Do you Carry and Why

[drunkenmonkey]

Don't wat to start a war or anything just curious if anyone else out there carries a knife for self defense situations that may warrant such defense. If you don't or feel it's in bad taste lets here your opinion too. This way we see both sides of the issue.

Play nice everyone.

[rogue]

I never carry a knife as a weapon.

[clemsontkd]

im often near or in downtown Clemson. Youd be hardpressed to find a sober person there with a variety of bars. They arent very nice drunks either. Its usually more for a scare tactic, i would never use it on a human except for last resort.

[Hobbitlauncher]

well, currently I live in a po-dunk little useless town so I don't carry anything. On the job I carry an mp5 or whatever im issued for teh given post (now thats job security, or is that a security job? =P ) anyway I think if I were to live anywhere that i felt protection was needed, i would get whatever protection best fits the situation, In most cases a good hard stick and a taser or something.

[Wax]

Don't carry anything. Sydney isn't the most dangerous city in the world and if anyone ever pulls something on me I'll just run.

[Ripchord]

I personally dont carry a knife or any other weapon for the simple fact that taking one into a real life fight situation creates the possiblity that it can be wrestled away from you, and used against you, which would suck. Also by boldly brandishing a weapon you may escalate the fight to a level that may lead to a tragic loss of life.
Then again it may be a good idea to carry one in reserve if you ever find yourself in a situation where your life is in clear danger. I would definitly appreaciate having a knife then.

[Hobbitlauncher]

I personally dont carry a knife or any other weapon for the simple fact that taking one into a real life fight situation creates the possiblity that it can be wrestled away from you, and used against you, which would suck. Also by boldly brandishing a weapon you may escalate the fight to a level that may lead to a tragic loss of life.
Then again it may be a good idea to carry one in reserve if you ever find yourself in a situation where your life is in clear danger. I would definitly appreaciate having a knife then.

agreed, I wouldn't even consider carrying anything unless i thought i was proficient at not only using it but not letting the enemy get it


and quite obviously, if you don't need it don't pull it like a lunatic or you'll go from :woo: to :Angel: quick

[reikislapper]

I carry a knife, I know I shouldn't as my brother has not so long since been to court for it and thankfully not been sent down. It does carry a sentence upto 2 yrs so my brother come off very lightly as he's got a conditional discharge for 2 yrs and has had the knife destroyed which I thought was amusing at the time.
You see the police do know that I have a knife on my keyring and they've had my bunch of keys quite a few times but never said anything so I've not let on. I have also even managed to take one into court which I know I could have got into serious trouble and I was with the C.I.D. at the time as they had took us for a look around the place before a court case started. At the time I really didn't give a toss what happened but things have changed now ;) ;) ;) . I wouldn't encourage anyone to do the same as I was very lucky to get away with it at the time and I did admit it afterwards and got a good telling off from the copper friends I have now lol, it just shows they care and I took it like a good little girl that I am :Angel: not lol.
lisa xx

[pgm316]

im often near or in downtown Clemson. Youd be hardpressed to find a sober person there with a variety of bars. They arent very nice drunks either. Its usually more for a scare tactic, i would never use it on a human except for last resort.

I'd only carry a weapon I was happy to use. Problem is if you use it as a scare tactic you don't know what the response will be and you've lost the element of surprise, like shaking your fist before a fight saying "I'm gonna punch you!".

How will they respond? Will they try and scare you back, with a gun? Knife? Stick? Leaving you in the awkward position of needing to use the knife.

I don't and have never carried a knife.

[beef]

Nope don't carry any weapons. Wouldn't want to use them. If you carry them and have to use them and kill someone you may not be able to claim in in self-defence as you were knowingly and willingly carry it with the intent of possibly killing someone.

[thepunisher]

Don't wat to start a war or anything just curious if anyone else out there carries a knife for self defense situations that may warrant such defense. If you don't or feel it's in bad taste lets here your opinion too. This way we see both sides of the issue.


..in my bag whenever I used to go to work Nightshifts some months ago. But that was because it was late at Night and the area I worked at wasn't the most secure- Northern line close to Aldgate station. I prefer not not to carry weapons though- one other reason I decided to take up karate. And a knife is definitley out of the question although when I was in Belgium I used to carry my pen knife around, especially when heading towards Gare du midi, as that is one of the most dangerous areas in Brussels.

Christian

[pj_goober]

you used to carry nunchuku, before you started martial arts? there not exactly the easiest of weapons to use at the best of times! definately not what i'd want on me if i desperately needed a weapon, for any reason.

I never carry a knife, as i know i wouldn't be prepared to use it, and if you ever did use a knife in "self defence" then you'd almost certainly be going down - which is not good.
That said i'm often carrying a hockeystick, squash rachet, bokken, big bag full of heavy stuff. all of which could and would be used in self defence if the need arose.

[Bil Gee]

I would never carry a weapon, it just puts you in a loose-loose situation. You either get the weapon taken off you and used against you, or you succesfully use the weapon and then have to face prosecution. Or you simply get stopped by the police and searched and again have to face prosecution.

If an area was so dangerous that I couldn't go into it without a weapon, I wouldn't go into it.

[adouglasmhor]

I used to carry a knife all the time, it saved ruining the edge on my bayonet :) but now I am a a civy I never carry weapons other than training weapons safely in a bag. I do have a good Irish walking stick if I have to go out late at night though, old codgers like me can sometimes slip in the dark.

[CosmicFish]

I carry a tiny penknife as part of a small folding tool-set (need to use a small blade and screwdriver regularly as part of my job). It would take at least five fiddly seconds to get out, and struggles to slice through a banana so it's obviously not a weapon!

I'm against carrying weapons. Once people start arming themselves then it simply causes things to escalate.

[Matt_Bernius]

Its usually more for a scare tactic, i would never use it on a human except for last resort.Then, honestly, you shouldn't be carrying it. Scare tactics are a terrible reason to be carrying, because they mean that you need to bring a weapon into play that you're not prepared to use. And that's another variable where something can go wrong.

You either get the weapon taken off you and used against you, or you succesfully use the weapon and then have to face prosecution.I want to debunk the first part of that statement. Once deployed, it's tough to remove a weapon from someone's hands. Especially if they are committed to use it. Anyone who works in a weapons based systems will back this up. So the idea that one shouldn't bring a weapon because it can be taken away and used against you notion just isn't true. However the back part of Bil's statement is correct.

As for myself, I used to carry knifes. I don't any more, it was too much of a hassel. Plus is you are carrying you need to make sure that what ever you are carrying is in a deployable position.

Now adays I don't pack a specific weapon. But I almost always have pens, pencils, keys and a cell phone on me. And that's enough for me to have something to rely upon if I really need help.

- Matt

[Legless_Marine]

Don't wat to start a war or anything just curious if anyone else out there carries a knife for self defense situations that may warrant such defense. If you don't or feel it's in bad taste lets here your opinion too. This way we see both sides of the issue.
Play nice everyone.

To paraphrase Heinlein, "An armed man becomes stupid". He ignores other options available to him, and is more likely to engage in direct confrontation.


"I know how good a gun feels. It makes you bright-eyed and bushy-tailed, 3 meters tall and covered with hair. You're ready for anything and kind of hoping you'll find it. Which is exactly what is dangerous about it-because you aren't anything of the sort. You are a feeble, hairless embryo, remarkably easy to kill. You could carry an assault gun with 2,000 meters precision range and isotope charges that will blow up a hill, but you would not have eyes in the back of your head... nor be able to see in the dark .... Death can cuddle up behind you while you're drawing a bead on something in front. "

- Tunnel in the sky

[Sever]

I never carry a weapon. The nearest thing I have is a key and wallet chain (if it came to it, I could get some pretty serious whip with the key chain), I've always got a pen on me and I pretty much always wear steel-toed boots, but I'd certainly never carry a knife or similar, particularly for a "scare tactic." As has been said, never carry something you're not completely prepared and able to use
When I was at school, a guy in my year group used to carry a folding knife (this was about ten or eleven years ago, now I'd bet a lot more people at my school carry blades - damn I feel old suddenly! :cry: ). He'd make a point of everyone knowing he had it, he'd try his best to get pick fights with people at lunchbreaks etc, then flash the handle or something similar to make them back down (my school wasn't what you'd describe as well-supervised at breaks) so he could walk around, acting like the big man. He did this outside school too. He got stabbed to death before he graduated school (and we graduate at 16 in the UK)

[drunkenmonkey]

To paraphrase Heinlein, "An armed man becomes stupid". He ignores other options available to him, and is more likely to engage in direct confrontation.



First off only a stupid man arms himself without prior training and an idea of how to use the knife ion the situation. If trained correctly in knife fighting you have already been taught empty hand tactics then trained to use the knife as an extension of you thus you cover the normal lines of attack with a razor sharp extention to your attacks. A weapon is not called for in all situations but if we're gonna quote

the smartest man I know told me this " I'd rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it"
Train in the tactics your enimeis use so that even if you don't use them you can defend against them because you will know to see them. Muggers, assailints crazy family members whatever it is they don't have name tags that say "wako with knife" ..."wacko without knife". I prefer to be prepared. :Angel:

[Crimson_Stone]

"I know how good a gun feels. It makes you bright-eyed and bushy-tailed, 3 meters tall and covered with hair. You're ready for anything and kind of hoping you'll find it. Which is exactly what is dangerous about it-because you aren't anything of the sort. You are a feeble, hairless embryo, remarkably easy to kill. You could carry an assault gun with 2,000 meters precision range and isotope charges that will blow up a hill, but you would not have eyes in the back of your head... nor be able to see in the dark .... Death can cuddle up behind you while you're drawing a bead on something in front. "

- Tunnel in the sky



The only thing I agree with is how good a gun feels. Robert A. Heinlein needs to spend a bit more time with his gun and learning a bit more about his abilities and the world around him.

As a competitive shooter I take pride in my abilities, as a handgun safety instructor I take pride in the strict respect I have for firearms. I carry both a knife and a concealed handgun. I don't become Superman when I have my gun any more so than when I do not. It may have to do wtih the amount of time I spend shooting or the fact that I have been around firearms all my life, whichever the novelty has worn off. A gun is just another tool, just like a sword, a knife, or your fists.

As for the struggles between life and death, that is affected by one's awareness. A bad situation is a bad situation. A weapon may help one escape or succeed, but it's far better to never find one's self in a bad situation.

Far too often these threads rely on the 'what if' situations when you need to be considering the events that lead up to the 'what if' situation, and your own abilities encite or negate a bad situation.

Now everyone go read SunTzu.

PS
Mace is far better than a knife in a fight, if you keep your wits.

[billz]

I carry a Spyderco Waved Endura. Part of our training, among other weapons, include the use of knives as a defensive weapon. I would not go to my blade if other less drastic devices would work in the given situation. But, that being said, if I went to it, I would use it.

[drunkenmonkey]

I carry siegel kerambit and as well I would only use it as a last reort in a situation

[The Student]

I can't believe no-one has said it yet.

"The best weapon I could have with me is my brain."

Conclude that as you will, it can mean lots of things.

[tekkengod]

I always carry a butterfly knife {5 inch blade} or a folder {3 inch blade} if i go out and about, just a good habit.

[Bil Gee]

I can't believe no-one has said it yet.

"The best weapon I could have with me is my brain."

Conclude that as you will, it can mean lots of things.

My money is on the guy who chooses the UZI

[Davey Bones]

im often near or in downtown Clemson. Youd be hardpressed to find a sober person there with a variety of bars. They arent very nice drunks either. Its usually more for a scare tactic, i would never use it on a human except for last resort.

Dude, you do realize that, statistically speaking, if you draw a weapon and don't have the balls to use it, it most likely ends up (a) being used against you or (b) if he has a bigger weapon you get messed up, right?

[NeonxBurst]

I personally carry a folder, but then I'm a farm kid and I work all day and I use it for work, but I wouldn't take it to school. But I know for a fact that my relatives in TX and NM (USA) all carry atleast a 45 and have no second thought about blowing someone away with it, but hell, it's legal there.

[Ghoul]

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Student
I can't believe no-one has said it yet.

"The best weapon I could have with me is my brain."

Conclude that as you will, it can mean lots of things.


well it is your best weapon but if you cant control your tounge it can also be your worst enemy, (speaking as someone who mosked his attacker and angred him into beating on one of my friends (though not me curiousley)


when i was younger, i used to be very jumpy, and would have one pocket full of razor blades incase anyone tryed to force me to empty my pockets and verious other booby traps about my person

but have grown up alot since then
not exactly a weapon, but i often wear iron wrist guards, (more for the estetics thay just look so darn cool ;) )

[Lennert]

I never carry a weapon, I'm much to confident fighting without one.. If in some coincidence I had a knife in my hand at the the start of a fight I would most probably throw it away and make a fist :o
I do train the disarming techniques a bit extra to be able to counter weapons..

[Wynnston]

Just some observations but two things strike me;

A lot of people who carry are younger, often still at school and probably in the age range of 15-20. School isn't optional so some of the people there would probably not mix with everyone else once they leave - they'll either be dead from fighting, in prison or running about in a gang fighting each other rather than everyone else (hopefully).

A lot of people who carry / have carried are from America and places other than the UK. I guess it's different comfort zone WRT weapons compared to the UK.

[slipthejab]

"I know how good a gun feels. It makes you bright-eyed and bushy-tailed, 3 meters tall and covered with hair. You're ready for anything and kind of hoping you'll find it. Which is exactly what is dangerous about it-because you aren't anything of the sort. You are a feeble, hairless embryo, remarkably easy to kill."



LOL! That is classic. That about sums it up. :D


I love it... threads like this alway bring out the tough guys who pack this and carry that and are prepared to do this and would do that...

BHWAHAHAHHAAAAAAA!!!!!!!

WHAT A LOAD OF PAP!!!

You're stroking yourselves. Give your insecurities a rest and use your brain.

I carry a knife just about every day... it's part of work.. it's a tool... the times when I have had some kind of hassle I made an express point of handing it over to a friend and just dealing with the problem. I can deal with anyone who wants to step up and get some... if I can't then I will have avoided that situation long before it happens.. it's called being aware of your environment and having command presence. Failing any of that... I can outsprint most people. :D

All this tough guy/gear-freak jabber about who packs this and who's rollin' with that is fantasy nonsense.

