Other arts and their applications in Hapkido

[TheGnome]

I apologize if this topic has been discussed here before but I am new. My question is how many people study or have studied another art, and what those were. If Hapkido is your primary art then how do you feel your other art supplements your Hapkido techniques? Or if Hapkido is not your primary art how do you feel your Hapkido supplements your_____?

I've studied Judo and Jujitsu and find that I often use Judo techniques, especially throws, in combination with breakaways and other techniques. I found that there almost always seems to be an ashi waza (foot throw) available during wrist grab counters. Any one else? (I know many people come to Hapkido from TKD backgrounds so I'd be interested in hearing from them.)

[BackFistMonkey]

Other arts usualy have their place ..according to the orignal real deal Hapkido .. and that place is training with them so they can apply the Concepts of Hapkido correctly against them . Hapkido was all about defending against the more common combative arts of the day .

If I am wrong on this one .. please feel free to flame holy living crap out of me .

Today .. well I dont know about today's official stance on other arts . I personaly cross train alot becouse My Instructor has NO students except me who want to really learn Hapkido as a Martial Art but to their credit they do tolerate my constant demands for sparing and rolling . So to get my time doing real stand up and something more than very limited full range contact , I cross train . Some things I pick up are good .. somethings dont meld with with Hapkido ... or I cant meld them yet maybe in time .

*edit *

Aikijitsu ( spelling ) is the root of Hapkido ... I hope you can apply alot of what you know with Hapkido ... it should feel similiar in alot of aspects .

[Thomas]

I really love the core concepts of Hapkido and that is probably what has attracted me to the art. My background is Taekwondo and IHF Hapkido and ICHF Hapkido. I strongly believe in cross training in every way possible, from classes to seminars to videos and so on. I feel that a "good" art should be flexible enough that its core concepts should be able to accept techniques and strategies from all arts... maybe with a bit of modification.

Personally, my TKD gives me a great range of striking, especially in the kicking department. The (Trad) Hapkido gives me the circular movement and wide depth of techniques to escalate or de-escalate situations (ranging from locks to strikes). The Combat Hapkido provides a good core with a strong forum for bringing in different techniques from various styles and helping integrate all those "bits" into a unit.

[zac_duncan]

I started xingyiquan recently and it's made a definite impact on my hapkido. It's funny too because the arts have a lot of differences tactically but few conflicts when it comes down to the principals of the arts.

It hasn't necessarily made my hapkido better, but it has made it somewhat different. A few of the differences I've noted:


I enter a bit more aggressively than I used to.
I've also found myself using the inner gate more than I have in the past. Generally, I used to enter to the outside unless I had no choice but to take the inside. These days I still feel that the outside is tactically superior, but I'll enter the inside if it's an easier entry than outside.
I have a little better control over the ranges and have better comfort moving between them.
I tend to pay more attention to my center line in close fighing situations.
I'm finding that in sparring situations, I prefer attack over defense. It's a generalization and wrong in many instances, but for the most part hapkido is reactive and focused on defense while xingyi is aggressive and forused on offense. I'm finding that I prefer the "attacking" mindset.
I'm also having better luck setting up sweeps, takedowns etc in sparring situations. I'm not really sure why, perhaps because I'm taking the offensive and getting people of balance.
Also, the aggressive, straight line approach of xingyi has helped illustrate the beauty of the rounded smooth movements of hapkido.


It's not like these things aren't things I haven't studied in hapkido, its more an issue of perspective. Looking at conflict through a different tactical point of view has helped a lot of those things "click".

That said, xingyi is agressive, but not a "hard" style. It never blocks hard or meets force with force. I think if I had taken up style that was harder, I think it would probably introduce more contrasts than compliments.

[Hapkid0ist]

I have 2 other schools of Hap Ki Do under me, one TKD based the other Muai Thai based, my primary is mor KF influinced. I have also studied Western Boxing and wrestling, Kajukenbo, Japanese JJ, Muai Thai, TKD, Wing Chun, Military combatives, Okinowan Shorin Ryu, a little bit of Yudo, Monkey KF(don't know why) and I find they all, with the exceptinon of Monkey KF fit very well and floww very well with my Hapkido. As was said Hap Ki Do is an art that was developed to fight against other martial arts, primarily Judo/Yudo back in the day.

Here is a little Article (Author unknown)

HAPKIDO: THE ANTI-MARTIAL ART MARTIAL ART

Hapkido is culturally patterned Japanese aiki-jiu jitsu and by that, I certainly don't mean to demean either hapkido or aiki-jiu jitsu. I mean it the same way that you might say that karate is culturally patterned Chinese kung fu.

To my mind, hapkido is all aiki-jiu jitsu is and more, because it includes striking and kicking refined to a degree not found in any other art - whether Chinese, Korean or Japanese. However, many people are unaware of one aspect of this versatile art and that is: it was specifically modified to cope with other martial arts. By that I mean that many of its techniques work best when another martial artist is using classical techniques against the hapkido practitioner.

The first student of hapkido was a well-known Korean judoka by the name of Suh Bok Sup. One day, in the late forties, Suh saw the 'Father of Hapkido' Choi Yong Sool, in action and afterwards asked him about his fighting system. Choi explained that he was practising 'hap ki yu sool', and Suh was so impressed by what he had seen that he asked Choi to teach him. Suh went on to become Choi's first black belt and helped the latter open his first school in Taegu City, Korea.

