyway. (insert potty language) the Corporation is my motto. :woo:

[Sgt_Major]

EVERYONE should wear black.

This I agree with. And Im not a goth, nor any other stereotype. I like to be known as the Sarge, not a 'label' :D

Black is my ideal colour as I use it to my advantage to be reclusive in dark places.

[Moosey]

3) I don't have to be an anarchist to be an individual. But I am anyway. (insert potty language) the Corporation is my motto. :woo:
Heh heh, mine too - but I can't get away with the punk rock look any more as most people have trouble trusting a psychologist with funny hair. :D

[bum-eyes]

Lol! I'm afraid there will always be people in authority mate. This world wouldn't function otherwise.You think so? You poor brainwashed soul. I shall weep for you now. :cry:

The world turns regardless of the actions of humanity. Unless some nutter set off all the nukes at once on Nov 5 or something. Society will fail without leaders, but another will rise to replace it. What we need is leadership, not rulership.

If anyone really feels like arguing this point further, maybe you should start a new thread. Otherwise, let's get back on topic.

[bum-eyes]

Heh heh, mine too - but I can't get away with the punk rock look any more as most people have trouble trusting a psychologist with funny hair. :D
Depends on what kind of clients you work with.

[Moosey]

Depends on what kind of clients you work with.
Brain injuries. Trust me, I'd get fired quite quickly :D

[bum-eyes]

Anyway, the time is now 5:39AM and it's light outside. I should probably go home for a shower before I hit the shops. Hence I won't be posting here for a few days probably so don't go too hard with all the questioning and accusations ok?.

[snow_tiger]

1) Thanks for a great nickname. I feel like getting it tattood.

2) I agree with your post entirely. Congratulations.

3) I don't have to be an anarchist to be an individual. But I am anyway. (insert potty language) the Corporation is my motto. :woo:
1 Peter 2:11-25

Anarchy is anti-Christian. I say this as a former skater-"punk", anarchy-sign t-shirt, etc... Not being judgemental. K?

But, in an effort to show a Biblical perspective, anarchy is anti-Biblical. Do with that as you wish.

[bum-eyes]

I'll go home, read my bible, and try and answer you later ok?

[holyheadjch]

The way we are supposed to act according to the Bible. Loving and forgiving even your enimies, avoiding drunkedness, etc.

Jesus - isn't he the dude who turned water into wine...that guy was a wino with skills

[bum-eyes]

1 Peter 2:11-25

Anarchy is anti-Christian. I say this as a former skater-"punk", anarchy-sign t-shirt, etc... Not being judgemental. K?

But, in an effort to show a Biblical perspective, anarchy is anti-Biblical. Do with that as you wish.How could I possibly honour a corrupt and envious ruling class as well as fear a just and holy God? The two are at odds - I cannot serve two masters any more than I could fight in both sides in a war.

[bum-eyes]

Jesus - isn't he the dude who turned water into wine...that guy was a wino with skillsHis first recorded miracle that was. There is a difference between drinking and drunkedness though, and He never crossed that line.

[snow_tiger]

That's cool-- or not. Either way is fine.

I wasn't heaping coals or anything, just thought it worth mentioning. Also, you can check out Romans 13:

1 Let every soul be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities that exist are appointed by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authority resists the ordinance of God, and those who resist will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to evil. Do you want to be unafraid of the authority? Do what is good, and you will have praise from the same. 4 For he is God's minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God's minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil. 5 Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience' sake. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for they are God's ministers attending continually to this very thing.

Again, not trying to belabor the point, but thought if you want to look into it, the above could bolster the study.

The 1 Peter quote would address the issue of this thread, in fact. It is a call to the Christian to live a life of blatant goodness, taking care of the world's perception of the body of Christ. The way we look, act, interact with people and the government, all reflect on Christ-- whom we profess. Their opinion of us is the opinion they'll have of our Lord.

So, whether it be mascara, antisocialism, televangelists banging their secretaries, whatever... We are the only Christ that some will see.

Take care and love...

[bum-eyes]

But if the government is evil, and I believe it is, then how can I both serve them and claim to do good, without bearing the lable of a hypocrite?

[neb]

without evil there can be no good so it must be good to be evil sometimes............!

up there, where the sky is blue, where babies burp and flowers bloom! everyone dreams i can dream too, up there! UP THERE!

....sorry. Broke into song again.

[bum-eyes]

Without evil, good has nothing to compare itself against, but it never good to be evil. Is it ever hot to be cold?

[snow_tiger]

How could I possibly honour a corrupt and envious ruling class as well as fear a just and holy God? The two are at odds - I cannot serve two masters any more than I could fight in both sides in a war.
It's pretty clear in scripture that gov. officials have the responsibility to God for how they use or abuse the power HE has GIVEN them for His purposes. But, as the above Romans quote states, if you resist civil authority, you clearly bring His judgement on yourself.

I think it's pretty clear through the story of Shadrack, Meshack and Abednego that we are to refuse government mandates that specifically violate God's ordinances. So, I'll ask you what the NZ government is asking you to do which violates God's law? Do they have you running a concentration camp? Asking you to renounce God? Kill?

Or are they asking you to live within a free, ordered society? Any abuses they perform are on them. But by resisting their authority, you resist God's. And, i don't think you have it much worse than the 1st century church that Paul and Peter were writing to-- who were about to experience the most bloody persecution in church history. There wasn't much more corrupt than the Roman treatment Christianity was about to experience.

I don't mean to sound like this will obviously sound, so please forgive me in advance, but... You seem a bit young? Teenager, maybe? Once you've experience a bit more, you may learn to appreciate what you have around you instead of disdaining it. No government will ever be perfect until the New Jeruselem, but you have been born into a fairly privileged society, comparatively speaking. You may think about that before pissing on it.

Anyway, think about it, take care, and God bless you.

[bum-eyes]

Free? Sure, whatever. More freedoms here than in a lot of other places, but there still exist what I see as unacceptable restrictions on everyone.