I'd suggest before you end up stabbing someone and or end up cutting yourself you get yourself to a first aid/CPR class and learn how to help people out instead. Everything always seems to make so much sense before hand... it's aftewards when you're up on charges and looking at jail time that you'll realize how little you know about the law and life and the seriousness of carrying a weapon.

Everyone thinks they can deal with emotionally with stabbing someone... but it's primarily psuedo tough guy talk... a verbal self inflicted handjob. Go work in a ER room or on an ambulance as an EMT or a medic and deal with this stuff on a daily basis and then maybe someone will take all the blab seriously.
Or look at the number of ignorant kids that have been railroaded because they were caught carrying...

Grow up.

[El Tejon]

Carry a knife, but not as a weapon. I carry a pistol for a weapon.

slip, we call that "Problem #2". You're right, many do not realize the extent of bad stuff that will fall down upon them for harming a fellow human being.

[Britzy]

Carry a knife, but not as a weapon.


Huh? why carry a knife if not as a weapon?

[oldshadow]

I carry a knife as a tool most every day of my life. I have carried a pocketknife daily starting at about 12 years old. I have trained and can use it in a “self-defense” situation as required. I mainly just think of it as part of the normal things I carry for every day life as a comb, ect. I carry a firearm as a self-defense item when I feel the need.

[Jang Bong]

I've never carried a knife (or any other 'recognisable' weapon), but in our training in defence against knives we are told that there are a lot of people {using the word lightly - 'thugs' would be better} that do. N.B - UK resident here, so I'm not commenting on whatever our American friends need to defend against ;)

What we are told in training (after run away ) is that when a weapon comes on the scene then you are in danger of your life and should act that way - all bets are off, and limbs will be destroyed. :woo: That's just a comment for those that would consider a knife as a "scare tactic".

My left knee sometimes gives me problems, so I'll happily carry on walking the streets with my walking stick. ;)

[drunkenmonkey]

LOL! That is classic. That about sums it up. :D


I love it... threads like this alway bring out the tough guys who pack this and carry that and are prepared to do this and would do that..
BHWAHAHAHHAAAAAAA!!!!!!!

WHAT A LOAD OF PAP!!!

You're stroking yourselves. Give your insecurities a rest and use your brain.

First of all this isn't just people trying to be tuff some of us have had real life street expierence like growing up in them.I have been and have stabbed people attacking me before and if need be i'll do it again.

I carry a knife just about every day... it's part of work.. it's a tool... the times when I have had some kind of hassle I made an express point of handing it over to a friend and just dealing with the problem. I can deal with anyone who wants to step up and get some... if I can't then I will have avoided that situation long before it happens.. it's called being aware of your environment and having command presence. Failing any of that... I can outsprint most people. :D
Yeah when you hand over the knife then I'll get mine out and no amount of whatever it is you use to difuse the situation is gonna tell you I have years of expierence with this thing i'm holding and I'm waiting with baited breath for you to try limb distruction so I can get you with in reach of my blade and free hand. And I can throw my knife faster than you can run. but how are you gonna diffuse the situation whe I jump out of a car or alley or inbetween cars in a lot and you have 3 seconds before i'm on you. And yes people do train for this it is possible to deflect a suprise attack but you have to train in a real MARTIAL ART.


I'd suggest before you end up stabbing someone and or end up cutting yourself you get yourself to a first aid/CPR class and learn how to help people out instead. Everything always seems to make so much sense before hand... it's aftewards when you're up on charges and looking at jail time that you'll realize how little you know about the law and life and the seriousness of carrying a weapon.

If your gonna carry know how to use it or you just a moron so thats that for cutting yourself. As for charges well the sad truth is 2 things first I'd rather be in front of A judge than THE judge so i'm stabbing punching kicking and all around screwin up your world first if you attack me then if your still with us we can have a chat its called staying alive. Second if your visciously attack and you "incapacitate" this P.O.S that just attacked you A) I aint gonna help hime and B) I'm pretty much done so I don't need to stick around.

Everyone thinks they can deal with emotionally with stabbing someone... but it's primarily psuedo tough guy talk... a verbal self inflicted handjob

Although there may be alot of wannabe's on this site I know some of these people have seen the real stuff and have participated in some lesser than humane defenses against an attack so before you bash everyone think about the fact some of us have before and we know. It' not just kids on this site. :rolleyes:

[akitaka]

Why have a knife when you can have Karate Keys (http://www.donrearic.com/images/fistload16karatekey.jpg)?

But really, car keys. Put the blade of it between your middle/ring fingers, and BAM. Modified knuckle-spike. You can add more spikes with more keys; personally two is enough for me.

[TheMadhoose]

I only carry a 2 inch folding knife for work porpouses.
A knife for self defence is cowardly
Pull a knife ya gotta be prepared to kill with it

[El Tejon]

A weapon is smart. Denial is not a defense. It is cowardly to deny reality and live in a fantasy world of warriors and samauris.

Britzy, the primary purpose of my knife is a tool to separate matter, i.e. cutt stuff, not people. Weapon use is merely secondary. I prefer the standoff capacity of a pistol.

[Kali-Raven]

i carry a kobutan which on my keys never had to use it but if im ever in a situation which i know isnt lookin too good for me at least ill have it to hand

[bassai]

I've never carried as i 've always felt if you have a weapon you WILL use it,and that can land you in a world of trouble.

[NeonxBurst]

Knife self defence cowardly? WHY?! It's like anything else, if it helps you keep your ass outta a coffin I dont find that cowardly at all!

[|MT|omar]

I can't stand weapons, that's why i took up Muay Thai. I dont want to know how to use one, coz if i did and i lost my temper i'd do something regretful

[spacefuzz]

I dont carry a knife, dont have quite enough training to feel I could use one effectivly. Was always told in fma class that if you get into a fight with a knife prepare to get cut, even if you win. A friend of mine killed someone with a knife and it still bothers him 30 years later.

I carry a kubiton, might not be as effective but its still would help if I needed to defend myself.

[drunkenmonkey]

I dont carry a knife, dont have quite enough training to feel I could use one effectivly. Was always told in fma class that if you get into a fight with a knife prepare to get cut, even if you win. A friend of mine killed someone with a knife and it still bothers him 30 years later.

I carry a kubiton, might not be as effective but its still would help if I needed to defend myself.


My instructor has reminded us on several occassions that if you fight with a knife the general rule is your gonna get cut hands down end of story...unless the other guy is totally incompetent. :Alien:

[creswell]

frightening - im glad i dont live in america - all you donuts carrying this and packing that. paranoid nation..............

[Matt_Bernius]

frightening - im glad i dont live in america - all you donuts carrying this and packing that. paranoid nation..............Didn't you know its the wild west out here. I typically have to shiv 3-4 people just to get to my car in the morning.

- Matt

[spacefuzz]

frightening - im glad i dont live in america - all you donuts carrying this and packing that. paranoid nation..............

stay away from texas then. Isnt there one town in Utah that requires you to own a gun? Probobly not many mugings there.

[Sheyja]

I never carry weapons. If it goes wrong it might be used on me, if it goes right I might have to use it.
If everyone starts carrying weapons we lose the skill of fighting, people just stabbing people cos they're too scared to take an asswhooping. Or shooting people, even less skillful!
If you can't fight with your body, you shouldn't pick up a substitute. Weapons should be learnt after you can fight without them, and even then you shouldn't take a weapon out just in case someone attacks you. That's a reason people do martial arts.
If someone pulled a knife on me in a fight I'd consider it disasterous. Someone's gonna get much more hurt than they need to be.

[Sheyja]

I personally carry a folder, but then I'm a farm kid and I work all day and I use it for work, but I wouldn't take it to school. But I know for a fact that my relatives in TX and NM (USA) all carry atleast a 45 and have no second thought about blowing someone away with it, but hell, it's legal there.

Damn i sure am glad I don't live in America! Talk about the most violent place on the planet! Did they kill many kids in Texas under nine this year?!

[Matt_Bernius]

If everyone starts carrying weapons we lose the skill of fighting, people just stabbing people cos they're too scared to take an asswhooping.Sheyja,

I think you might want to rethink that type of broadsweeping statement as it's the type of thing people who train in the FMA and other weapons based systems tend to take kinda personal. :)

- Matt

[StoneDog]

Texas isn't that violent. I'd rather walk around just about any place in Texas unarmed than NYC or east LA where law abidding citizens are not allowed to carry weapons. As they say, an armed society is a polite society. :) It's funny how people in Europe and Asia think America is an inherently violent place. But hey, if it somehow keeps illegal immigration down then so be it. We're allowed to protect ourselves (and not even 100% of the time) but it is very illegal to go and pick a fight. Add a weapon into the mix an it's a felony, plain and simple. It's only legal to "blow someone away" in Texas if they are defending life, family and possibly property. What's wrong with that?

Back on topic, I often carry a one-hander like a Spyderco but only because it's a handy tool. Where I grew up men carried some sort of folding knife - not because it was a weapon but because it had real utilitarian value. I really don't think I'd use it in self defense unless it was as some sort of last resort to escape a hold - and that's assuming I could even reach it. Lacerate a calf, quad or bicep - that sort of thing.

Jon

[creswell]

well i guess this is a topic that we feel strongly about in the UK. I certainly do - but my real thoughts on this matter are too strong for a public forum. Filipino martial arts/ kali/ arnis are exactly that, an art - pulling a blade on someone isnt. Carrying a blade/tool for self defence is just pathetic (and thats putting it mildly)...it doesnt solve the issue or protect anyone it just escalates the situation - and as sheyja said someones gonna get hurt badly. My friends brother was on life support last year from multiple stab wounds that came about from an argument over a girl....theres no art in that - its attempted murder....and i feel such discussion have no place on a martial arts forum.

Just my thoughts.

[StoneDog]

I may be coming late to this discussion, but it does beg the question of art vs defense. If the only reason I study MA is so that one day I may survive a mugging or home invasion, or more importantly protect my wife and children, that's one thing. In that case one could argue that training with a firearm is faster, more efficient, more effective and cheaper. The idea is to put down the threat as quickly and safely as possible - not to make use of years of physical conditioning simply because one has trained in a certain style. If I study Muay Thai or even TKD for years and use it to stop a home invader, am I more honorable, intelligent or successful than if I used a shotgun? Do I get more points? No. This isn't a game. The goal is to neutralize the enemy. Period.

But, to most people MA is about more than just defense and rightfully so. The physical and mental benefits are far more important than the increased probability of them successfully defending themselves in the (usually) rare case where a real threat has presented itself. EDIT: I am not trying to belittle the fact that some people that study MA actually need and use what they've learned for legitimate purposes on the job or on the street. :)

Be careful with generalizations. Thugs carrying knives and guns is not the same as a law abidding citizen that realizes evil exists and tries to prepare himself/herself accordingly.

Jon

[NewLearner]

Damn i sure am glad I don't live in America! Talk about the most violent place on the planet! Did they kill many kids in Texas under nine this year?!

I hope that was your attempt at sarcasm. America is hardly as violent as many other places.

[El Tejon]

Carrying weapons makes you "lose the skill in fighting"??? Ummm, weapons are for fighting!

Weapons are inert pieces of metal and wood. They have no will. They can be used to protect or to harm without cause depending on the individual's will.

[Matt_Bernius]

Carrying weapons makes you "lose the skill in fighting"??? Ummm, weapons are for fighting!

Weapons are inert pieces of metal and wood. They have no will. They can be used to protect or to harm without cause depending on the individual's will.

Told you so:

Sheyja,

I think you might want to rethink that type of broadsweeping statement as it's the type of thing people who train in the FMA and other weapons based systems tend to take kinda personal. :)

- Matt

- Matt

[Scarmiglione]

I hope that was your attempt at sarcasm. America is hardly as violent as many other places.

Y'know compared to Rwanda, and Iraq :rolleyes:

[tellner]

I never carry weapons. If it goes wrong it might be used on me,

Very unlikely if you are really in fear for your life and act accordingly.

if it goes right I might have to use it.

If you have to use it, then you are infinitely better off with it than without it.

If everyone starts carrying weapons we lose the skill of fighting, people just stabbing people cos they're too scared to take an asswhooping. Or shooting people, even less skillful!

So a woman should let herself be raped rather than use a weapon on the scumbag who's trying to stick his penis in her body? Muggers will fight fairly like Manly Men(tm), but if one of them puts you in the hospital you should take that ass whipping like a little man because it's the sporting thing to do?

Like they say in my neighborhood "Nigga, please!"

If you can't fight with your body, you shouldn't pick up a substitute. Weapons should be learnt after you can fight without them, and even then you shouldn't take a weapon out just in case someone attacks you. That's a reason people do martial arts.

Why shouldn't you use a weapon if you're afraid of getting hurt? Are you bigger and stronger than most people you know and afraid they might be able to match you if they cheat and use a tool? We still have those opposable thumbs for a reason. They made us the premier large animal on the planet. I don't eat with my bare hands. Why in the world would I drive off predators with them?

If someone pulled a knife on me in a fight I'd consider it disasterous. Someone's gonna get much more hurt than they need to be.

It certainly would be disastrous. Probably for you. Which is why I'd much rather defend myself with a tool than without.

You'll notice I'm talking about self defence here (the subject of this forum). I'm not talking about guys standing up, folding their hands and beating each other into submission according to the unwritten rules of fair play for status and breeding rights. That's an informal sporting contest. I'm talking about defending your loved ones, life, health and property when someone wants to do a crime.

[drunkenmonkey]

"Why shouldn't you use a weapon if you're afraid of getting hurt? Are you bigger and stronger than most people you know and afraid they might be able to match you if they cheat and use a tool? We still have those opposable thumbs for a reason. They made us the premier large animal on the planet. I don't eat with my bare hands. Why in the world would I drive off predators with them?"

exactly thats beautiful man it gets exactly to the point. :love:

"You'll notice I'm talking about self defence here (the subject of this forum). I'm not talking about guys standing up, folding their hands and beating each other into submission according to the unwritten rules of fair play for status and breeding rights. That's an informal sporting contest. I'm talking about defending your loved ones, life, health and property when someone wants to do a crime."

The hard core UFC fans that aboud in forums like these cannot seem to grasp this concept...once again genuis dude :)

[StoneDog]

Amen!

This isn't two blokes in fistcuffs after a football game or some sort of childish school-boy revenge. The merits and characteristics of that type of altercation should be discussed elsewhere. That behaviour is not that far removed from the typical "thug" that everyone thinks lurks on every American street corner...