Suh was initially interested in learning how to adapt Choi's art so he could use it against judoka. This is an important point that is often missed, even though one of the first things a novice hapkido student learns is defence against various holds. But look at some of the holds taught! They make little sense without the link to judo! Why, for example, are hapkido students taught to defend against a grab made to the sleeve near the wrist? This is not likely to happen in the street though, along with grabs to the lapel, collar, armpit or shoulder, it would be used by a judoka attempting to throw you!

Defence against judokas was the first thing Suh wanted to use his hap ki yu sool against and that is why responses to judo grabs remain the first thing hapkido novices learn today!

Hapkido is also uniquely structured to respond to sword attacks. Kumdo (the Korean rendering of 'kendo') was very popular in Korea after World War II and Suh decided he wanted his art to cope with that too. This is why modern hapkido contains a selection of techniques suitable for use against the stick ('dan bong') - techniques that were originally devised for use against the bamboo or oak sword.

Hapkido knife defence was developed because the carrying of guns by Koreans was outlawed, so knives were used a great deal by the criminal fraternity.

Defences against kicks were incorporated to equip hapkido practitioners to deal with students of tang soo do/kong soo do, kwon bop and later, taekwondo. Interestingly, the earliest forms of these largely Japanese-influenced systems used only three kicks - the front kick, side kick and turning kick, so the earliest hapkido defences were designed to counter those. Later, of course, as the striking styles diverged from their karate ancestor, so the wealth of kicks increased.

In exactly the same way, defences were developed to counter the Japanese- influenced standard lunge- and reverse punches, both of which leave the arms at full extension. Nowadays, of course, people don't fight like that. Punches are snapped back afterwards but, at the time when hapkido defences were being originated, taekwondo players were taught always to lock their arms straight. There was no competition, so confrontations between striking styles took the form of prearranged sparring. Though prearranged, these duels were often quite bloody affairs as one academy sought to prove it could thrust its lunge punch through the opponent's block and on, into his face! Hapkido worked very well in such confrontations and the extended fist was avoided, grasped, harmonised with and destroyed!

Then Ji Han Jae looked at the way boxers throw punches and developed hapkido defences to those too. This happened because Ji's Seoul dojang was right next to a boxing academy! If it hadn't been for that, hapkido practitioners would still be trying to cope with jabs using defences meant for locked-elbow punches.

I hope this short essay on part of the historical development of hapkido will lead to a deeper understanding of the techniques used in today's hapkido dojang.

[bvermillion]

I also came to Hapkido from Taekwondo. I also wrestled in high school and trained in BJJ. Most recently I started training at a school teaching muay thai. My instructor also teaches classes in Karate (which I take no part in, mostly kids), self defense (mostly based on jjj) and grappling (sambo and bjj mix). I also continue to train in hkd but only verly limited due to schedule. I haven't been doing muay thai long enough to incorporate aspects of hkd into it therefore I don't really know of any applications. But I routinely incorporate hkd into grappling. I have used alot of the body mechanics principles learned in hkd along with small joint manipulations to my advantage in bjj. I have never really used a hapkido type takedown to get to the ground while grappling though. My old bjj instructor had me teaching a self defense class on saturdays to his bjj students which was based soley on hapkido. In my opinion hkd is bar none the best art for self defense when properly trained and executed.

[Alexander]

I'll answer this from the opposite direction.

Since the style of Hapkido I do has no free sparring I don't consider myself a Hapkido fighter - just someone who happens to know Hapkido moves. However I've found that I've been able to spot many of Hapkido's throws and joint locks in my 'primary' arts of Tae Kwon-Do and Shotokan Karate, hidden in the patterns and Kata.

So I think that Hapkido has improved my interpretation of the other arts I do massively, and probably means that my performance in patterns and Kata has become more focused because of the better mental imagery I now have.

[JimH]

My belief is that long ago the arts were more full,more every range effective,over time the masters or instructors worked what they enjoyed most and left the other stuff behind.

Hapkido ,for example, is workable in all ranges ,as was Daito Ryu aiki jitsu,my belief is that since Suh was a judo palyer Choi began working defenses against judo players with Suh and from there they branched out to dealing with other popular martial arts to be found in Korea at that time,I believe Choi was more advanced in his knowledge and in his ranges of fighting but for Suh's needs they were not relevant,he was already a grappler,a judo player.(had Suh been a Kung fu player,where would the art of hapkido been led)

Tae Kwon Do became a mostly foot/leg art,but it stayed with in the linear concepts of its Japanese predecessors, like Shotokan,but the forms do denote an aspect of grabbing,pulling,take downs and strikes to the opponents limbs and on the ground,so the art of TKD/shotokan at some point also held aspects of Hapkido or a grappling art,it was just phased out along the way.

I believe in cross training,not because Hapkido is ineffective,(it is a multi range art and is usable in all situations if the situations are trained),but to understand how to fight an opponent of some other art ,or style, we must learn their way and then be able to apply our main stay art against them.
(this was, as said,the method Choi and Suh used in developing the needs of what we now do in the art we call Hapkido)

Many Hapkidoists have a background in TKD as many aikidoists have a background in a linear art such as Shotokan.

The circular and the linear compliment each other well,but as said I believe they were always mixed and some how became seperated due to the likes and dislikes of certain masters.