I do not commit crimes soley for the sake of chucking a spanner in the works (there are much better ways to achieve the same), but I will not comply with any law I think is wrong. Who would?

Um, yeah, I turned 19 a week ago. Got no presents yet :(

I will, I will, and thanks you too.

[neb]

By all means lets piss on society and our overly powerful government. Its much funner than just sitting around saying 'This is very grand, much better than thrid world countires, no complaints.'

and besides, the reason why we have it at least this good is becoz society keeps saying 'This is crap, make it better now!'

[JTiedes]

I don't see any reason to accept another man's interpretation of the Bible as better than mine, as we are both merely human.



yea except that priests devote their lives to the study of the bible, so im goin to give them the benifit of the doubt and some serious consideration when i form my own views

[snow_tiger]

yea except that priests devote their lives to the study of the bible, so im goin to give them the benifit of the doubt and some serious consideration when i form my own views
Or, judge each man's theology by his actions and the Books it's supposed to come from. I know of some little boys who would question some priest's practices. Clergy cards are only as good as their holder. ;)

[snow_tiger]

By all means lets piss on society and our overly powerful government. Its much funner than just sitting around saying 'This is very grand, much better than thrid world countires, no complaints.'

and besides, the reason why we have it at least this good is becoz society keeps saying 'This is crap, make it better now!'
Good point, but my response was to the theological validity to anarchy as stated by a Christian poster.

Anarchy is NOT the betterment of your current government. It is the abolishment of said government, in favor of an ungoverned society. It is the absense of authority, political disorder and confusion, and a lack of common standards or codes. It would be the promotion of a true survival-of-the-strongest, and the biggest gun would dictate morality.

I don't want to thread-jack, so I'll leave the discussion at that, except to say that I agree with you that we should always seek a better standard. But at least in a democracy, any "class" can be elected into the "ruling class".

Take care.

[bum-eyes]

Weren't we discussing goths and christianity here?

[thepunisher]

By all means lets piss on society and our overly powerful government. Its much funner than just sitting around saying 'This is very grand, much better than thrid world countires, no complaints.'


Wonder if you would utter the same words if you were on the other side of societys ladder.

Christian

[aikiMac]

1 Peter 2:11-25

Anarchy is anti-Christian. I say this as a former skater-"punk", anarchy-sign t-shirt, etc... Not being judgemental. K?

But, in an effort to show a Biblical perspective, anarchy is anti-Biblical. Do with that as you wish.
Peter didn't say anarchy was unbiblical. Peter said we should obey the authority that is in place (read verse 13 again). One could very well use the rules of the existing authority to replace it with, oh, an anarcho-libertarian form of governance. :) And, if the anarcho-libertarian form of governance was the existing authority, would not verse 13 be a command to obey it? I think so. :)


Free? Sure, whatever. More freedoms here than in a lot of other places, but there still exist what I see as unacceptable restrictions on everyone.
Preach it, brother! :) Libertarian, Libertarian, woo-ooo-ooo! :D


"5) A hot christian gothic girlfriend."

is that not a contradiction in terms?????
Surely the 2 do not go hand in hand?
:eek: No, it's not a contradiction. Dude, are you blind? All goth girls are hot!

[lordazazel]

Despite going wildly off-topic, the main point in question is a very interesting one indeed. I'm heavily into Gothic music and wearing dark clothes and leather (no make-up or dyed hair though :D ), but I don't label myself as a "Goth". That's not because I'm embarassed by the title, it's just that I am equally into metal, classic rock, gothic, prog, glam and grunge/alternative. So all-in-all, I'm too varied to fit into the Goth category (or indeed any one specific genre), even though I do share a great affinity with it.

I have come across other "Goths" who claim to be Christian, but my thoughts on this are that we should consider whether they are mainly into the IMAGE, or if they are indeed into the Gothic LIFESTYLE as a whole. If it's the former, then you could mainly attribute it to youthful adolescent "I wanna rebel against mommy and daddy" rebellion. Nevertheless, if it's the latter then I do see it as a contradiction in terms.

As far as I can tell, Christianity is a life-affirming ideology. Some might say it's life-DENYING, but although I'm Agnostic/Atheist myself, I won't turn this into a rant against Christianity. ;) However, if it's a life-affirming ideology, then it is based on, for the most part, POSITIVE values. On the other hard, Gothic culture deals with the darker side of human existence, exploring a wide range of values such as death, misanthropy and non-conformity.

Given the stark contrast between their core values, I have always seen Christianity and Goth culture as mutually-exclusive. :Alien: As I iterated previously, I have met some who claim to straddle that fine line between both scenes. But personally, I've always maintained that you cannot serve two masters equally....

[bum-eyes]

Peter didn't say anarchy was unbiblical. Peter said we should obey the authority that is in place (read verse 13 again). One could very well use the rules of the existing authority to replace it with, oh, an anarcho-libertarian form of governance. :) And, if the anarcho-libertarian form of governance was the existing authority, would not verse 13 be a command to obey it? I think so. :)Though anarchism is actually a lack of a governing system.:eek: No, it's not a contradiction. Dude, are you blind? All goth girls are hot!Most. Some are fat and ugly and horrible. Just like in most cultures and sub-cultures.

[bum-eyes]

There seems to be a little bit of confusion on what the word "Goth" actually means.

Here's Wikipeida's version: [link] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goth).

[pgm316]

agreed, it IS daft. But its not looks I talking about, its principles. Anti authoritarian, and faith in a God, they contradict

Most Goths seem to be around college age. And I think its little more than fancy dress and some lame image statement to say how different they, by dressing exactly the same as the bunch of friends there with :D

Theres a big difference between these teeny moshers & the older hardcore black metalers.

[iamraisen]

:eek: No, it's not a contradiction. Dude, are you blind? All goth girls are hot!

really?