Self defense is first about avoiding attacks against your family and loved ones, whether it's a robbery, a rape, home invasion, car jacking, etc. Second it's about putting down that threat as quicky and powefully as possible if the threat can't be avoided. If you have a problem with these last two sentences you need to re-examine your convictions and your understanding of life and death.

Jon

EDIT: We are WAY off track here. To contribute a bit more on topic, I am currently carrying a SAK (Swiss Army Knife). It's the full size model with a single main blade, cap lifter, scissors, corkscrew, mini-screwdriver, toothpick, tweazers, straight pin and ball point pen. I have used EVERY implement on this tool at least five times in the last two months and find it to be the most useful tool I own next to my automobile and computer. I am also carrying a little Spyderco Dragonfly for those few cases where I am holding something in one hand and/or a hand isn't free. Very handy to be able to open a pocket knife with a single hand! I'm also carrying a SureFire Executive Elite E2e in my back pocket. You'd be surprised how handy a small, bright flashlight can be. I would employ this as a blinding/distracting/bludgeoning device long before I would think to revert to my Spyderco.

[scorpiousmac]

Dont carry personally,one because it's illegal and I'm bored of prison and two because I genuinly belive it will attract trouble.Now before you go off on one about karma ect that's my personal experience.I know people who carry knives and these people tend to be the same one's who are always getting into trouble(usually quite seriously).You know the type,always shouting their mouths off and in my opinion just looking for a reason to take the thing out.Unless Iv'e got serious problems I would not carry but if you are going to get tooled up why not do it properly,carry a gun.They pull out their Knife,you pull out your gun/katana.Sorted

[PlumDragon]

Sometimes I carry rattan arnis sticks in my car, but never ever carry a knife or the like. I think its totally unnecessary, and honestly, a bit trashy.

[carlos]

I don't carry anything.

In the car I do have an extending baton. Which I have never had to use.

My job is a highways engineer and we occasionally get awkward confrontations when I'm marking up a road for repairs, but I carry a large can of spray paint which can easily be used if I want.

As for carrying anything other. I wouldn't want to b made to look stupid and have it taken off me for the other person to use it on me!

[mishqua]

I carry a small knife(blade 3in) with me every day, never leave home with out it. There are many advantages for having one. Here is one,I was walking my dog when a pit mix decided that my dog looked like a good chew toy so it bolts toward me draging its owner behind it. The dog circled entangling me in the rope(leash) and then instead of going for my dog it had a change of heart and went for my leg. I took out my trusty knife and cut through the rope and managed to put the dog into submission. Had I not had that knife to cut me free from the rope I surly would have been bit. In the end I didn't blame the dog but the owner for the dogs training. Not all self defence requires humans to be involved one should always be prepaired for the unexpected, Because when your not prepaired you allow the unexpected to take you by surprize.

[NewLearner]

Y'know compared to Rwanda, and Iraq :rolleyes:

You obviously haven't traveled much. Lots of places in the Middle East, Africa, South America, Asia, and even Europe are far more violent than America. Certainly there are places in the US that are violent. And certainly America has less restrictions on weapons than some other countries. However, it is still illegal to use a weapon illegally. The way some of you talk, there would be nothing but muggings and killings every day. Yet the conversations under the General Discussion forum would lead one to think that the UK and Australia seem to be far more dangerous with all of their fights that they brag about.

[tellner]

I usually have about 15 pounds of stuff on me - tools, electronic gear and so on. That's the downside to Scott eVests (http://scottevest.com). The great pile of crud includes a mini-Maglite, a Leatherman tool and a Spyderco Endura. All of them are excellent field expedient self defense tools. Sometimes I carry a Kahr or compact Glock - legally with a permit and everything.

[Lame Leopard]

I carry a Browning folding knife with a 3 1/2 inch blade. It is just a tool for me which I use often for non self-defense purposes. My goal is to get from point A to point B, survive, and live another day so if I ever have to use it in self-defense, I have plenty of training in how to. It is pretty far down in my self-defense layer system. :)

[Oversoul]

I tend not to carry a knife around, but simply because I dislike carrying things on my person. I do have one, and there have been situations where it would have been helpful (cutting a rope or whatever).

A scenario where I must defend myself and can't run away instead seems rather unlikely...

[Fighter4Higher]

Mace (as in pepper spray)... Smaller than most knives... easy to quickdraw.. more reach than any knife (8 - 12 feet) its range also allows you to spray it on the run if someone is chasing you with something. However it has its drawbacks. Really no melee ability.. Maybe hit them with the can. I have a type that the wind can't blow back in your face its called pepper foam (google). If you get it taken you deserve to get sprayed.. lol. I never carried anything intill me and a very close friend we're attacked one night by some freaking psycho with what I'm sure was a machete (WASN'T TAKING TIME TO MAKE SURE.) Anyway I was running for my life but my friend managed to turn around and spray him. The guy dropped whatever it was he was carrying and yelled something. Anyways wasn't long before I got exactly what my friend has... Best thing is pepper spray isn't lethal.. but it is BY NO MEANS 100% as like I said it has its drawbacks.

[Hobbitlauncher]

the problem with pepper spray that civvies can buy is it's just that.. pepper spray. It stings and it sucks ot be sprayed with but it's really weak, and nearly anyone determined enough (or trained, etc) can easily see through/resist it. The military/police grade version (the real mace) now that crap sucks let me tell you, most of them tend to hate using it because it has a tendency to affect the sprayer as well as the sprayee.

[kiaiki]

Try pulling a 'folder' out of your jeans and opening it in a hurry - then having it in exactly the right grip to meet a specific attack. Not in front of the mirror! In front of a mate at your dojo who is delivering a range of fast attacks. IMHO unless you are very fast and have a fixed blade somewhere very accessible (illegal in the UK) forget it.

Incidentally, I agree that taking it out of your hand may be a challenge for an attacker, but if he's hit you 6 times before you've even opened the thing, it sure is possible.

Nope, the only useful things I have carried have been a walking stick and a kubotan or substitute.

[tellner]

Gotta disagree with you kiaiki. I've drawn a folder in time to use it more than once, usually during the "interview" portion of the confrontation. The ones I have also make decent handpackers and impact weapons when closed.

[Matt_Bernius]

I've drawn a folder in time to use it more than once, usually during the "interview" portion of the confrontation.I'm also betting that you've trained to do this.

And you're right, they can make great handpackers.

- Matt

[kiaiki]

That's my point, but better made............you had better be VERY well trained if you plan on pulling out a folder in a fight. Fine, if you use it to close down a verbal confrontation, not so fine if a guy is already in motion - close and fast. Even lads who've only done a bit of boxing and have quick enough hands can challenge a 'quick draw' from a pocket.


Liner locks seem to be easier to deploy rapidly IMHO than lockbacks (Spyderco etc) but I'd still personally prefer rapid use of my kubotan, whipped out of my belt - a personal choice, but I agree that a closed knife may work as well in striking.

My other concern is that in the UK, even if you pull out a knife in self defence, the police are still likely to prosecute you, even if it is under 3" and maybe even if not a lock knife, if they think you carry it for fighting it's an 'offensive weapon' - and you may even get a worse deal than your attacker. I'm older and unlikely to be stopped and searched but if I was 20, dressed like a Chav, and out in the city, I'd be stupid to carry anything.

[Afthelador]

I've always carried a locking knife, and a liner-lock is a better idea, but I don't own one. I carry more for utility because I just frequently use it for stuff, but I never don't carry it just in case something happens.

[tellner]

That's my point, but better made............you had better be VERY well trained if you plan on pulling out a folder in a fight. Fine, if you use it to close down a verbal confrontation, not so fine if a guy is already in motion - close and fast. Even lads who've only done a bit of boxing and have quick enough hands can challenge a 'quick draw' from a pocket.

If someone catches you completely flat footed and is inside his distance you're probably hosed irregardless. I haven't had any particular training in folding knives. But I've been carrying them as tools for a terribly long time and have gotten used to taking them out. You get pretty fast with it after a while.

Most fights and violent crimes don't start with a sudden lightning fast attack. The dynamics of the event give you the necessary time. Or don't.


Liner locks seem to be easier to deploy rapidly IMHO than lockbacks (Spyderco etc) but I'd still personally prefer rapid use of my kubotan, whipped out of my belt - a personal choice, but I agree that a closed knife may work as well in striking.

I'll leave the religious wars about the best sort of lock to other people. It really comes down to personal preference and comfort. One of the nice things about knives-as-impact-weapons is that you have some choice in the degree of force. You can do pain compliance, whack someone or escalate as appropriate.

In some places kubotans are illegal while knives are alright as long as you don't fail the police attitude test.

My other concern is that in the UK, even if you pull out a knife in self defence, the police are still likely to prosecute you, even if it is under 3" and maybe even if not a lock knife, if they think you carry it for fighting it's an 'offensive weapon' - and you may even get a worse deal than your attacker. I'm older and unlikely to be stopped and searched but if I was 20, dressed like a Chav, and out in the city, I'd be stupid to carry anything.

If memory serves carrying anything, even a toothpick for self defense is a crime in the UK. I also recall a couple cases in the last few years where Londoners going about their normal business got serious time for non-locking small folders. One was a newspaper deliveryman who had a Swiss Army knife he used to cut the bundles of papers. On sentencing him the judge said the knife interfered with the "public's right to feel safe".

Oy vey.

[Fighter4Higher]

the problem with pepper spray that civvies can buy is it's just that.. pepper spray. It stings and it sucks ot be sprayed with but it's really weak, and nearly anyone determined enough (or trained, etc) can easily see through/resist it. The military/police grade version (the real mace) now that crap sucks let me tell you, most of them tend to hate using it because it has a tendency to affect the sprayer as well as the sprayee.

The military uses tear gas, also it really depends on the spray you use they have different OC pepper percentages (however the percentage dosn't have as much to do with the strength of the spray as it does the size of the grains of pepper inside). Also you can be trained to fight the affects of tear gas because it is an Irritant however pepper sprays effects are inflammatory nothing you can do if your eyes swell shut and your nose starts running uncontrollably. However it is possible to become somewhat used to the inflammatory reaction your body has the spray. Doubt anyone attacking you would have this resistance unless he gets sprayed often lol but who knows the guys around here do this for a career. A lot of the police issue pepper sprays are also combined with tear gas. Its the tear gas which is subject to being blown back to you that can also effect the user.


I carry this... and apologies the range is 8 - 10 feet.

http://pebbleco.com/item.jhtml;$sessionid$2ZMQLGAAAA1BVTZENUGJPQWPERWR JPX0?UCIDs=184099%7C184109&PRID=389604

[tellner]

CN and CS tear gas are much less effective than OC. That's why police departments have almost universally gone to pepper spray. I'm afraid it's time for my two minute rant on pepper spray....

The amazing people at Modern Warrior (http://www.mwarrior.com) have done extensive testing on the stuff using their own students, random volunteers and others. They found that in wide variety of strengths and people it just plain does not work against people who are motivated and goal oriented. Thousands of tests, no statistically significant exceptions.

The The American Society of Law Enforcement Trainers (http://aslet.org) recommends that it be used on "non-violent non-compliant suspects" and strongly warns against its use on violent or dangerous ones.

The Berkeley CA PD did an exhaustive study of every use of OC. They found that it hurt the situation as often as it helped, made more than half of the suspects more violent and contaminated the officer most of the time.

The Federal Trade Commission investigated OC and forced the original manufacturer to retract all claims that it would stop violent attacks and write a public letter to that effect.

The original FBI trials at Quantico were fraudulent. The agent in charge of the protocol did several years in prison for taking a bribe to cook the protocol and the results.

Pretty much every OC training program includes spraying the participants so they know they can fight through the effects.

The inflammation is basically - and I know I'm being inexact - an allergice response. Good enough. Unfortunately, the body's immediate response is to dump adrenaline. Congratulations. Now the attacker is faster, stronger and less reasonable. Tests done on subjects before and after spraying showed a significant increase in grip strength.

I've been hit with the stuff a couple times in training with extra special cop-only not-for-sale-to-mere-civilians varieties. It didn't drop me. It did tick me off and provided an immediate goal: Get to the drinking fountain and start washing myself. I was able to breathe and could see albeit not very clearly. My wife says my language was unutterable :o

In other words, it is a very frail reed to carry you in a serious assault. I'd strongly recommend spending more time on empty hand skills and/or learning how to use a more effective set of tools.

[karate princess]

i dont actually carry anything

[drunkenmonkey]

You know I notice alot of concern . Alot of people say they don't carry because thier afraid of jail time. Well I know from personal expierence that jail sucks yes it does but I'd go back there any day as long as it meant I wasn't DEAD. Although I've never been dead before I'm pretty sure its a permanant thing where as if you attack me with the intent to take my life I'd rather be alive in jail. Before I get all the BS about how horrible jail is do you know anyone in a coffin whose got out on bail...I don't. Been to jail never been dead I'll take the first one thank ya very much. Second I'm not a loud mouth in public who goes looking for fights I quite bouncing because of those jackholes. I've had to defend myself against a knife and gun too many times from that. Third I grew up in a rough neighborhood and thugs don't just stay in there confined areas so just cause your not in an alley or dark parking lot doesn't mean you can't get mugged. Criminals are criminals because they DON'T follow the laws. I go to the store work and home thats about it but dang skippy i'll be prepared when some psyco decides to shot up wal-mart or the job because he got fired or caught his wife cheating on him. Just because johnny law says "Hey this area is well lit and safe" does not cast a magical spell around it to keep all "law abiding citizens" safe. Be prepared its gonna be your life on the line people and maybe your kids or wife if they are with you and once your dead thats it no mas gone finished banging a gavel won't bring you back.

Thats all thank you for your time. :love:

[Fighter4Higher]

I've been hit with the stuff a couple times in training with extra special cop-only not-for-sale-to-mere-civilians varieties. It didn't drop me. It did tick me off and provided an immediate goal: Get to the drinking fountain and start washing myself. I was able to breathe and could see albeit not very clearly. My wife says my language was unutterable :o

In other words, it is a very frail reed to carry you in a serious assault. I'd strongly recommend spending more time on empty hand skills and/or learning how to use a more effective set of tools.

I've never been sprayed with the stuff so I'll take your word lol. I suppose its enough to buy you time to get away as it did the night me and a friend were attacked. I do train hard, but not enough to feel confident to take on anyone with a machete. Use it at a range and get away.

