Form Practice

[baubin2]

One of the reasons I don't like practicing forms is that after a while I feel I am just waving my hands in the air and not really improving at all. And when something feels pointless I tend not to do it. So in order to make such practice feel more worthwhile, I was hoping that a few people might comment on what they concentrate on when they do their forms, and how they can tell they have improved in those areas. Also, how do you define when your form has become "better". After all, forms are a bit subjective and change from person to person; it's really impossible to lay down a standard and say that THIS is the perfect form.

One of the (obvious) things I concentrate on is making the right moves. Some other things are stancework and fluidity. When kicking, punching, or blocking I try to make sure I'm doing it with proper technique. When on one leg or jumping around (Ki Cho Hyung 6 :)) I try to make sure that I am balanced and that will not have to take time to recover my balance after the move. I know that I'm improving when I am able to follow the rest of the class, when stuff like stancework and proper technique start to come automatically and not only when I'm concentrating on it, when my stances start to feel more natural, and when I feel in-control of my body even when I have to go on one leg or spin around or both.

Are there other things I have missed that you concentrate on? How do you practice them and measure your progress? And most important of all, how do you deal with it when you feel that you honestly can't improve something any more than you have? And please don't just brush that question off with the blase statement that there is always room for improvement. We've all felt that way at one point or another, or at least I know I have.

Thanks for the input :)

[davefly76]

do you know the 5 principals of hyung?

eyes bright
mind clear
hands fast (and precise)
feet slow (and controlled)
body low

stick to these and with the correct techniques your forms will constantly improve.

unfortunatly there isn't any magic formula to improve you forms. i'm not happy with my current hyung, especially after seeing a video of a 3rd dahn performing the same form (baek pahl ki hyung) to win a gold medal. it really opened my eyes to where i was going "wrong" and where i can improve.

i bet if you were to watch yourself as a white belt doing ki cho hyung you'd laugh your socks off. i did when i saw a video of myself at my first grading.

:)

[KSW_123]

I think you are headed in the right direction.

I have two ideas for things that are easily measurable. First is low stance. If you look in the mirror, you can see the angle between the thigh and the calf. Ideally you want 90 degrees. I say look in the mirror because it is easy to think that an angle of 120 degrees feels to be 90. To get low stances you obviously need stretch and strength. I do not how strong/flexable you are so I can give a general idea of how you might proceed. If you can't do a whole form at 90 degrees and some stances come easy, make sure those stances are 90 degrees in the form. Then you could pick one stance at time to add to the pool of 90 degree stances. You may not be able to make transitions low at first, but keep on trying. I think it is better to bob up down than it is to stay high. Another thing you could try is doing all stances of one type as low as possible. I wouldn't expect to get all stances to 90 degrees overnight, but you should see measurable progress relatively quickly.

My second idea is to look at any extra steps you make. Say you are doing Cho Guep Hyung. Do you need to move the front foot back if you step forward from a low long stance, (or your back foot to the front when stepping back). Another good example is Ki Cho Hyung #5, long stance to one leg stance. Do you move the back foot there? Shifting your feet is a clue that you are not managing your weight properly. To fix this stuff practice stance changes low in front of mirror and look at your feet. You could even measure the amount of movement you make, to watch it get better over time.

My feeling is that if you are in pain you will not get bored. Low stances will hurt, but you'll never get bored pracitcing forms that way.

[ember]

Alana PSBN used to have us kneel on our right knee, with left knee up. Then without moving the head, raise the right knee into the stance. From that position (body low), do your form without raising your body out of the stance. (Obviously jumping will cause you to go higher, the point is to return to the low stance.) A mirror helps with monitoring that you return to the same low stance.

[psbn matt]

the best advice you can have for hyung is to have neet footwork and never look down. every time you step or change stance especialy from a jump kick you should never shuffle your feet or adjust you stance backwards, you allways step into a stance. eg ki cho hyung 5, when you have steped into long stance for the elbow kinfe hand you souldn't move your back foot when you raise up to the one leg balance circle knife hand. allso film yourself doing your hyung and see how much better it looks if you don't look down. if you want to see how important footwork is just look at kjn sun jin perform whan hark hyung. awsome!

[KSW_123]

And most important of all, how do you deal with it when you feel that you honestly can't improve something any more than you have? Thanks for the input :)

Frustration and boredom are negative feelings that will eat you alive if you let them get to you. If you are practicing with mostly your brain, then you will have plenty of time to question (negatively self criticize) every move you are doing. If on the other hand you make it physically difficult to get through the form, then you might find those negative feelings going away. Some things cannot be fixed by anything other than repetition, i.e. to make a form look "natural" you have to do it many times. Forcing a form to look natural is somewhat like trying to push rope up a hill. I hope this helps.

[JSun]

Forcing a form to look natural is somewhat like trying to push rope up a hill.

Great simile!

[KSW_123]

Here is another pattern that might apply.
That is, the "we can't see our own growth" pattern. I have seen this pattern in a wide variety of people and ranks. It feels horrible when you work so hard to try to get better and nothing "happens". The point is something is usually happening, just not quick enough for us to notice ourselves.

Try following ksn_matt's advice and video your form. Then put it away and video yourself in 6 months. Then you should notice a difference.

[Dahn Boh Nim]

I have have the pleasure of training with two old school masters. It is an absolute pleasure to watch them do their forms. When you get to see somone who has been doing their form for almost thirty years, it is eye opening. Every time I do forms, I try to make them better. Every so often we will spend the entire class fine tuning our forms. It makes a big difference. Does anyone out there do short forms?

[KSW_123]

Does anyone out there do short forms?
What are short forms?

[ember]

If he's referring to what I think he is, they are elements from hyung taken out and performed by themselves. One example: front kick, incover, upcover, punch (beginning of Ki Cho Hyung #1).

I haven't practiced them by myself yet, but we've done them in class occasionally.

What are short forms?