[Sgt_Major]

:eek: No, it's not a contradiction. Dude, are you blind? All goth girls are hot!

:D

Been there ;) Still have the deep embedded scratch marks :D

http://www.deti-nochi.kiev.ua/images/festival/goth-girl-melissa.jpg

[thepunisher]

:D

Been there ;) Still have the deep embedded scratch marks :D

http://www.deti-nochi.kiev.ua/images/festival/goth-girl-melissa.jpg

Sorry, definitley not the kind of woman I would date. She might be hot but she is not letting it out. Why make yourself look like that ? We had a girl at Uni who was dressed in the "goth" manner and the only thing I was wondering the whole time:"Why does she look so depressed ?" And that girl seemed to be a loon too, saying totally incoherent stuff at the most strange times, like in the middle of a class.
:D

Christian

[Sgt_Major]

She might be hot but she is not letting it out. Christian

its a still photo dude, you cant judge personality from a photo.

[pgm316]

Sorry, definitley not the kind of woman I would date. She might be hot but she is not letting it out. Why make yourself look like that ? We had a girl at Uni who was dressed in the "goth" manner and the only thing I was wondering the whole time:"Why does she look so depressed ?" And that girl seemed to be a loon too, saying totally incoherent stuff at the most strange times, like in the middle of a class.
:D

Christian

Bet you wouldn't say that if she was wearing a bikini?

Meeting your parents with her wearing swimwear could be equally awkward! :D

[thepunisher]

Bet you wouldn't say that if she was wearing a bikini?

Meeting your parents with her wearing swimwear could be equally awkward! :D

Well, if she would be wearing a bikini she would still have dark makeup on so not so sure if that would fit, lol. But if she would appear in front of me in red or white lingerie I might change my mind.
;) :D

Christian

[iamraisen]

Sorry, definitley not the kind of woman I would date. She might be hot but she is not letting it out. Why make yourself look like that ? We had a girl at Uni who was dressed in the "goth" manner and the only thing I was wondering the whole time:"Why does she look so depressed ?" And that girl seemed to be a loon too, saying totally incoherent stuff at the most strange times, like in the middle of a class.
:D

Christian

hmmm there are better examples out there sgt major. i think you missus is nicer ;)

[thepunisher]

its a still photo dude, you cant judge personality from a photo.

Of course but what do we all first go for when meeting someone ? There looks. And she wouldn't be a girl I would normally approach. And thats the impression she would be giving me wearing all black, white and piercings, whether her personality is different would be something to find out although it wouldn't intrigue me enough to find out.

Christian

[adouglasmhor]

Though anarchism is actually a lack of a governing system.

Anarchism is the political philosophy of those who believe that a society based on shared ownership and voluntary agreements among individuals and groups is possible and that without each person's consent and involvement in the social order all established forms of government essentially rest upon the threat of force. As a result, some anarchists believed in the use of violence to bring about change. ...
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&lr=&oi=defmore&defl=en&q=define:Anarchism

[pgm316]

Of course but what do we all first go for when meeting someone ? There looks. And she wouldn't be a girl I would normally approach. And thats the impression she would be giving me wearing all black, white and piercings, whether her personality is different would be something to find out although it wouldn't intrigue me enough to find out.

Christian

Could be your loss if you're not intrigued enough to find out.

My previous point with the swimwear is people don't wear the same clothes all the time. Sometimes I wear all black, sometimes something more like some bad 70's curtains. :D

[iamraisen]

Could be your loss if you're not intrigued enough to find out.

My previous point with the swimwear is people don't wear the same clothes all the time. Sometimes I wear all black, sometimes something more like some bad 70's curtains. :D

i wear my speedo's in public too.

[pgm316]

i wear my speedo's in public too.

Those things shouldn't be worn in private either! :D

[iamraisen]

Those things shouldn't be worn in private either! :D

They are the most streamline and efficient of all swimwear. Speedoes are the iron of the swimming world and swim shorts are the machines :D

[thepunisher]

Could be your loss if you're not intrigued enough to find out.


Could be my loss or could be hers...depends if she would be intrigued enough to find out about me just wearing my regular clothes. And from what I know, most goths hang out in their own circles so I would definitley not be on the "interesting guy" list.

What this goth dress up sense does is partly isolate these ppl into one group. I can't believe alot of outsiders are intrigued enough to join it. I wouldn't be for my part. And its a statement not necessarily everyone wants to be a part off...reminds me of "Gay pride". Poeple participating in a party to show how proud they are of being gay. Sadly, often these very ppl also harbour a hatred towards heteros as well and that statement comes over much stronger than their pride. And it also isolates them from the rest of society. Hence I think it shouldn't be "Gay pride" but simply a "love fest" or parade, to celebrate the love between all human beings, whether gay or straight.

Christian

[iamraisen]

Could be my loss or could be hers...depends if she would be intrigued enough to find out about me just wearing my regular clothes. And from what I know, most goths hang out in their own circles so I would definitley not be on the "interesting guy" list.




as someone who hangs round with 'rockers' and dresses 'normally' i can definately say that most wont give me a second look despite being extremely dashing and liking heavier music than most of them.

[adouglasmhor]

Hence I think it shouldn't be "Gay pride" but simply a "love fest" or parade, to celebrate the love between all human beings, whether gay or straight.

Christian
Like the "Love Parade" in Berlin Christian? It started as a Gay event and has now grown int a huge party open to all>

[Sgt_Major]

hmmm there are better examples out there sgt major. i think you missus is nicer ;)


There are, yeah. But being in work with an open desk plan, I dont want people seeing my 'googling' Goth girls, especially when you see what comes up in the images :eek: :eek:

And I think my missus is nicer too :D

[thepunisher]

Like the "Love Parade" in Berlin Christian? It started as a Gay event and has now grown int a huge party open to all>

Yes, like that one. Its good that now its open to all. There is so much as I know still a "Gay pride" even going on as well and that one is only open to gays and lesbians.