[slipthejab]

CN and CS tear gas are much less effective than OC. That's why police departments have almost universally gone to pepper spray. I'm afraid it's time for my two minute rant on pepper spray....

The amazing people at Modern Warrior (http://www.mwarrior.com) have done extensive testing on the stuff using their own students, random volunteers and others. They found that in wide variety of strengths and people it just plain does not work against people who are motivated and goal oriented. Thousands of tests, no statistically significant exceptions.

The The American Society of Law Enforcement Trainers (http://aslet.org) recommends that it be used on "non-violent non-compliant suspects" and strongly warns against its use on violent or dangerous ones.

The Berkeley CA PD did an exhaustive study of every use of OC. They found that it hurt the situation as often as it helped, made more than half of the suspects more violent and contaminated the officer most of the time.

The Federal Trade Commission investigated OC and forced the original manufacturer to retract all claims that it would stop violent attacks and write a public letter to that effect.

The original FBI trials at Quantico were fraudulent. The agent in charge of the protocol did several years in prison for taking a bribe to cook the protocol and the results.

Pretty much every OC training program includes spraying the participants so they know they can fight through the effects.

The inflammation is basically - and I know I'm being inexact - an allergice response. Good enough. Unfortunately, the body's immediate response is to dump adrenaline. Congratulations. Now the attacker is faster, stronger and less reasonable. Tests done on subjects before and after spraying showed a significant increase in grip strength.

I've been hit with the stuff a couple times in training with extra special cop-only not-for-sale-to-mere-civilians varieties. It didn't drop me. It did tick me off and provided an immediate goal: Get to the drinking fountain and start washing myself. I was able to breathe and could see albeit not very clearly. My wife says my language was unutterable :o

In other words, it is a very frail reed to carry you in a serious assault. I'd strongly recommend spending more time on empty hand skills and/or learning how to use a more effective set of tools.


Interesting and well written post with the relevant links. Good on ya.
I wish we had more posts like this here at MAP!

[tellner]

I suppose its enough to buy you time to get away as it did the night me and a friend were attacked. I do train hard, but not enough to feel confident to take on anyone with a machete. Use it at a range and get away.

Darned straight! It can be a useful tool if you recognize its limitations.

But I would feel confident taking on most people with a machete. Just as long as they didn't have one, too :D

<Gotta love guerilla semantics.

"Have you ever shot a gun?"
"Never, your Honor!" (fired them a lot, but never hung one up and shot at it...)>

[Fighter4Higher]

Argh how dare you use such "guerilla semantic" tactics tellner :woo:

and how DARE you write something that slipthejab complimented!!!! :woo: :woo: :woo:

[drunkenmonkey]

Good use of gurellia semantics, you never see those Sappers coming lol.

But yes taking someone who is weilding a machete on when you are unarmed would definitley be a situation I would try to avoid at all costs thats why people died alot in all those Jason movies. :p

[kiaiki]

Guess what all this means is - whatever the other guy has, GET A BETTER WEAPON or TRAIN HARD to learn how to win with less.

I would carry a walking stick and small penknife in the UK and be within the law. But my preference is a kubotan (heavy brass which will smash an arm/shin with ease) irrespective of the law.


(See Indiana Jones for practical application - guy swishes huge scimitar about, Indie shoots him. Reasonable force if ever I saw it.)

Just thought - our cops in the UK now carry firearms anyway, and the crooks have AK47's so the escalation is way beyond worrying about a few blades! :)

[drunkenmonkey]

I guess what it boils down to is prefrence. Just remember there is always some one training and they're doing it right now so if your not training then when you meet the guy who has trained and prepared he will beat you. I grew up in the streets so I've seen the crap people do to each other and I train for this. Like one guy said another guy ran up in a bar with a hammer and started beating on another guy. Not normal but if you train to disarm a guy with a knife then a hammer should be a cakewalk. Train for the worst hope for the best but always try to stay alive. ;)

[Ewan]

the escalation is way beyond worrying about a few blades! :)

Not in Glasgow and the surrounding areas. We have relativly little gun-crime and the highest knife-crime rate in western Europe. I personaly don't carry one but my mate got stabbed at the begining of the year there so... I'm not saying I even contemplated carryin one but, using one, on a select couple of people, I don't think I would have a problem with.

Cheers, Ewan

[Punch-Kik-Choke]

That's my point, but better made............you had better be VERY well trained if you plan on pulling out a folder in a fight. Fine, if you use it to close down a verbal confrontation, not so fine if a guy is already in motion - close and fast. Even lads who've only done a bit of boxing and have quick enough hands can challenge a 'quick draw' from a pocket.


Liner locks seem to be easier to deploy rapidly IMHO than lockbacks (Spyderco etc) but I'd still personally prefer rapid use of my kubotan, whipped out of my belt - a personal choice, but I agree that a closed knife may work as well in striking.

My other concern is that in the UK, even if you pull out a knife in self defence, the police are still likely to prosecute you, even if it is under 3" and maybe even if not a lock knife, if they think you carry it for fighting it's an 'offensive weapon' - and you may even get a worse deal than your attacker. I'm older and unlikely to be stopped and searched but if I was 20, dressed like a Chav, and out in the city, I'd be stupid to carry anything.

I carry a benchmade Griptilian with an axis lock.

The damn thing is faster than liquid lightning. Faster than my liner-lock CRKT no doubt about it.

I'm not 'trained' at all. I simply have used knives since I was a wee lad and am very comfortable using them for pretty much any task.

"training" is nothing compared to:
A. technology.
B. Mind set.
C. actual experience.

I keep it clipped to my right pants pocket, I can draw in about a second (and a half )starting with my hands at my waist. It's not that hard at all, and I practice every time I need to cut a box or open a letter.

I'm betting I can draw my griptilian faster than an FMA expert weilding a Swiss Army Knife without a solid locking mechanism, and stick it in him before he noticed.

Just like I'm betting the US army is 'the best' more because of technological innovation than "training".

20 years training Karate wont beat 20 seconds training Gun-Fu.

Knives are tools though, first and foremost.

as far as weapons go, they're only so/so.

I'll take a bat over a 3.5 inch folder any day of the week.

PS: In most Knife attacks the Knife is an unknown factor untill it is already in the victim.

PPS: I've owned the BenchMade Griptilian for 2 weeks now and it's definately the best under 4 inch production level folder I've handled. Go get it!

[medi]

Since when does using knives since you were a little kid not count as 'training'?

I practice every time I need to cut a box or open a letter.


Exactly... if you hadn't trained at deploying your knife do you think you'd be able to do it nearly so fast?

[tellner]

Guess what all this means is - whatever the other guy has, GET A BETTER WEAPON or TRAIN HARD to learn how to win with less.

Better solution: do both.

[Timmy Boy]

The hard core UFC fans that abound in forums like these cannot seem to grasp this concept...once again genuis dude :)

There are two reasons why people cite like the UFC MMA competitions as evidence despite real self defence being different.

Firstly, you can't just carry a weapon around with you all the time or you'll get nicked either for using it or for carrying it. If you're not a thug and last resort self defence is really the reason you do martial arts, the chances are that you're not the kind of person who wants to put his career and lifestyle in jeopardy just to improve your chances of winning the few (if any) fights you will have. Therefore, unarmed combat is still extremely important to these people.

Secondly, it's obvious that if you can't deal with a fair situation you're not going to be able to deal with an unfair one. If you can't withstand a hit from a fist without panicking and flapping like a fish, you're not going to get a forcefield around you that deflects knife slashes and stabs. If you can't beat someone who's standing in front of you, you're not going to beat them if their mate grabs you from behind at the same time. Of course, if you can handle these things that I mention, great, but many martial artists can't. It's about having command of the basics before you add icing to the cake like knife defence and multiple attacker drills.

It's not that people don't grasp the concept that streetfights are unfair. It's just that there's a limit to what you can realistically prepare for.

Getting back to the main point of the thread: I think this is a very tricky issue because you have to balance out legal consequences with effectiveness. I have said many times before that when you're under attack you can't afford to think about legal consequences, you have to use whatever means are at your disposal to neutralise the situation before you get injured or worse. But on the other hand, I don't want to carry a knife for fear of being arrested. It's a difficult balance to strike. Personally, I think that if you're planning on defending yourself you will have very few fights anyway, unless you live in an extremely rough area, so for me the risk of legal consequences arising from carrying a weapon outweighs the risk of getting hurt in a fight.

[Punch-Kik-Choke]

Since when does using knives since you were a little kid not count as 'training'?



Exactly... if you hadn't trained at deploying your knife do you think you'd be able to do it nearly so fast?

because I am not 'training' for any sort of martial application. The ability to draw fast didn't come from MA instruction, or even a self defense mindset. I think it's important to be able to open a folder with one hand, for instance. This has more to do with real world application (my other hand might be full holding something else) than any self defense training.

then again maybe it's like the Karate Kid and the wax on/wax off training.

you dont know it's martial training untill ya get jumped by the cobra kai! :D

If the ability to draw quickly helps out in a fight, great. Win/win situation.

I look at it this way...

if you're comfortable using your hands for a variety of tasks, you'll be comfortable punching somebody in the head as well.

If you're confortable using a knife as an extention of your hands, you'll be comfortable using it as a weapon as well.

I just dont see it as "training" any more than I see walking to my car to be training for olympic track.

I suppose what I am trying to say is that I view knives to be a tool. If you decide to use that tool as a weapon, it's going to be effective indeed. if you're competant with a tool, you can apply it to any situation (self defense or knitting)

(but yeah I obviously see where you're coming from and it's a valid point)

[pgm316]

There are two reasons why people cite like the UFC MMA competitions as evidence despite real self defence being different.

Firstly, you can't just carry a weapon around with you all the time or you'll get nicked either for using it or for carrying it. If you're not a thug and last resort self defence is really the reason you do martial arts, the chances are that you're not the kind of person who wants to put his career and lifestyle in jeopardy just to improve your chances of winning the few (if any) fights you will have. Therefore, unarmed combat is still extremely important to these people.

Secondly, it's obvious that if you can't deal with a fair situation you're not going to be able to deal with an unfair one. If you can't withstand a hit from a fist without panicking and flapping like a fish, you're not going to get a forcefield around you that deflects knife slashes and stabs. If you can't beat someone who's standing in front of you, you're not going to beat them if their mate grabs you from behind at the same time. Of course, if you can handle these things that I mention, great, but many martial artists can't. It's about having command of the basics before you add icing to the cake like knife defence and multiple attacker drills.

It's not that people don't grasp the concept that streetfights are unfair. It's just that there's a limit to what you can realistically prepare for.

Getting back to the main point of the thread: I think this is a very tricky issue because you have to balance out legal consequences with effectiveness. I have said many times before that when you're under attack you can't afford to think about legal consequences, you have to use whatever means are at your disposal to neutralise the situation before you get injured or worse. But on the other hand, I don't want to carry a knife for fear of being arrested. It's a difficult balance to strike. Personally, I think that if you're planning on defending yourself you will have very few fights anyway, unless you live in an extremely rough area, so for me the risk of legal consequences arising from carrying a weapon outweighs the risk of getting hurt in a fight.

Good post!

If I got to the stage were I really felt I NEEDED to carry a knife all the time, it would be the stage were I stopped leaving the house! :D

Would having a knife really help? Or would being in knife vs knife fight increase your chance of being stabbed. I'd still rather run or wave the white flag....

As Tim says the risk of legal consequences outweighs the risk of getting hurt, and I'm glad thats true! The law currently makes the carrying of certain weapons very risky in itself! :)

I think the best advice is to concentrate on hand to hand defence, and also defence against weapons. And not get too obsessed with learning knife systems.

[Punch-Kik-Choke]

hrrmmm..

I dont see how carrying a knife is going to get you into knife fights...

I mean, unless you are a complete dolt to start...

in which case knife or not, you're going to get seriously hurt.

Carrying a knife does not in any way eliminate my ability to
A. Think Rationally.
B. Run away.
C. defend myself.

I mean really, it's can only *help* a self defense situation (once again, unless you're a fool, or the kind of guy who carries to 'scare' the other guy away from fighting)

Tis better to have and not need...
than to need and not have.

[pgm316]

hrrmmm..

I dont see how carrying a knife is going to get you into knife fights...


Thats not what I said!

[Punch-Kik-Choke]

I know.

I was going off on a tangent

[pgm316]

I know.

I was going off on a tangent

Ok :)

I don't like the thought of a knife vs knife fight, it doesn't leave much room for one of the fighters to back down.

[Sonshu]

I carry weapons

My fists and feet - they are legal weapons and I can not be sent to jail for having hands alone.

However if I am found carrying a knife for that just in case in a random stop and search - you will get a criminal record (harder to get jobs then people!)

My fists and feet have helped me plenty so far even when faced with a knife in my opponents hands - my fists and feet were better.

[tellner]

Firstly, you can't just carry a weapon around with you all the time or you'll get nicked either for using it or for carrying it. If you're not a thug and last resort self defence is really the reason you do martial arts, the chances are that you're not the kind of person who wants to put his career and lifestyle in jeopardy just to improve your chances of winning the few (if any) fights you will have. Therefore, unarmed combat is still extremely important to these people.

It really depends on where you live. Many parts of the world permit carrying tools that can be used as weapons - small knives, defensive sprays and so on.

Also, there are plenty of people closer to the fringe who might carry something but also learn martial arts because they understand using the right tool for the job. There are times when it's a knife. There are times when it's your fists.

Even for the law abiding who live where the laws are less restrictive than the UK that's a reason to learn unarmed self defense. A knife is a tool for deadly force. If the situation does not call for deadly force it may still call for physical force. You may not have your tool with you. You may believe (correctly) that relying solely on a tool has its drawbacks.

Secondly, it's obvious that if you can't deal with a fair situation you're not going to be able to deal with an unfair one.

Quite the contrary. I would much rather deal with an unfair situation. In a fair fight I'm constrained to stand there and follow the rules even when it puts me at a disadvantage. Fairness favors the big, fit and strong. It precludes most practical tactics. If it's "fair' it's a sporting event. It's not a fight.

I[...]It's about having command of the basics before you add icing to the cake like knife defence and multiple attacker drills.

For practical defense dealing with weapons, multiple attackers and "unfair" tactics aren't icing on the cake. They're bread and meat. Executing the pciture-perfect reverse punch, saying "Os!", tornado kicks, forms as 99.999% of teachers do them, uniforms, needlessly obscure terminology, and all the rest shouldn't even be on the menu.

It's not that people don't grasp the concept that streetfights are unfair. It's just that there's a limit to what you can realistically prepare for.
Indeed. That's why the more practical jettison a lot of what's taught in TMA classes. Sometimes a baby or two goes out, but much of it is dirty bathwater.

Getting back to the main point of the thread: I think this is a very tricky issue because you have to balance out legal consequences with effectiveness. I have said many times before that when you're under attack you can't afford to think about legal consequences, you have to use whatever means are at your disposal to neutralise the situation before you get injured or worse.

For the most part, yes. There are a few things you have to keep in mind.

Are you in "reasonable fear of death or serious bodily injury"? If not, you shouldn't use deadly force. If so, it's a whole different matter.

Blind panic isn't a defense under the law. "I just freaked out and started swinging. When I came to they had their throats torn out" is a bad defense. "I sincerely believed they were going to knock me down and kick me to death. I didn't have any other choice" is a much better one.

But on the other hand, I don't want to carry a knife for fear of being arrested. It's a difficult balance to strike. Personally, I think that if you're planning on defending yourself you will have very few fights anyway, unless you live in an extremely rough area, so for me the risk of legal consequences arising from carrying a weapon outweighs the risk of getting hurt in a fight.

I've met a lot of guys with chips on their shoulders who went out looking for a chance to defend themselves. *sigh*

[tellner]

hrrmmm..

I dont see how carrying a knife is going to get you into knife fights...

I mean, unless you are a complete dolt to start...

in which case knife or not, you're going to get seriously hurt.

Carrying a knife does not in any way eliminate my ability to
A. Think Rationally.
B. Run away.
C. defend myself.

I mean really, it's can only *help* a self defense situation (once again, unless you're a fool, or the kind of guy who carries to 'scare' the other guy away from fighting)

Tis better to have and not need...
than to need and not have.

Bingo! Give the man a cigar! We have a winner!

If you are the kind of dipwad who likes to do crime or get into fights your tools and training make you a more dangerous yob and give the rest of us a bad name. If you are basically a decent person they will keep you out of a lot of trouble.

Let's take an extreme example. I live in a state where you can be licensed to carry a concealed handgun. Sometimes I carry one. Like most other people with CCW it makes me a lot less likely to yell at people or get into minor scuffles. The knowledge that lethal force is less than a second away makes you think two or three times before getting into a confrontation over the small stuff.

The other nice thing is that being prepared to escalate if the situation requires it does a good job of cutting down on the times that you need to escalate. Some of the most welcome words I've ever heard (next to "Let's you and me and my hot identical twin make love out on the lawn like crazed weasels" :D ) are "Dude, I think he's serious" and "It's that crazy White guy. Whatup, dawg?"

I never got so much grief and so many threats and "interviews" as when I was in a brace and using crutches or a cane. Seems like all the low level predators were interested. I didn't have the knife there to scare people. But when it was presented strongly and with the absolute intention of carving their gonads into sushi if they didn't leave right away they went and looked for easier prey.

[tellner]

Ok :)

I don't like the thought of a knife vs knife fight, it doesn't leave much room for one of the fighters to back down.

Again, you might be surprised. A "knife fight" sucks. I mean it can suck a bowling ball through fifty feet of garden hose. The "winner" might be the guy who dies three days later instead of bleeding out at the scene.

But it doesn't suck nearly as hard as showing up to the knife fight without a knife. As they say about guns "First rule of gunfighting - Bring a gun".

[TheCount]

I carry shopping bags

[pgm316]

I carry shopping bags

We know!

:D

[drunkenmonkey]

There are two reasons why people cite like the UFC MMA competitions as evidence despite real self defence being different.

Firstly, you can't just carry a weapon around with you all the time or you'll get nicked either for using it or for carrying it. If you're not a thug and last resort self defence is really the reason you do martial arts, the chances are that you're not the kind of person who wants to put his career and lifestyle in jeopardy just to improve your chances of winning the few (if any) fights you will have. Therefore, unarmed combat is still extremely important to these people.

Secondly, it's obvious that if you can't deal with a fair situation you're not going to be able to deal with an unfair one. If you can't withstand a hit from a fist without panicking and flapping like a fish, you're not going to get a forcefield around you that deflects knife slashes and stabs. If you can't beat someone who's standing in front of you, you're not going to beat them if their mate grabs you from behind at the same time. Of course, if you can handle these things that I mention, great, but many martial artists can't. It's about having command of the basics before you add icing to the cake like knife defence and multiple attacker drills.

It's not that people don't grasp the concept that streetfights are unfair. It's just that there's a limit to what you can realistically prepare for.

Getting back to the main point of the thread: I think this is a very tricky issue because you have to balance out legal consequences with effectiveness. I have said many times before that when you're under attack you can't afford to think about legal consequences, you have to use whatever means are at your disposal to neutralise the situation before you get injured or worse. But on the other hand, I don't want to carry a knife for fear of being arrested. It's a difficult balance to strike. Personally, I think that if you're planning on defending yourself you will have very few fights anyway, unless you live in an extremely rough area, so for me the risk of legal consequences arising from carrying a weapon outweighs the risk of getting hurt in a fight.

First of all let me defend myself by saying not all countries are so primitave that the citizens aren't allowed to arm themselves. Second an old saying states an armed society is a polite society. I am from the U.S. so we are allowed to carry second I train in a martial art so I train for multiple opponents and train for the fact that the other guy is trying to KILL me lets stress that since in self defense its not yor mom tryin to spank you its someone making you DEFEND yourself against UNWANTED harassment. Second if you hurt yourself with your own weapon put it away until you learn how to use the wooden or rubber version first. You can realisticly prepare for any situatio you just have to think of them on your own not get them from a book or on the T.V. As for careers and putting them in jeapordy if your martial art is a carrer then you practice a sport so don't fight in the street you'll lose. You put your LIFE in jeapordy by not taking every advantage to protect yourself. I haven't been in a street fight in years but when the time comes I'll still be alive and have all my body parts at the end of it and I could care less about what happensds to the other guy. I'll repoint out that no one has gotten out of a casket on bail or parol. And just let me say I started this thread as "Do you carry and why" not "If you don't carry post why you think everyone else shouldn't". Real martail arts were invented to kill people somehow people lost that idea when they thought it would look cool and help them pick up chicks so people trying to make a buck dumbed it down to do just that. If you can't handel this or disagree thats for another thread someone should start that someplace else this one has turned into an argument of why you should carry or not..not what it was i9ntended for.

And as for the person who said that a knife fight doesn't seem fair because there is no out for either fighters go back the ring we're talkin about somebody trying to Rape, murder, tourture, dismember or rob you or whatever it is crazies are doing to people now adays this is about protecting yourself not staying ouyt of jail its staying alive.

[TheDarkJester]

I do carry, but I keep it concealed. I don't see a point in using it to intimidate someone.. hell half the time I end up getting into fights down in Deep Ellum or Greenville in Dallas, I'm out promoting for a few clubs I toss flyers for, and get a little bit of alcohol in 'em, they think they're as tall as me, and start gettin wee-mans syndrome. Thankfully I've never had to use it, but I've come close to using it, which would really suck for the person going against me.. I have a little 3 1/2 inch blade that has a nasty little curve and a finger hole for holding security.. that and the 3 hours of razor honing I did on it would make for a very straight clean wound...

the title of this thread made me think firearm.. anyone else with me on that?

[Wax]

Second an old saying states an armed society is a polite society.
As New Orleans is learning the truth about now.

[Sonshu]

I do carry, but I keep it concealed. I don't see a point in using it to intimidate someone.. hell half the time I end up getting into fights down in Deep Ellum or Greenville in Dallas, I'm out promoting for a few clubs I toss flyers for, and get a little bit of alcohol in 'em, they think they're as tall as me, and start gettin wee-mans syndrome. Thankfully I've never had to use it, but I've come close to using it, which would really suck for the person going against me.. I have a little 3 1/2 inch blade that has a nasty little curve and a finger hole for holding security.. that and the 3 hours of razor honing I did on it would make for a very straight clean wound...

the title of this thread made me think firearm.. anyone else with me on that?

This is a bad mind set to get into and have you fully thought through repocussions if you use it or even pull it.

[Taliar]

First of all let me defend myself by saying not all countries are so primitave that the citizens aren't allowed to arm themselves.


Yeah because having to carry a gun to shoot someone, is much more advanced and civilised than carrying a club to bash someones head in. :bang:

[Sonshu]

First of all let me defend myself by saying not all countries are so primitave that the citizens aren't allowed to arm themselves.Second an old saying states an armed society is a polite society.

The Uk does not let you arm itself and per person we have lower fatalities, deaths and murders than the USA - I guess that makes us more polite and less primitave.

I am from the U.S. so we are allowed to carry

Are you able to carry a knife all day everyday and it is the LAW?????


second I train in a martial art so I train for multiple opponents and train for the fact that the other guy is trying to KILL me lets stress that since in self defense its not yor mom tryin to spank you its someone making you DEFEND yourself against UNWANTED harassment.

It is mostly a drunk person (unless your on active service) which does not require use of lethal force. You should offer the same response to the threat you are offered this is self deffence. Someone pushes you and you pull a knife then they are defending themselves from a knife weilding muppet.


Second if you hurt yourself with your own weapon put it away until you learn how to use the wooden or rubber version first.

If you hurt yourself with your own weapon - change arts.

I haven't been in a street fight in years but when the time comes I'll still be alive and have all my body parts at the end of it and I could care less about what happensds to the other guy.

Then your a muppet and off to jail you will go.

I'll repoint out that no one has gotten out of a casket on bail or parol. And just let me say I started this thread as "Do you carry and why" not "If you don't carry post why you think everyone else shouldn't". Real martail arts were invented to kill people somehow people lost that idea when they thought it would look cool and help them pick up chicks so people trying to make a buck dumbed it down to do just that. If you can't handel this or disagree thats for another thread someone should start that someplace else this one has turned into an argument of why you should carry or not

You have not put anyone in a casket so stop trying to give it large you sound like your 12.

And as for the person who said that a knife fight doesn't seem fair because there is no out for either fighters go back the ring we're talkin about somebody trying to Rape, murder, tourture, dismember or rob you or whatever it is crazies are doing to people now adays this is about protecting yourself not staying ouyt of jail its staying alive.

I have had plenty of fights - real fights a fair few as an adult, I have had knives pulled on me and been cut with them. NEVER did I have a knife and I am still here.

I got cut due to my inexperience and know better now but you really do need to get a grip on reality. It sounds like you watch too many films, have too much coffee and need to grow up. If I watched a fight break out and one person immediatly pulls a knife it will be you in my witness statement that will be the real danger. Most fights are just brawls and a knife present causes the risk level to jump up instantly. I would suggest less suggary sweets for you my lad, stop watching so many violent movies and no PS2 for a month.

This wild chest beating is what I hear from young kids and insecure students who have more agression than substance.

[Sonshu]

I just noticed you are 26.

I grew out of your mentality at aged 17 I think.

[pgm316]

And as for the person who said that a knife fight doesn't seem fair because there is no out for either fighters go back the ring we're talkin about somebody trying to Rape, murder, tourture, dismember or rob you or whatever it is crazies are doing to people now adays this is about protecting yourself not staying ouyt of jail its staying alive.

I said something like that....

My point being that if someone pulls a knife, and your response is to pull a knife also, it doesn't solve your problem!

A better response would be to run or give them what they want?

You've turned a bad situation into a knife fight, ie made it into a leathal confrontation with both fighters NEEEDING to use their knives.

[Matt_Bernius]

Ok folks, a reminder here, discussion and debate should continue, but please, discuss the topic at hand and not each other. Thanks :-)

- Matt

[drunkenmonkey]

I have decided to quite this forum one for the personal attacks and 2 because its clear that not many people here have ever had their lives threated before . This is going to be my last post these forums apparently not matter what form they take are all for ring fighters and people who feel if someone attacks you you should run away or cow under to what they what and let yourself be rapped or robbed. Second somebody need to look up the 21 foot rule cause a person who trains with a knife and is good can get to you before you can pull your gun.I am tired of trying to have civil conversations with people that break down into personal attcks and BS about not hurting the guy trying to kill you. And yes I have a knife on me all day everyday. Post all you want to and talk about me all you want call me a person with a sorry mentality or whatever it is someone said but I hope none of you ever attack me in the street cause I at least know I'll walk away from whatever hapopens. I don't go looking for fights I don't run around in bars but when someone comes in my house or tries to rob me or hte store I'm in be sure you won't see my corpse on the evening news.


Like it means anything.

[pgm316]

This is going to be my last post these forums apparently not matter what form they take are all for ring fighters

Not at all! :confused: The majority do here are for self defence.


and people who feel if someone attacks you you should run away or cow under to what they what and let yourself be rapped or robbed.

Thats not what was said at all! You change the facts to suit your argument.


I am tired of trying to have civil conversations with people that break down into personal attcks and BS about not hurting the guy trying to kill you.

Again thats far from what was said.

Bye now.

[Taliar]

An 'encounter' can be thought of as containing 3 seperate battles.

1. With yourself and your own fear

2. With your opponent

3. With the Law and other repercussions.

While carrying a weapon may seem to give you and advantage in the second phase, (and this is all many think about), it is not always going to, but will definately raise the stakes of any outcome of this encounter.

Even in fairly weapons liberal countries like the states, carrying and quickly moving to use a weapon is only going to hurt you in phase 3.

The biggest benefit that can be drawn is in phase 1, the 'fight' you have with your own fear. However any confidence gained can often be false confidence, and you would do better to find another way (perhaps by training more or more realistically) to gain that confidence boost.

Just my take on it.

Also even in the states you can be succesfully sued by a thief in your house who attacks you and you defend yourself, I think it very likely that a 'weapon carrying martial arts expert' (which is what your likely to be called in papers etc) is just as likely to be sued if you defend yourself.

[Timmy Boy]

It really depends on where you live. Many parts of the world permit carrying tools that can be used as weapons - small knives, defensive sprays and so on.

And many don't. I wasn't saying that it's the same everywhere, I was simply pointing out why the UFC is still valid evidence for many people.

Also, there are plenty of people closer to the fringe who might carry something but also learn martial arts because they understand using the right tool for the job. There are times when it's a knife. There are times when it's your fists.