Christian

[iamraisen]

There are, yeah. But being in work with an open desk plan, I dont want people seeing my 'googling' Goth girls, especially when you see what comes up in the images :eek: :eek:

And I think my missus is nicer too :D

lol i just googled it. there are some hotties around i can tell you BUT very few are suitable for the work environment ;)

[pgm316]

as someone who hangs round with 'rockers' and dresses 'normally' i can definately say that most wont give me a second look despite being extremely dashing and liking heavier music than most of them.

I agree.

I like the rock/metal pubs also. Although find myself frequenting them less often, because the people look down on you for wearing regular clothes. Ironically this is what they accuse us of doing, they are the worst for!

Although I’ve found a quite easy fix, wear a small black shirt that makes you look buff! :)

[pgm316]

Could be my loss or could be hers...depends if she would be intrigued enough to find out about me just wearing my regular clothes. And from what I know, most goths hang out in their own circles so I would definitley not be on the "interesting guy" list.
Christian


I had this conversation with a couple of metal heads that had made a comment about a friends shirt. Which apparantely he bought because he was a sheep and went to Next, blah blah blah. I said "he's a martial arts instructor of 20 years, black belt 3rd dan. But thats not as good as your black shirt I guess!" ;)

[iamraisen]

Although I’ve found a quite easy fix, wear a small black shirt that makes you look buff! :)

hehe much to the anger of all the skinny goth guys!

[pgm316]

hehe much to the anger of all the skinny goth guys!

Absolutely :)

Put some more make-up on and show me your pain now boys! :D

[iamraisen]

Absolutely :)

Put some more make-up on and show me your pain now boys! :D

HAHAHA man this thread has been everywhere

[Sgt_Major]

I agree with the t-shirt thing, I buy some a size smaller than I need, cos that way I look buffer than I really am :D


Vain? Me? NEVER! :p

[iamraisen]

I agree with the t-shirt thing, I buy some a size smaller than I need, cos that way I look buffer than I really am :D


Vain? Me? NEVER! :p

i used to wear loads of oversized band tee's. then i switched to figure hugging ones when i started lifting (bout 2 years ago) now ive outgrown them and can make my old band tee's look figure hugging :D

[Sgt_Major]

LOL!

Thats where Im aiming for. When I have to buy bigger clothes cos my lifting makes me bigger than them....


But back on topic .... goths

[pgm316]

LOL!

Thats where Im aiming for. When I have to buy bigger clothes cos my lifting makes me bigger than them....


But back on topic .... goths

I'm finding the buff boys thread more entertaining! :D

I do have a few goth/metal friends, whatever you classify them as. But theres very little substance to back the lifestyle up. So you like the music, so what? Theres maybe a small hint of satanism, but in reality there probably as religious as an athiest! :D

Maybe its mob mentality, humans have a great sense of wanting to belong. Whether its martial arts club, religion, friends, groups or whatever. People will find something they attach themselves to.

[iamraisen]

Maybe its mob mentality, humans have a great sense of wanting to belong. Whether its martial arts club, religion, friends, groups or whatever. People will find something they attach themselves to.

sometimes even internet forums :D welcome to the buff boys club.

[Sgt_Major]

Like fight club? but camper?

[snow_tiger]

Peter didn't say anarchy was unbiblical. Peter said we should obey the authority that is in place (read verse 13 again). One could very well use the rules of the existing authority to replace it with, oh, an anarcho-libertarian form of governance. :) And, if the anarcho-libertarian form of governance was the existing authority, would not verse 13 be a command to obey it? I think so. :)



Preach it, brother! :) Libertarian, Libertarian, woo-ooo-ooo! :D



:eek: No, it's not a contradiction. Dude, are you blind? All goth girls are hot!
I was thinking more along the lines of Romans, which I specifically quoted. Paul says, speaking of government:

For he is God's minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God's minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil. 5 Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience' sake. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for they are God's ministers attending continually to this very thing.

Anarchy defined:
1. Absence of any form of political authority.
2. Political disorder and confusion.
3. Absence of any cohesive principle, such as a common standard or purpose.


God is not a God of disorder, but of order and authority. HE is the one who set forth government.
Anarcho-libertarian is a clash of viewpoints. I'm all for the lebertarian movement, as in decreasing federal interferences. But the idea of decreasing ferderal interference through the abolishment of government, period, would do more harm than good.

Peace...

[iamraisen]

Like fight club? but camper?

and more importantly bigger :D

[neb]

is this a bad time to bring up the fact that jesus was jewish...

so, christains are kinda just some fan club of jesus.

now let's stop all this nonsense! its christmas soon! embrace your fellow Goth, love the satanist, and tolerate those who actually believe a snake tempted Adam to eat some fruit!

for just one month of the year - let's all focus on what is really important!

Turkey, scrumptious lightly salted crackling, homemade gravy, and coca-cola from the bottle with santa's face on it!! :)

sweet, sweet joy.

[iamraisen]

so, christains are kinda just some fan club of jesus.


thats pretty much the rationale behind it, yes :D

except we dont get monthly newsletters, membership cards or a bumpersticker.

on a more serious note, can goths wear the hats you get in christmas crackers? if so i want to see pictures!

[neb]

i think it would count as conformity outside of Goth acceptable standards. Well, all i can say is that they better confrom to Turkey!

[iamraisen]

i think it would count as conformity outside of Goth acceptable standards. Well, all i can say is that they better confrom to Turkey!

everyones aim this christmas is to find pictures of goths wearing seasonal attire. or at least partaking in seasonal activities!

[fugepilot]

What is goth? (http://www.goth.net/goth.html)

I hope this clears things up.
It certianly does. :) Thanks Bum-eyes, I must admit to having been curious for some time as to what they are all about.

From your link:

"There is no specific thing that defines what you need to do or be to fit into the goth scene (except of course the implied black clothing)."