The question here seems to me to be about effectiveness vs legal repercussions. I think it's pretty obvious that if you have a knife it's going to be more effective than using your fists.

Even for the law abiding who live where the laws are less restrictive than the UK that's a reason to learn unarmed self defense. A knife is a tool for deadly force. If the situation does not call for deadly force it may still call for physical force. You may not have your tool with you. You may believe (correctly) that relying solely on a tool has its drawbacks.

I agree with you here.

Quite the contrary. I would much rather deal with an unfair situation. In a fair fight I'm constrained to stand there and follow the rules even when it puts me at a disadvantage. Fairness favors the big, fit and strong. It precludes most practical tactics. If it's "fair' it's a sporting event. It's not a fight.

So you would prefer it if you got ambushed by 20 blokes with weapons rather than having to face just one unarmed guy? You would really rate your chances more highly in this situation?

For practical defense dealing with weapons, multiple attackers and "unfair" tactics aren't icing on the cake. They're bread and meat. Executing the pciture-perfect reverse punch, saying "Os!", tornado kicks, forms as 99.999% of teachers do them, uniforms, needlessly obscure terminology, and all the rest shouldn't even be on the menu.

They are icing on the cake IMO not because it doesn't happen but because it's really stretching what you can realistically prepare for. At the end of the day you're only a human with so many limbs and so much resistance to attacks. Even if you have done knife defence, someone who attacks you with a knife is at an enormous advantage.

For the most part, yes. There are a few things you have to keep in mind.

Are you in "reasonable fear of death or serious bodily injury"? If not, you shouldn't use deadly force. If so, it's a whole different matter.

You don't stand around assessing the situation like this when someone's coming at you and punching you. You can't afford to.

Blind panic isn't a defense under the law. "I just freaked out and started swinging. When I came to they had their throats torn out" is a bad defense. "I sincerely believed they were going to knock me down and kick me to death. I didn't have any other choice" is a much better one.

What kind of idiot is going to go into a courtroom and say he just freaked out and started swinging?

[TheDarkJester]

This is a bad mind set to get into and have you fully thought through repocussions if you use it or even pull it.

Yeah actually I have. If you read the post completely I've never been so backed into a corner where I've absolutely had to pull it. But you know damn well if its either pull the damn weapon or receive a no expenses paid trip to the ER I'm gonna pull it. And yes I've thought of the repercussions.. the common sense thing to do would be to get my story to the nearest police officer, call an ambulance, and have to deal with the legal fecal storm afterwards. But you know.. I'd rather deal with a crappy legal system than push up daisies.

[BgRdNk]

Yes i carry...at all times...i would rather sit in jail and suffer law suits than rot in a pine box...or lament that if i had been armed maybe my wife and kids wouldnt have been raped and murdered...the fact that the authorities might persecute/prosecute me for defending myself or family says they are part of the problem...not my defense...how many people are dead today but maintained the moral highground? no thanks ill stay above ground with lower morals :rolleyes:

even the Dalai lama stated if you were shot at it would not be unreasonable to shoot back to defend ones self...here read these quotes for yourselves...if your government disarms you even as the world turns more violent (hijackings and bombings) then they have something in mind other than YOUR welfare....i know many of you in england feel quite differently about this than americans do...thats why we live over here in the worlds only superpower and you live there where the queen doesnt trust you with weapons...so get over the politics and be real with yourself about why you dont/cant carry a weapon to defend yourself...An interesting side note ADOLPH HITLER didnt want his citizens armed either....think about it...

[Timmy Boy]

First of all let me defend myself by saying not all countries are so primitave that the citizens aren't allowed to arm themselves. Second an old saying states an armed society is a polite society. I am from the U.S. so we are allowed to carry

So you start by calling my country primitive. Nice one. Glad we're here for a civil debate.

second I train in a martial art so I train for multiple opponents and train for the fact that the other guy is trying to KILL me lets stress that since in self defense its not yor mom tryin to spank you its someone making you DEFEND yourself against UNWANTED harassment.

Erm... where did I say otherwise?

Second if you hurt yourself with your own weapon put it away until you learn how to use the wooden or rubber version first. You can realisticly prepare for any situatio you just have to think of them on your own not get them from a book or on the T.V.

So when was the last time you took on multiple armed attackers in your lesson?

As for careers and putting them in jeapordy if your martial art is a carrer then you practice a sport so don't fight in the street you'll lose. You put your LIFE in jeapordy by not taking every advantage to protect yourself.

I'm not talking about your martial art as a career, I'm talking about your job. If you get nicked for carrying a weapon that's going to ruin your life. If a situation arises where I need to defend myself, then yes, I will take every step I need to take to survive. However, my life is not a constant battlefield, I probably won't get into a situation where I need to use a knife, so I'm not going to put my lifestyle and career plans on the line just to be prepared for something that probably won't happen.

I haven't been in a street fight in years but when the time comes I'll still be alive and have all my body parts at the end of it and I could care less about what happensds to the other guy. I'll repoint out that no one has gotten out of a casket on bail or parol.

Again, missing my point completely. Try reading.

And just let me say I started this thread as "Do you carry and why" not "If you don't carry post why you think everyone else shouldn't".

So what exactly annoys you about hearing people disagree with you?

Real martail arts were invented to kill people somehow people lost that idea when they thought it would look cool and help them pick up chicks so people trying to make a buck dumbed it down to do just that. If you can't handel this or disagree thats for another thread someone should start that someplace else this one has turned into an argument of why you should carry or not..not what it was i9ntended for.

Point out where I said otherwise. READ WHAT I ACTUALLY TYPED.

And as for the person who said that a knife fight doesn't seem fair because there is no out for either fighters go back the ring we're talkin about somebody trying to Rape, murder, tourture, dismember or rob you or whatever it is crazies are doing to people now adays this is about protecting yourself not staying ouyt of jail its staying alive.

READ
WHAT
I
ACTUALLY
SAID

[Timmy Boy]

Yes i carry...at all times...i would rather sit in jail and suffer law suits than rot in a pine box...or lament that if i had been armed maybe my wife and kids wouldnt have been raped and murdered...the fact that the authorities might persecute/prosecute me for defending myself or family says they are part of the problem...not my defense...how many people are dead today but maintained the moral highground? no thanks ill stay above ground with lower morals :rolleyes:

Law and morals aren't the same thing. And you've missed the point completely.

even the Dalai lama stated if you were shot at it would not be unreasonable to shoot back to defend ones self...here read these quotes for yourselves...if your government disarms you even as the world turns more violent (hijackings and bombings) then they have something in mind other than YOUR welfare....i know many of you in england feel quite differently about this than americans do...thats why we live over here in the worlds only superpower and you live there where the queen doesnt trust you with weapons...so get over the politics and be real with yourself about why you dont/cant carry a weapon to defend yourself...

What, you actually think the Queen still runs the country?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

[BgRdNk]

Law and morals aren't the same thing. And you've missed the point completely.



What, you actually think the Queen still runs the country?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

no YOU missed the point the thread was titled do you carry and why?

If its illegal to carry a knife for any reason in your country much less own a gun it sounds like the queen...or whoever else you want to blame it on is in the perfect position to dictate the rules and you just have to take it...as for moral choices as to why you carry, whats more important to you ? you and your familiys well being or public opinion?

[Timmy Boy]

no YOU missed the point the thread was titled do you carry and why?

So I answered that question by saying that I don't carry, and why I don't carry. How is that missing the point?

If its illegal to carry a knife for any reason in your country much less own a gun it sounds like the queen...or whoever else you want to blame it on is in the perfect position to dictate the rules and you just have to take it...as for moral choices as to why you carry, whats more important to you ? you and your familiys well being or public opinion?

That's not what I said. You either didn't bother to read what I said or you're too stupid to understand it, either way I'm not going to debate this with you anymore.

[BgRdNk]

So I answered that question by saying that I don't carry, and why I don't carry. How is that missing the point?



That's not what I said. You either didn't bother to read what I said or you're too stupid to understand it, either way I'm not going to debate this with you anymore.

No i read your post...you said you dont carry because you dont want to get arrested...i said i would rather get arrested than deal with the ramifications of being unarmed if attacked...and if your govt doesnt allow you to carry thats between YOU and your govt....since you had no intelligent answer for that you began personal attacks upon me...

It was established a long time ago that the people who make up the United States of America felt a little differently about things than the queen...ever heard of a little thing called the revolutionary war? (thats about when the british law and opinion stopped mattering over here) ...is it any wonder the queen doesnt like the idea of an armed populace? if we hadnt been armed the queen might still be running our lives...We WERE and still ARE armed so what your laws are dont affect me thank you very much...enjoy all the security camera's ...maybe stuff like this little poster from your govt comforts you....it creeps me out!!!!

BTW timmy boy i love the way you sling personal insults then RUN away hollering over your shoulder ...."im not talking to you anymore"...VERY MATURE.
From what i have seen of your behavior you act like a little kid...with maturity levels like that its no wonder your weapons were taken away...we try to keep weapons out of those too immature to carry them in the USA as well ....maybe thats it, they decided none of you were mature or trustworthy enough to be allowed weapons so they took them all away...

[pgm316]

no YOU missed the point the thread was titled do you carry and why?

If its illegal to carry a knife for any reason in your country much less own a gun it sounds like the queen...or whoever else you want to blame it on is in the perfect position to dictate the rules and you just have to take it...as for moral choices as to why you carry, whats more important to you ? you and your familiys well being or public opinion?

I don't carry a weapon MAINLY because the law itself makes it very risky to do so.

And I'm very glad it does.

I know some naughty people and none of them carry a weapon either.

And I'm glad they have the same point of view as me :D

If you think you're privaledged to carry knives and guns then you're a fool!

:Angel:

[tellner]

And many don't. I wasn't saying that it's the same everywhere, I was simply pointing out why the UFC is still valid evidence for many people.

The problem with the MMA tournaments isn't that ground grappling isn't realistic or a bunch of the other reasons people toss out. It's a few other things. First, there's physical condition. The right tool for the job if you're young, strong, in top condition and have fantastic endurance may not be the right one if your physicality is a little different. There's a lot we can learn from the MMA. There are some serious differences.



So you would prefer it if you got ambushed by 20 blokes with weapons rather than having to face just one unarmed guy? You would really rate your chances more highly in this situation?
Not exactly. I'm not weak, not as slow as I look and not a bad hand at what I do. I am realistic about my limits. In a fair, standup fight with a faster, stronger, bigger guy in better shape (which describes an awful lot of people) I'm going to get broken in two. I'd much rather fight unfairly with him. Sportsmanship is for sports. Fighting is something else entirely. When it comes to not getting hurt by people who attack me I do not want to play by the rules. The 20 guys with weapons is a few standard deviations outside of what I can reasonably expect even on a really bad day.



They are icing on the cake IMO not because it doesn't happen but because it's really stretching what you can realistically prepare for. At the end of the day you're only a human with so many limbs and so much resistance to attacks. Even if you have done knife defence, someone who attacks you with a knife is at an enormous advantage.

As I said, perfection of the TMA basics is not nearly as useful for the sort of self defense most of us might need as some more realistic training. The stuff I mentioned is pretty much worthless. At best it reaches the point of diminishing returns where even the basics of some other skills would give you a fighting chance.

Multiple attackers is something I have had to deal with and may again. My time is better spent working on that than on katas - which can be incredibly useful with the right teacher but aren't worth a cup of chilled rat phlegm the way almost everyone learns them. The formality, uniforms, sacred space et cetera actually detract from self defense ability. A knife in the attacker's hand gives him a tremendous advantage. That's a good reason to learn how to deal with it, not throw up your hands and say "It's hard. I can't do it. So I'll spend my time and money on something easy."

I'm unlikely to bow to an attacker, take a stance a polite distance away from him and spar for a couple rounds. My real world needs are a little different than that, so I train with someone who teaches closer to the reality I have to deal with.

You don't stand around assessing the situation like this when someone's coming at you and punching you. You can't afford to.
There's a difference between analysis paralysis and a trained tactical view of the situation. How many are there? Where are they? Are they armed? Is the leader where I can take him out quickly? Can I get away?

Those are all things you'd better get a good idea about if you want to live, much less survive the court battle. "Is my life in danger" is the most important question. If it is I'm not going to put up my dukes and engage in fisticuffs, rah rah the Marquis of Queensbury. I'm more likely to give someone the traditional Four Cuts (long wide deep and repeat). If it's not I'm not going to use deadly force.

This is important, especially if you are using a tool for self defense. You will have to justify yourself to the law. In every country that bases its legal system on English Common Law the standard is pretty much "Were you or another innocent person in immediate and otherwise unavoidable danger of death or serious bodily injury?"



What kind of idiot is going to go into a courtroom and say he just freaked out and started swinging?

You'd be surprised. A lot of attorneys who've never successfully done a self defense case advise exactly that. Or they tell the client "Just say you panicked and don't know what you did" or "Tell the court the gun 'just went off' ". The lawyer still gets his fee. You go to jail.

[BgRdNk]

I don't carry a weapon MAINLY because the law itself makes it very risky to do so.

And I'm very glad it does.

I know some naughty people and none of them carry a weapon either.

And I'm glad they have the same point of view as me :D

If you think you're privaledged to carry knives and guns then you're a fool!

:Angel:

keep telling yourself the "bad guys" are too afraid of going to jail to carry a weapon... :rolleyes:
If you believe your govt disarming you was for your own good....YOU ARE THE FOOL...bwahahaahahah

[Sonshu]

I have decided to quite this forum one for the personal attacks and 2 because its clear that not many people here have ever had their lives threated before . This is going to be my last post these forums apparently not matter what form they take are all for ring fighters and people who feel if someone attacks you you should run away or cow under to what they what and let yourself be rapped or robbed. Second somebody need to look up the 21 foot rule cause a person who trains with a knife and is good can get to you before you can pull your gun.I am tired of trying to have civil conversations with people that break down into personal attcks and BS about not hurting the guy trying to kill you. And yes I have a knife on me all day everyday. Post all you want to and talk about me all you want call me a person with a sorry mentality or whatever it is someone said but I hope none of you ever attack me in the street cause I at least know I'll walk away from whatever hapopens. I don't go looking for fights I don't run around in bars but when someone comes in my house or tries to rob me or hte store I'm in be sure you won't see my corpse on the evening news.


Like it means anything.

I have been attacked with knives and a bat before, kicked and stamped on the floor by a big group of people so I know the deal and I still say you need to get out more as your previous post sound like a winging child.