So that's it...the wear black clothes club. :bang:
I was expecting so much more. :D

[aikiMac]

Though anarchism is actually a lack of a governing system.
That might be true, but I didn't advocate anarchy or anarchism. I advocated anarcho-libertarianism. It is a governing system. (I'd be willing to try anarcho-capitalism too.)


really? [picture -- post 57]
:eek: [shudder] Okay, I stand corrected. With a few exceptions, all Goth girls are hot. I think it's the black hair. I have a thing for the dark brunette color. (My wife has black hair. She's asian.)


I was thinking more along the lines of Romans, which I specifically quoted. Paul says, speaking of government:

For he is God's minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God's minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil. 5 Therefore you must be subject, not only because of wrath but also for conscience' sake. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for they are God's ministers attending continually to this very thing.

Anarchy defined:
1. Absence of any form of political authority.
2. Political disorder and confusion.
3. Absence of any cohesive principle, such as a common standard or purpose.

God is not a God of disorder, but of order and authority. HE is the one who set forth government.
Anarcho-libertarian is a clash of viewpoints. I'm all for the lebertarian movement, as in decreasing federal interferences. But the idea of decreasing ferderal interference through the abolishment of government, period, would do more harm than good.
Paul and Peter say the same thing, and anarcho-libertarian does not fit your #2 or #3.
Private contracts --> order, not confusion, 'cause you agreed to it.
Private contracts --> rules that we all know --> cohesive principles.

I've done a lot of thinking about what the Republican Party, the Democratic Party, the modern American "conservative" movement, and the modern American "liberal" movement all promote. And I've thought much about what the Libertarian Party and various Libertarian sub-groups promote. My conclusion is that the Libertarian perspective is unquestionably the most biblical. There's no doubt in my mind. An anarcho-libertarian model is what God set up in the days of Joshua in the Old Testament. It's therefore the best. Done deal. Not surprisingly, it's completely consistent with the preachings of Paul and Peter and John in the New Testament. You cannot say the same thing about modern Republican or Democrat or conservative or liberal plans, because all of these competing plans conflict somewhere with important biblical principals.


everyones aim this christmas is to find pictures of goths wearing seasonal attire. or at least partaking in seasonal activities!
A Goth girl in red? :confused: That would be weird.

[iamraisen]

A Goth girl in red? :confused: That would be weird.

lol maybe just a santa hat, or carry a sack of presents. i want to know what goths look like on christmas day :D

[lordazazel]

Talk about a thread getting off-topic! :rolleyes: It's funny how a few Christians on here have been acting all high and mighty and have criticised Gothic culture, yet NOT ONE of you even bothered to address my (very valid) points earlier in this thread.

I find it amusing that Christians have the cheek to say those who criticise THEM and their way of life are ill-informed, yet reading through some of the garbage on this thread, the hypocrisy speaks volumes. :D Re-read my earlier post if you must, but if you insist on having a go at Gothic culture for it's "narrowmindedness" or "conformity among friends" then at least get some coherence to your arguments. ;)

[Capt Ann]

??Huh?? Not sure I follow you. The whole point of the thread was that someone didn't think a Christian could be a goth, and a very gothic very Christian forum member discussed how/why they can fit together. I didn't think any Christians were bashing goths.

As far as your question, if you really want some discussion/answers, please just repeat it. I think it got lost in the room noise.

[lordazazel]

??Huh?? Not sure I follow you. The whole point of the thread was that someone didn't think a Christian could be a goth, and a very gothic very Christian forum member discussed how/why they can fit together. I didn't think any Christians were bashing goths.

As far as your question, if you really want some discussion/answers, please just repeat it. I think it got lost in the room noise.

For your convenience, here is my earlier post quoted below. ;)


Despite going wildly off-topic, the main point in question is a very interesting one indeed. I'm heavily into Gothic music and wearing dark clothes and leather (no make-up or dyed hair though ), but I don't label myself as a "Goth". That's not because I'm embarassed by the title, it's just that I am equally into metal, classic rock, gothic, prog, glam and grunge/alternative. So all-in-all, I'm too varied to fit into the Goth category (or indeed any one specific genre), even though I do share a great affinity with it.

I have come across other "Goths" who claim to be Christian, but my thoughts on this are that we should consider whether they are mainly into the IMAGE, or if they are indeed into the Gothic LIFESTYLE as a whole. If it's the former, then you could mainly attribute it to youthful adolescent "I wanna rebel against mommy and daddy" rebellion. Nevertheless, if it's the latter then I do see it as a contradiction in terms.

As far as I can tell, Christianity is a life-affirming ideology. Some might say it's life-DENYING, but although I'm Agnostic/Atheist myself, I won't turn this into a rant against Christianity. However, if it's a life-affirming ideology, then it is based on, for the most part, POSITIVE values. On the other hard, Gothic culture deals with the darker side of human existence, exploring a wide range of values such as death, misanthropy and non-conformity.

Given the stark contrast between their core values, I have always seen Christianity and Goth culture as mutually-exclusive. As I iterated previously, I have met some who claim to straddle that fine line between both scenes. But personally, I've always maintained that you cannot serve two masters equally....

[Capt Ann]

OK, I guess I didn't answer because I thought you were making a comment and not asking a question.

I see the goth culture as acknowledging the 'grittier' side of life, including death, betrayal, hopelessness. It recognizes deep suffering in the world, almost to the point of despair, while noticing that others (society in general) is nearly apathetic to that suffering. It seems to say that the authority structure in place has left the world in a total mess, and now a younger generation is left to deal with the consequences, after having been given almost no tools and training for the task.

You see that view as contrary to Christianity, because you see the life-affirming aspects of Christianity, the belief that the world exists with a set purpose and a plan, that although we don't see the outcome of that plan, we can rest assured that the end will be good, because God is good, and He is the one ultimately in control of the plan.