If you cant handle objection on a forum you have no chance in a fight - stop crying.

[Sonshu]

keep telling yourself the "bad guys" are too afraid of going to jail to carry a weapon... :rolleyes:
If you believe your govt disarming you was for your own good....YOU ARE THE FOOL...bwahahaahahah

No its cos were in the UK not sure where your from but most people dont carry weapons. If you go looking for that kind of trouble you will find it. I did and now I know better.

[BgRdNk]

No its cos were in the UK not sure where your from but most people dont carry weapons. If you go looking for that kind of trouble you will find it. I did and now I know better.

I am from the USA ...i have been a weapon bearing individual for 30 plus years.. with no hassles from law enforcement...i am a veteran and a biker...long hair beard etc...most people i know ARE armed and our govt doesnt try to put us in jail for it...yes i have had idiots pull weapons on me...when i produced one as well that i obviously know how to use the idiots changed thier minds...mind you this happened in the U.K while i was on leave not once but twice (1981) (yes i was out drinking ) had i not been armed i probably would have had problems...but i was so the punks roamed on looking for easy prey...funny thing thats never happened to me here the USA but i continue to carry just in case...

[drunkenmonkey]

I have been attacked with knives and a bat before, kicked and stamped on the floor by a big group of people so I know the deal and I still say you need to get out more as your previous post sound like a winging child.

If you cant handle objection on a forum you have no chance in a fight - stop crying.

Yep I am a child because I know the diffrence between reality of a situation and what the people who make the rules tell me. I guess since I don't have 2000 posts on a forum because I have a job and train most of my time and the fact that I don't call people morons and idiots that I am a "winging" child whatever the hell that means. I don't post alot because I am training, maybe you people across the pond should check out what's happening in New Orleans USA right now. Good thing I don't live anywhere near where a natural disater might hit cause then all my training with weapons would come in handy, Oh wait I live in Florida check a map if a class five Hurricane, that's a big storm with over 120mph winds (whoops sorry I didn't say what it is in Kilometers) and lotsa rain comes thru I'll be going thru what those people are. I don't go looking for trouble but I have seen enough to be prepared so I am. I've been jumped before to but I have yet to not walk away from a fight because I train. I got jumped for being the wrong race at the wrong time damn I must've been out looking for trouble then. :eek: By the way if you judge how a person argues on the forums as to how they fight you need to train alittle more.

Also for the person out there with the cofee sugar and PS2 comment. I don't own a video game system watch TV I don't drink coffee and I hate sweets. I train and work at a job I came on these forums to find intelligent conversation not get jumped and called a psycho.

And for the jerk who asked how many people have I put in the ground. Even pros don't ask that kinda crap bad bad form bub.

And hey moderator where's the no personal attcks now that I'm being lynched in my own thread when several posts ago I tried to reiterate that we were off topic????????

And bye the way at football games here in the US people here don't cause riots and crush each other to death and we're all armed funny how many people die in your "football" games every year. HOOLIGANS

glad I could talk to the wall.

[drunkenmonkey]

BY the way I didn't quote a talking hand puppet on my posts but then I guess I'm not british so I guess I'm not used to being a puppet.

[medi]

Angry people are teh funney

[drunkenmonkey]

Nah I'm not angry just frustrated you can't really get angry at someone who calls you names from behind a keyboard and doubles back on what they said or denies what they said completely you can only get frustrated. Lol but hey it's all in fun right I mean everyone on this forum is a super badass especially everyone across the pond who don't need weapons to survive an attack by an armed assailant I mean wow no wonder WE won the war. I guess thats the price we pay for being a free country to bad for us. Besides the fact that not so Great Britan hasn't won a war without help since the US whooped em thats why Big Brother is here in the first place, good thing you guys aren't allowed to have arms. Heck if you armed all your citizens then your country might wind up like switzerland.

OMG did he just say that? :Angel:

[ecosys]

Nah I'm not angry just frustrated you can't really get angry at someone who calls you names from behind a keyboard and doubles back on what they said or denies what they said completely you can only get frustrated. Lol but hey it's all in fun right I mean everyone on this forum is a super badass especially everyone across the pond who don't need weapons to survive an attack by an armed assailant I mean wow no wonder WE won the war. I guess thats the price we pay for being a free country to bad for us. Besides the fact that not so Great Britan hasn't won a war without help since the US whooped em thats why Big Brother is here in the first place, good thing you guys aren't allowed to have arms. Heck if you armed all your citizens then your country might wind up like switzerland.

OMG did he just say that? :Angel:

Sigh ..

I'm not even going to waste my time.

[medi]

Nah I'm not angry just frustrated you can't really get angry at someone who calls you names from behind a keyboard and doubles back on what they said or denies what they said completely you can only get frustrated. Lol but hey it's all in fun right I mean everyone on this forum is a super badass especially everyone across the pond who don't need weapons to survive an attack by an armed assailant I mean wow no wonder WE won the war. I guess thats the price we pay for being a free country to bad for us. Besides the fact that not so Great Britan hasn't won a war without help since the US whooped em thats why Big Brother is here in the first place, good thing you guys aren't allowed to have arms. Heck if you armed all your citizens then your country might wind up like switzerland.

OMG did he just say that? :Angel:


LMAO The Russians won WWII in Europe, thanks all the same. We didn't mind helping you guys out in the Pacific though. :Angel:

[Britzy]

falklands war was without your help.
I seem to remember you doing quite well in vietnam...oh wait....

[drunkenmonkey]

Um before you wonn the fauklands you got your butts handed to you. The russians had to switch sides in WWII and ummm thanks for helping us watch the mushroom cloud over the Pacific.

[bassai]

Um before you wonn the fauklands you got your butts handed to you. The russians had to switch sides in WWII and ummm thanks for helping us watch the mushroom cloud over the Pacific.

Actualy we didn't get our butts handed to us in the falklands,it was more a case of being massivley outnumbered in the first instance.
And that mushroom cloud may not have happened if it wasn't for british scientists.
Anyway
1:whats this got to do with carying a weapon?
2:weren't you quitting this forum a few posts ago?

[Sonshu]

I am from the USA ...i have been a weapon bearing individual for 30 plus years.. with no hassles from law enforcement...i am a veteran and a biker...long hair beard etc...most people i know ARE armed and our govt doesnt try to put us in jail for it...yes i have had idiots pull weapons on me...when i produced one as well that i obviously know how to use the idiots changed thier minds...mind you this happened in the U.K while i was on leave not once but twice (1981) (yes i was out drinking ) had i not been armed i probably would have had problems...but i was so the punks roamed on looking for easy prey...funny thing thats never happened to me here the USA but i continue to carry just in case...

Perhaps you had a bad trip to the UK as most of the trouble in the uk is with fists and feet unless you go out in the kind of places where things escalate.

Looking like a biker is often typecast as being in a gang etc but it to my money does not make any odds I know some people who look hard as nails and arn't and some who look easy prey and can kick ass.

It is good that you protect yourself but I for one think its a bad thing. The laws on guns for example now dictate in the UK if you have one on you for ANY reason it is 5 years in jail.

The knife laws have been closed up as well, the biggest threat for 99% of the UK people is bottles and fists / feet. They can still kill but I for one tend to train for what are the most common threats which is why UK people have the views we have.

Even in the parts of the US I have been to the few fights I have seen have been beer induced punch ups.

[Sonshu]

Yep I am a child because I know the diffrence between reality of a situation and what the people who make the rules tell me. I guess since I don't have 2000 posts on a forum because I have a job and train most of my time and the fact that I don't call people morons and idiots that I am a "winging" child whatever the hell that means. I don't post alot because I am training, maybe you people across the pond should check out what's happening in New Orleans USA right now. Good thing I don't live anywhere near where a natural disater might hit cause then all my training with weapons would come in handy, Oh wait I live in Florida check a map if a class five Hurricane, that's a big storm with over 120mph winds (whoops sorry I didn't say what it is in Kilometers) and lotsa rain comes thru I'll be going thru what those people are. I don't go looking for trouble but I have seen enough to be prepared so I am. I've been jumped before to but I have yet to not walk away from a fight because I train. I got jumped for being the wrong race at the wrong time damn I must've been out looking for trouble then. :eek: By the way if you judge how a person argues on the forums as to how they fight you need to train alittle more.

Also for the person out there with the cofee sugar and PS2 comment. I don't own a video game system watch TV I don't drink coffee and I hate sweets. I train and work at a job I came on these forums to find intelligent conversation not get jumped and called a psycho.

I have a job to and post here as well as train and instruct so not sure what your point is here. As for the Hurricane a bad thing and neither you or I are near it. That is a difference situation that training in TKD and CMA like you do will not protect you from its mob rule mass hysteria very different than what you are training for. The fact you have talked your way out of trouble and not faught shows you the power of words not knives also I judge people by what info the offer and on a forum this is all you can offer so this is what your judged on, its common sence and your job should give you this info my job does. As for good intelligent conversation, read your posts then you will see why you got the feedback you did, read them and think you did not write them.


And bye the way at football games here in the US people here don't cause riots and crush each other to death and we're all armed funny how many people die in your "football" games every year. HOOLIGANS

That is a childish quote to put you idiot, if the mods take excetpion to this post then fine but you need to grow up you sulking child. People died in that event and it has nothing to do with the forum or this thread. THIS IS WHY PEOPLE THINK YOUR AN IDIOT

[Sonshu]

Nah I'm not angry just frustrated you can't really get angry at someone who calls you names from behind a keyboard and doubles back on what they said or denies what they said completely you can only get frustrated. Lol but hey it's all in fun right I mean everyone on this forum is a super badass especially everyone across the pond who don't need weapons to survive an attack by an armed assailant I mean wow no wonder WE won the war. I guess thats the price we pay for being a free country to bad for us. Besides the fact that not so Great Britan hasn't won a war without help since the US whooped em thats why Big Brother is here in the first place, good thing you guys aren't allowed to have arms. Heck if you armed all your citizens then your country might wind up like switzerland.

OMG did he just say that? :Angel:

I am angry as your post about the disaster in the Liverpool football ground shows what kind of immature child you are. I would gladly call you a lot of things to your face as I struggle to recall a more pathetic post than that one.

People on the forum dont make them out to be super badass's thats you making yourself out to be one. We dont need weapons as we dont get that kind of agro in a normal altercation.

As for the war people died in that my grandfather being one of them who I would have liked to have met. He faught in that war and you clearly know nothing at ALL about what the war and what happened in it.

I am struggling to put anything that wont be classed as a threat on here so I am gonna shut up now. You sure as hell dont sound like your 26.

[drunkenmonkey]

I am angry as your post about the disaster in the Liverpool football ground shows what kind of immature child you are. I would gladly call you a lot of things to your face as I struggle to recall a more pathetic post than that one.

People on the forum dont make them out to be super badass's thats you making yourself out to be one. We dont need weapons as we dont get that kind of agro in a normal altercation.

As for the war people died in that my grandfather being one of them who I would have liked to have met. He faught in that war and you clearly know nothing at ALL about what the war and what happened in it.

I am struggling to put anything that wont be classed as a threat on here so I am gonna shut up now. You sure as hell dont sound like your 26.

Your angry because I pointed out that your people can't go to a sporting event without causing a tradegy and you're not even armed. Hey I wasn't there I didn't start the riot I'm sorry if it upsets you that someone has the balls to point out the truth.
You know funny thing is I was told I can't handel arguments on the forum but you seem to take every one of my posts as a personal attack. If you can't handel an argument on the forum then you'll never be able to handel a fight. I didn't start running my mouth till everyone in this thread jumped me about my OPINION so if you seem to think I was making fun or your dead relatives with my post you might want to turn down YOUR sensitivity level a little, My family fought in the war too and MY grandfather was in Korea the biggest waste of American military time next to Vietnam and Iraq. Threaten me all you want its a forum I don't care I won't complain it's just words. As for my pathetic post I think I just quoted the most pathetic post in this thread right her. Now your crying boo hoo. I started this thread to talk to other people that carry weapons not a bunch of people who are so dillusional that they claim they don't need them. Secondly I have been in plenty of altercations where I had a knife and never drew it. The police have guns (at least here in the US) and they don't shoot someone everytime they have an altercation but according to the logic thrown at me here since I carry I use it every time even though thats not true nor was it ever implied that I do. But since I'm so hyped up full of myself 26 year old chest beating macho man savage "winging child" to you people instead of trying a real argument because you can't think of one you instead attack my person. Well according to the posts and logic in this thread I attacked with the same force you attacked me and that was against your person. Gosh I used the suggestions you gave me in a "forum fight" and now your all mad. Sucks to have your own tactics thrown in your face now try to use something else just remember all your throwing at me is ammunition. Keep calling me immature if thats all you got I'm gonna get back to the subject of this thread now

So go see if J-Lo will let you try and sniff her butt again :cool:

[drunkenmonkey]

These are a few of the knive I have I don't carry the top one because it is illegal to being longer than 6 inch blade and being double edged I prefer the kerambit and the spyderco. My wife carries the second one which is a bud nealy design and can be deployed with one finger if practiced with regularly.

[Sonshu]

Your angry because I pointed out that your people can't go to a sporting event without causing a tradegy and you're not even armed. Hey I wasn't there I didn't start the riot I'm sorry if it upsets you that someone has the balls to point out the truth.

No you are making light of a bloody tragety. You then start having a making light of world war II.

You know funny thing is I was told I can't handel arguments on the forum but you seem to take every one of my posts as a personal attack.

Cos you have nothing constructive of value to ad.

If you can't handel an argument on the forum then you'll never be able to handel a fight.

Had plenty and done fine.

I didn't start running my mouth till everyone in this thread jumped me about my OPINION so if you seem to think I was making fun or your dead relatives with my post you might want to turn down YOUR sensitivity level a little,

I have been here for a long time and am pretty easy going, you are just full of it. Yes you have been running your mouth and if enough people tell you perhaps that there are other ways of doing things you might stop and listen.

My family fought in the war too and MY grandfather was in Korea the biggest waste of American military time next to Vietnam and Iraq. Threaten me all you want its a forum I don't care I won't complain it's just words. As for my pathetic post I think I just quoted the most pathetic post in this thread right her. Now your crying boo hoo.

No you started taking examples where having a knife would have made no difference - hilsburgh disaster a knife would not have helped and I doubt you would have got one in. Then you make light out of 2nd world war. If its just me your taking the piss out of I would not be bothered.