I see the two as fitting together precisely because of the message of Christmas (kind of appropriate this time of year, eh?). The world was in such a horrid mess of despair and suffering, yet the Creator of all did not leave it that way. He stepped into that world and experienced all its hopelessness, suffering, and despair. He even dealt with the apathy of those around Him, as He suffered and died to pull those same people who couldn't care less about His suffering, from hopelessness back to hope.

This is called the message of the Incarnation. God who is infinite chose to enter time and space. God who is eternal chose to be born and to die. He did not turn His back on all us filthy, dirty, rebellious, despairing folk, and that is precisely why real Christians will not turn their backs on those who have embraced a way of life that simply acknowledges the despair and hopelessness that we're in. The real difference, though, is the Christian Goth doesn't stop with where we are (in despair and gloom), but sees where we're going (destined to become like Jesus and rise to new life).

[lordazazel]

OK, I guess I didn't answer because I thought you were making a comment and not asking a question.


Although I wasn't asking a specific question, if you read my post you can clearly see that I was contributing to the topic at hand. Something many on here unfortunately weren't. So while it was more of a statement than a random question, it was open to discussion.



I see the goth culture as acknowledging the 'grittier' side of life, including death, betrayal, hopelessness. It recognizes deep suffering in the world, almost to the point of despair, while noticing that others (society in general) is nearly apathetic to that suffering. It seems to say that the authority structure in place has left the world in a total mess, and now a younger generation is left to deal with the consequences, after having been given almost no tools and training for the task.


Yes, you are quite right in your analysis. As I said, I have no specific label and therefore feel that being categorised as a Goth would be too restrictive. Nevertheless, I do have an affinity with the scene. Generally speaking, we do despair at the way society has decayed and often feel helpless to reverse the decline. :bang:



You see that view as contrary to Christianity, because you see the life-affirming aspects of Christianity, the belief that the world exists with a set purpose and a plan, that although we don't see the outcome of that plan, we can rest assured that the end will be good, because God is good, and He is the one ultimately in control of the plan.

I see the two as fitting together precisely because of the message of Christmas (kind of appropriate this time of year, eh?). The world was in such a horrid mess of despair and suffering, yet the Creator of all did not leave it that way. He stepped into that world and experienced all its hopelessness, suffering, and despair. He even dealt with the apathy of those around Him, as He suffered and died to pull those same people who couldn't care less about His suffering, from hopelessness back to hope.


This is where I cannot agree with you. Some see the Bible as being scripted by Man, through the direct influence of God. Others see it as a historical text. I am firmly in the latter category. How accurate it is, is a subject which we can debate until the end of time. But I don't believe Jesus "died for all our sins", Jesus just died. Full stop. Take it or leave it, that's view I and many others share.



This is called the message of the Incarnation. God who is infinite chose to enter time and space. God who is eternal chose to be born and to die. He did not turn His back on all us filthy, dirty, rebellious, despairing folk, and that is precisely why real Christians will not turn their backs on those who have embraced a way of life that simply acknowledges the despair and hopelessness that we're in. The real difference, though, is the Christian Goth doesn't stop with where we are (in despair and gloom), but sees where we're going (destined to become like Jesus and rise to new life).


But that implies that if we all just sit on our asses, then all will come good in the end, when the Saviour returns. I just can't go along with that, I believe that that is a form of apathy. The future of the planet lies in OUR hands, it's up to US to change things. Under Christianity, we've had 2000 years of unrealised eschatology. When will we learn? :bang:

[Capt Ann]

But that implies that if we all just sit on our asses, then all will come good in the end, when the Saviour returns. Not at ALL!!!!!!! The good news is one of hope, that the 'goodguys' are destined to win. The world is NOT going to hell in a handbasket, and in the meantime, while we wait for the Savior to return, we are to be about the business of seeing God's "will be done" and His "kingdom come, on earth as it is in heaven".

I just can't go along with that, I believe that that is a form of apathy. The future of the planet lies in OUR hands, it's up to US to change things. Under Christianity, we've had 2000 years of unrealised eschatology. When will we learn? :bang:THANK you for saying that (and no, I am NOT being sarcastic, because it opens up a whole topic for discussion that has been filled with misunderstanding and false assumptions). Just sitting and 'looking to the sky because Jesus is returning soon' IS a form of apathy. It is also NOT Christianity. I know that current 'pop theology' teaches that the 'rapture' will happen at any second and the Christians will be whisked away while the rest of the world gets blasted for sin with judgement for 7 years. THAT is NOWHERE in the Bible, and it was taught nowhere in ANY branch of Christianity until the 1800's, almost exclusively in the UK and the US.

2000 Years of unrealized eschatology?? Hardly!! The predominant view of history before Christianity (generally, all cultures and other religions) was cyclical. Things moved in cycles, or randomly, either meandering with no purpose or aim, or through an infinite cycle of repetition. It was the Christian notion of progress (in history, theology, social science, and every other field) that led to the boon of science, political freedom, medical advances, development of the modern University system, and studies of every topic imagineable. (Bibliographical references available on request :) ) True Biblical Christian eschatology can best be summarized by this one verse in the Bible: "He told them still another parable: "The kingdom of heaven is like yeast that a woman took and mixed into a large amount of flour until it worked all through the dough." (Mt 13:33)

I had to comment on that (one of my favorite topics to discuss!), but further discussion is even farther outside this thread than the topics already wandered into ;). If you'd like to discuss it further, please let me know, and I can meet you on another thread.

[Sever]

Not very. i'd tell them to cheer up and stop listening to cradle of filth!

btw im only kidding except for the cradle of filth part. oh and the cheering up ;)OI! I don't listen to Cradle of Cack and you damn well know it! :D

[bum-eyes]

i wear my speedo's in public too.Ew.

[bum-eyes]

on a more serious note, can goths wear the hats you get in christmas crackers? if so i want to see pictures!If I get a camera in my stocking I would be glad to oblige. I probably won't be wearing my makeup then though as I'll be going to church in the morning and it would kind of kill the spirit if I walked in and started scaring the kids.
i think it would count as conformity outside of Goth acceptable standards. Well, all i can say is that they better confrom to Turkey!I will most certainly not.
A Goth girl in red? That would be weird.Red is my favourate colour. Apart from black of course. As soon as I get enough cash I'm getting my mohawks back and dying the right one bright red.

Thanks Capt Ann for your post. I agree with it in all its beautiful entirety.

[bum-eyes]

How do goths feel about emo kids stealing their 'look'? i.e. the black eyeliner and nail varnish, long hair, peircings etc? Do you see this as an expansion or a corruption of goth?

Back in the day, emo kids used to disguise themselves as skate-punks or wear big glasses and tank tops (a'la Weezer) but now they're encroaching into goth territory!I take back what I said before. Get your own bloody look.

[Ikken Hisatsu]

believe it or not ive had goths tell me i dress like a freak. a good thing though because by lordy, id never want to associate with that crowd. conformity and acceptance seeking at its worst.

[bum-eyes]

Although I’ve found a quite easy fix, wear a small black shirt that makes you look buff!
hehe much to the anger of all the skinny goth guys! :bang:

[bum-eyes]

everyones aim this christmas is to find pictures of goths wearing seasonal attire. or at least partaking in seasonal activities![link] (http://www.aspdesign.no/christ_goth/christ_goth/db666.jpg)

[Ikken Hisatsu]

this thread doesnt have NEARLY enough gay undead vikings in it

http://tyler.orcon.net.nz/ugv.gif

[lordazazel]

Talk about hijacking a thread and making it go WILDLY off-topic! :bang: Are you really so sad, that you have nothing better to do than post derogatory comments about Gothic culture and those who follow it? Tell you what, seeing as this thread is entitled "Christianity and Goths", why don't I start ripping on Christianity and the corruption, hypocrisy and child-molestation that surrounds it? Fair enough? No, didn't think so.... :rolleyes:

Oh and by the way, to you two who posted the "Xmas" link and the "Vikings" link: Black metal is NOT the same as Gothic culture. ;) If you're going to go off on someone with that degree of ignorance, then at least get your facts right. Muppets!

[bum-eyes]

Oh and by the way, to you two who posted the "Xmas" link and the "Vikings" link: Black metal is NOT the same as Gothic culture. ;) If you're going to go off on someone with that degree of ignorance, then at least get your facts right. Muppets!I googled "Christmas Goth" and that's what I got.

[lordazazel]

I googled "Christmas Goth" and that's what I got.

Then maybe if I Googled "Christianity", I would see images of altar boys being molested, civilisations being wiped-out, etc. etc. ? ;)

[Ikken Hisatsu]

http://seposition.redemption.co.nz/img/kids.jpg

fear the acne warriors!

[bum-eyes]

No, you'd get a lot of old catholic art, even though catholicism is not christianity.

[Ikken Hisatsu]

well that was easier than i expected it to be

goths are so touchy these days

[bum-eyes]

I thought the topic was pretty well settled on. Goths and Christians can be the same people.

[lordazazel]

well that was easier than i expected it to be



So this is how you like to spend your weekend, winding people up? Get a life, will you? Sad.... :rolleyes:

[bum-eyes]

I'll have to side with Ikken here. Baiting grown men into hissy fits is actually pretty fun.

[Ikken Hisatsu]

dont know if id count two posts as a weekend, but i am a bit of a slow typer at times

[lordazazel]

I'll have to side with Ikken here. Baiting grown men into hissy fits is actually pretty fun.

hahaha "hissy fits"? You really think you're that important? Sorry, but you are actually AMUSING (not angering) me with your ignorance. People like you are a fine example of why so many people like myself hate Christianity. :D

If I were to come out in attack of your religion and how it has suppressed the evolution of the human race for 2000 years, you would be the first to climb on your high horse. But keep on talking, all you clowns are doing is digging yourselves an even deeper hole with your childish games. ;)

Come to think of it, where the hell are the moderators? If this were a thread full of Gothic people attacking Christianity, rather than the other way around, you can bet your ass that the mods would be all over it like flies round dogshit. One rule for them, eh? :rolleyes:

[bum-eyes]

Where exactly was I attacking Goths again?

And where are those same mods to stop you swearing?

[lordazazel]

Where exactly was I attacking Goths again?

And where are those same mods to stop you swearing?

Oh I see, it's unacceptable to use a few "naughty" words, but perfectly OK to denounce a whole subculture of people (most of whom do no harm and are passive, intelligent individuals), is it? :rolleyes: Bigots like you and your friend are exactly why so many people are afraid to deviate from the norm in life, because the likes of you are right behind them with your childish, insecure sniping. So much for your "tolerant, compassionate and caring" belief system....

[Ikken Hisatsu]

goths arent deviants from the norm, they are just one of many cultural groups. one that is hilariously easy to make fun of :D

[lordazazel]

goths arent deviants from the norm, they are just one of many cultural groups. one that is hilariously easy to make fun of :D

Well if you'd even bothered to read my posts when we were actually ON-topic, you'd have seen that I myself am not strictly a "Goth", though I do have an affinity with the scene. And as I said above, you don't anger me. You amuse me with your adoloscent ignorance. You really need to get a life, you two. :rolleyes:

Whjat I would like to know is this, though: Just what gives you the right to think that, as a teenage, unknown run-of-the-mill Thai Boxer, you have some kind of superiority over those who are Goths? What attributes do you possess that give you the scope to "make fun of" those people? I'd love to hear it.... :D

[Ikken Hisatsu]

my dress sense for one- black is just soooo cliche

[bum-eyes]

Where exactly was I attacking Goths again?Answer me, dammit!

[iamraisen]

OI! I don't listen to Cradle of Cack and you damn well know it! :D

LOL
nice sig btw :D

[bum-eyes]

Well if you'd even bothered to read my posts when we were actually ON-topic, you'd have seen that I myself am not strictly a "Goth", though I do have an affinity with the scene. And as I said above, you don't anger me. You amuse me with your adoloscent ignorance. You really need to get a life, you two. :rolleyes:

What I would like to know is this, though: Just what gives you the right to think that, as a teenage, unknown run-of-the-mill Thai Boxer, you have some kind of superiority over those who are Goths? What attributes do you possess that give you the scope to "make fun of" those people? I'd love to hear it.... :D(spelling correction mine, hope you don't mind)

Just because Ikken has a sense of humour does not mean he has a superiority complex. Though it seems to me that you do.

Oh, and newsflash: I am a goth. I just have enough of a sense of homour to be able to laugh at my own expense.

[CKava]

lodazazel as far as Im aware Ikken is often fairly cheeky about Christians as well so I think your claim that Goths are being victimised by a bunch of Christians is a bit of wishful thinking. Mind you isn't feeling persecuted and misunderstood something that often comes up in the Gothic sub culture?

Also if you type Christianity into google I think you'll have to look through a couple of thousand pages before you find any reference to the abuses you mention but I dunno maybe you've just got a weird google.

[Ikken Hisatsu]

just for the record- im neither christian nor a goth. just someone who can take a ribbing a little better than some, obviously :D

dont make me break out the gay undead vikings wearing meat bras. it isnt pretty.

[pgm316]

Oh I see, it's unacceptable to use a few "naughty" words, but perfectly OK to denounce a whole subculture of people (most of whom do no harm and are passive, intelligent individuals), is it? :rolleyes: Bigots like you and your friend are exactly why so many people are afraid to deviate from the norm in life, because the likes of you are right behind them with your childish, insecure sniping. So much for your "tolerant, compassionate and caring" belief system....

I have been known to wear black and listen to Dimmu Borgir, but I don't see how my outfit and taste in music makes me deviate from the norm :confused:

[Sever]

LOL
nice sig btw :DThought you'd like it :D
The whole "humourless, tooootalyy unconformist, unable to take a joke, fear my evil emo" contingent of the goth scene (particularly locally) was a big contribution to why I got sick of the whole thing - well that and irritating little kiddie-goths asking me where I got whatever I was wearing. I still have the same genuine love of goth music that I've had since I first heard Bauhaus in 1994, but I just can't be bothered with the look anymore - if nothing else, this season's clothing designs are simply awful dah-ling :D

[JayKayD]

goths arent deviants from the norm, they are just one of many cultural groups. one that is hilariously easy to make fun of :D

Amen to that.


(get it... amen? ...)


Off topic slightly; bum your a complete ****, i'd just started reading the Harry Potter series after avoiding it for several years and was actually getting into it.

[iamraisen]

Off topic slightly; bum your a complete ****, i'd just started reading the Harry Potter series after avoiding it for several years and was actually getting into it.

would it help if i told you he wasnt telling you the truth? now you'll have to read it to see if i am :D

[JayKayD]

A little bit.

But someone already pulled this trick on me when Sirious Black died (bastards).

[slipthejab]

Lighten up people... Goth is harldy the first or last word in teen sub-culture. It's definitely jockying for position as the most narcissistic, melodramatic and self important group... but hey Goth packages like the one below ain't too hard on the eyes... :D

[JayKayD]

Now that helps!

*sets as wallpaper*

[iamraisen]

right click, save image as :o

just out of curiousity where did you get that image from? does it have anything to do with my friends the suicide girls?

[JayKayD]

And also; why doesn't she have any arms?

*Edit* hahahahha slip, i like the way you wrote a message, realised a few minutes later it wasn't quite as offensive as your usual standard, and so edited it.

[slipthejab]

JayKayD,
Diamonds don't truly sparkle without a bit of cut and polish. :D


And hey who says Goth's have to conform to a monochromatic standard... or even a species standard... I think mixing it up is all good...

[slipthejab]

And anyhow Goth is not so narrowly defined as some of the posters in this thread would have you believe... there is massive crossover into the rubber scene... ya know... equal opportunity - :D

[slipthejab]

Hmm... but just how far does the crossover go? Let's see how many right click this image and save as...

[slipthejab]

this one probably will get set to wallpaper on a lot of desktops.:D

[slipthejab]

ackk!!!!!
sorry wrong image loaded.

[slipthejab]

Christ my hard drive is not very organized.. sorry

[JayKayD]

Aaaaagh, make the bad man go away!

[Sever]

does it have anything to do with my friends the suicide girls?I wish some of the suicide girls were MY friends ;) Whatever happened to that thread, anyway?

[slipthejab]

whew... back on the Goth track...

[slipthejab]

hot hot hot

[iamraisen]

I wish some of the suicide girls were MY friends ;) Whatever happened to that thread, anyway?
it was removed and i was repremanded :D
no joke.

however Pm me for more info :cool:

[slipthejab]

it was removed and i was repremanded :D


raisen I am shocked at your behavior. tsk tsk. :p

[iamraisen]

raisen I am shocked at your behavior. tsk tsk. :p

it was worth it though :love:

[Sever]

it was worth it though :love:Hell yeah it was! At least I found the thread before it got binned :D

[slipthejab]

Damn. I got to somehow get a 24 hour MAP feed to my brain so I don't miss magic moments.

[iamraisen]

Damn. I got to somehow get a 24 hour MAP feed to my brain so I don't miss magic moments.

slip, you know thats how addictions start ;)

[Moosey]

Damn. I got to somehow get a 24 hour MAP feed to my brain so I don't miss magic moments.
I'm beginning to think I have got one. I came into my office on a Sunday afternoon to get some work done - but here I am... :bang:

[Sever]

slip, you know thats how addictions start ;)Hey, it's not an addiction. We can stop anytime we want. We just don't want to

[KickChick]

You really need to get a life, you two. :rolleyes:

And everyone on this thread really needs to read over our TOS .... especially you.

And slip ... enough of the pics ok??

Thread locked for a cool down