I started this thread to talk to other people that carry weapons not a bunch of people who are so dillusional that they claim they don't need them.

We dont claim, I am telling you fact I am 30 in a few months time and never needed one. That is fact, how many people you stabbed then tough guy?

Secondly I have been in plenty of altercations where I had a knife and never drew it.

That is what I said you dont need, perhaps a few people need to carry one but most of your country does not neither does most of mine.

The police have guns (at least here in the US) and they don't shoot someone everytime they have an altercation but according to the logic thrown at me here since I carry I use it every time even though thats not true nor was it ever implied that I do.

As I said there are people who move in circles where weapons are needed - Police are a prime example, they are there to keep order you are not. Again how many have you stabbed?

But since I'm so hyped up full of myself 26 year old chest beating macho man savage "winging child" to you people instead of trying a real argument because you can't think of one you instead attack my person.

Based upon your posts its pretty plain to see what I think your a joke, your going on about the brits getting whooped in wars is why you sound like a joke.

Well according to the posts and logic in this thread I attacked with the same force you attacked me and that was against your person.

No you started taking the piss out of tragetys, I would not bring up the Twin Towers and say if the brits helped you the USA would be ok as that is not true I am mature enough not to make light of such things. Taking the piss out of me I would not care about I can live with it but its a low blow taking shots at the UK, World War and Hilsburgh disaster where a knife would not have saved anyone.

Gosh I used the suggestions you gave me in a "forum fight" and now your all mad. Sucks to have your own tactics thrown in your face now try to use something else just remember all your throwing at me is ammunition. Keep calling me immature if thats all you got I'm gonna get back to the subject of this thread now

My tactic thrown in my face - you are a joke. Giving you ammo doh!!!!!

So go see if J-Lo will let you try and sniff her butt again :cool:

Very mature! come on tough guy give us your low down then about all the people you have stabbed and your marital arts history?

[drunkenmonkey]

Man gettin a little upset don't get a knot in your knickers it's just a forum right.
First off stating a fact and making fun are 2 diffrent things all I have stated was a fact about the tragdegies. Second I'll be the first to say if the Americans on those planes during 911 had been trained even a little and int he right mind set maybe one or two would ahve died but the towers wouldn't have been destroyed. THATS OUR BAD 100% NO EXCUSES FROM ME.
Second you keep calling me immature is that your equivalent of the "Am not, Am too" argument cause I don't play kid games. I'll state again and get on yahoo news and READ an article or two about whats happening here in the states the hurricane has cause crazy crap to be happening. National Guardsmen (thats some of our military) are shooting people for no good reasonh and watching people get raped in the streets IF these people were armed and trained then women wouldn't be getting raped and having their throats slit and the military wouldn't be shooting people who ask them to stop it. But hell I guess thats just me making fun of another tradgey.

If i'm so childish they why did I try to get the thread back and track.

And one last thing I have said this before and you have show absolute ignorance to this fact if you don't stop asking me how many people I have killed I am gonna PM a MOD. Pro's don't ask this people in jail don't ask this and people on the street don't ask this. Let me educate YOU this is the worst kind of manners EVER in any circle of people who have actually had to fight for thier lives and I know a few this is worst then asking your buddies wife how many guys she has been nailed by. If you knew anything about life and death situations you would know this so stop showing how IMMATURE you are.
By the way nobody else here has said I'm an idiot or they're are just doing better things with thier time then yelling at the screen and typing in this thread because they aren't as immature as you.

Now did you have anything realavant to say about the topic of discussion cause if you want to rant start a thread called "drunkenmonkey is a retard" and have fun with it

[BgRdNk]

Perhaps you had a bad trip to the UK as most of the trouble in the uk is with fists and feet unless you go out in the kind of places where things escalate.

Looking like a biker is often typecast as being in a gang etc but it to my money does not make any odds I know some people who look hard as nails and arn't and some who look easy prey and can kick ass.

It is good that you protect yourself but I for one think its a bad thing. The laws on guns for example now dictate in the UK if you have one on you for ANY reason it is 5 years in jail.

The knife laws have been closed up as well, the biggest threat for 99% of the UK people is bottles and fists / feet. They can still kill but I for one tend to train for what are the most common threats which is why UK people have the views we have.

Even in the parts of the US I have been to the few fights I have seen have been beer induced punch ups.

No doubt that if you live where the law prevents you from carrying a weapon
that makes it tough...personally i would move to a country that allowed me the freedom to protect myself and family until the "calvary" arrived.
especially until MUCH better screening of who gets a badge and a gun is done.
There are far too many instances of the good guys "accidentally" killing innocent people...just because someone gets to put on a uniform does not make them infallible...as long as you have no weapons you are at the mercy of those who do...the opium wars or boxer rebellion in china is a perfect example...a nation without arms was forced to trade against thier will and were paid in opium...then had to ask for foriegn help to save themselves...leading to economic and social rape of thier culture...a population that owns it own weapons and practices with them is of far more use to a military than people who never held one until the day they joined the military or police.
one of the most helpful factors for the USA in the revolutionary war was the fact that we owned guns and used them to hunt...we needed to be able to hit a squirrel..so since necessity is the mother of invention, we invented the rifled barrel...allowing us to defeat the "superior" british army :D that is a fact of history which proves that an armed populace SHOULD be an asset to its country and leaders...UNLESS the government fears its citizens...now if you are fair and honest with them this shouldnt be a problem. If however your leaders have motives and plans the populace might find unacceptable were they armed they are probably going to disarm you to insure the continued control and furthering of thier agendas at your expense.
...................................... THINK ABOUT IT.............................................

[Hobbitlauncher]

Man gettin a little upset don't get a knot in your knickers it's just a forum right.
First off stating a fact and making fun are 2 diffrent things all I have stated was a fact about the tragdegies. Second I'll be the first to say if the Americans on those planes during 911 had been trained even a little and int he right mind set maybe one or two would ahve died but the towers wouldn't have been destroyed. THATS OUR BAD 100% NO EXCUSES FROM ME.
Second you keep calling me immature is that your equivalent of the "Am not, Am too" argument cause I don't play kid games. I'll state again and get on yahoo news and READ an article or two about whats happening here in the states the hurricane has cause crazy crap to be happening. National Guardsmen (thats some of our military) are shooting people for no good reasonh and watching people get raped in the streets IF these people were armed and trained then women wouldn't be getting raped and having their throats slit and the military wouldn't be shooting people who ask them to stop it. But hell I guess thats just me making fun of another tradgey.

If i'm so childish they why did I try to get the thread back and track.

And one last thing I have said this before and you have show absolute ignorance to this fact if you don't stop asking me how many people I have killed I am gonna PM a MOD. Pro's don't ask this people in jail don't ask this and people on the street don't ask this. Let me educate YOU this is the worst kind of manners EVER in any circle of people who have actually had to fight for thier lives and I know a few this is worst then asking your buddies wife how many guys she has been nailed by. If you knew anything about life and death situations you would know this so stop showing how IMMATURE you are.
By the way nobody else here has said I'm an idiot or they're are just doing better things with thier time then yelling at the screen and typing in this thread because they aren't as immature as you.

Now did you have anything realavant to say about the topic of discussion cause if you want to rant start a thread called "drunkenmonkey is a retard" and have fun with it


Drunk the Nat'l Guard was called up because of ridiculous amounts of looting and because tasking people with rounding up and HOLDING criminals was taking away from the rescue efforts (New Orleans has a pop of roughly 487k, fyi)They aren't just shooting any random joe schmo on the street, the governor of the state AUTHORIZED the use of lethal force if necessary on uncooperative criminals during the state of emergency, and I believe it is completely justified, example to follow.

One convenience store owner who survived most of the devastation opened his doors to anyone and everyone to take what they needed, FOR FREE. Early on before he even opened for work 2 thugs came in, shot him, and emptied the store of anything of value, starting with the register (obviously).

back on lighter subject matter: thanks for trying to keep the thread on track DM. Answers to this shouldn't be so darn tough. a simple yes or no + supporting reason is PLENTY. People need to stop telling other people waht to do or not do because frankly, I don't know anyone who puts their complete trust in random strangers via an internet forum (no offense, I love you MAPpers!)

[slowmo]

i carry my teeth, finger tips/strong grip, boney shins and forearms, elbows, knees, and fists everywhere i go =] who needs a knife.

The most important thing is to train for speed, if you get to dependent on weapons you end up a slow fighter. And if anything running fast is the best self defense :) If someone pulls a knife on me they better hope they're somehow quicker and smarter than me (and in america thats about as rare as lightning striking twice)

But honestly i do carry knives where it's legal, they're VERY useful tools for survival in general (not just for fighting) For fighting i prefer kali sticks or extendable batons though

[drunkenmonkey]

thanks for the support on keeping it on track folks thats what we are here for. what kind do you carry slomo. and hobbit thanks for the info I always appreciate intelligent incite. :cool:

[slowmo]

thanks for the support on keeping it on track folks thats what we are here for. what kind do you carry slomo. and hobbit thanks for the info I always appreciate intelligent incite. :cool:

usually folding knives, im also big into throwing knives and other things like throwing spikes. That's a great skill cuz i can throw a pen or pencil, steak knife or fork into someone up to 20 feet away (anythin further than that wont do much damage by the time the pen/pencil hits them)

[drunkenmonkey]

usually folding knives, im also big into throwing knives and other things like throwing spikes. That's a great skill cuz i can throw a pen or pencil, steak knife or fork into someone up to 20 feet away (anythin further than that wont do much damage by the time the pen/pencil hits them)
yeah i posted a pic of my endura and kerambit i love my kerambit its flat ground on one side siegel design. i like throwing spikes too i train in throwing as well. cool :cool:

[DaileyC]

As a police officer I believe that it is important for everyone to use and carry what their laws allow (too bad we are moving far left on the issue and taking more and more weapons from people), and what they are comfortable with. Knives, like all weapons are mission specific. Know what you can do with it, how to do it, and when to do it. They are great tools with a little practice.

[slowmo]

I kinda think it should be legal to pull out a knife in self defense because usually if someone just sees a blade they'll just leave you alone. It doesn't matter if you're a kick boxer or ground fighter or whatever, you're not gonna wanna get close to a knife.

It should be illegal if you actually use weapons in an absusive way, rob someone with it or let some child get ahold of it or something, but weapons often keep the peace (and let's face it, women especially need something they can stop a 250lb aggressor with)

If i had a daughter or wife i'd want her carrying a knife, gun, taser, pepper spray and hand grenade everywhere she went =]

[BgRdNk]

very nice post, slomo and Dc its a pretty simple equation if you care about someones welfare you want them to have the ability to defend themselves should it become necessary.....................

i must say throwing knives, spikes etc at a moving target is VERY difficult...not to mention if the person is moving AWAY thats a new assault, perpetrated by you :eek:

"In these modern times, many men are wounded for not having weapons or knowledge of their use".
Achille Morozzo 1536

[Oversoul]

I don't want to derail the thread or anything. I just can't help but notice that some posters here seem to think there is a wrong answer to this.

I already answered the original question earlier: I don't carry a knife.

But I don't try to convince others that they shouldn't carry knives.

And if someone berated me for not carrying a knife to protect myself, I would just roll my eyes (at best). :rolleyes:

There isn't a wrong answer. You can carry a knife or not carry a knife (unless you're somewhere that it's illegal to carry a knife). But people who do differently aren't making a mistake, just because they follow a course of action that is not your own.

[slowmo]

oversoul i would never consider someone bad or stupid for not carrying a knife. It's a personal choice and when I walk to the store or something like that i dont usually have a knife on my person.

It's very important not to carry a knife in a paranoid way, or in a way that makes you feel violent.. like instead of running (like you should) you'd end up going 'oh i have a knife so im not afraid'. gots to be very careful of that =] When i carry a knife im not thinking about the world being a bad place i'm thinking 'i might need this to cut a seatbelt if it gets stuck, or some other function' and i ALWAYS carry a knife if im going into a wilderness setting.

Knives aren't bad, its your state of mind that can be good or bad (restaurants give us knives to cut our steak trusting in this philosophy)

The thing is a screw driver, box cutter, or something like that can be just as dangerous as a knife and yet perfectly legal. it's all about perspective and skill

Also, throwing spikes may not seem that practical but trust me if you're truely skilled in them it opens up a whole nother world of possibilty for defense (even if you're just throwing a rock or a shoe, because your aim and ability to throw hard are increased) Throwing things is also a good strategy cuz it throws your attacker off and can buy you a second or two to escape or attack

[slipthejab]

and i ALWAYS carry a knife if im going into a wilderness setting

Agreed, in the wilderness one never knows when they'll stumble upon a bear and a Navy SEAL fighting and have to defend themselves against both. :D

[slowmo]

Agreed, in the wilderness one never knows when they'll stumble upon a bear and a Navy SEAL fighting and have to defend themselves against both. :D

hah, well not for fighting so much as for a tool, a knife is the single most important tool you can have because you can cut wood with them to allow you to make compasses, shelters, traps, fire, etc. (if a bear is after me im gonna play dead before i become dead)

this also shows you how much better knives are than guns when we're in our natural environment, can't do all that with guns and bullets :)

Some people equate knives and martial arts to violence and not being 'civilized', to me that's just wrong perception

[Taliar]

Has anyone seen the 'How to survive' series being show on UK T.V. Being presented by Chris Ryan of Bravo Two Zero fame and backed by a range of personal protection specialists and reformed ex cons. The episode on bugulary was very eye opening, their advice, stay in your room, baracade the door and ring the police. Everything was to do with avoiding confrontation and giving the 'offender' opportunity to escape easily. Pretty much the worst thing they said you could do would be to arm yourself and confront the attacker, as this forces the confrontation down a quickly descending spiral to a bad end.

[slowmo]

good advice. it's simple math: it takes more than 1 person to fight (unless you've seen "Fight Club") so take yourself out of the equation. Often people want to subtract the aggressors, big mistake unless you have no choice :)

[Oversoul]

and i ALWAYS carry a knife if im going into a wilderness setting.

Same here. I just leave it at home most of the time. But I would be sure to bring one if I were in something like a wilderness setting.

[pgm316]

Everything was to do with avoiding confrontation and giving the 'offender' opportunity to escape easily. Pretty much the worst thing they said you could do would be to arm yourself and confront the attacker, as this forces the confrontation down a quickly descending spiral to a bad end.

I said similar ealier, unless you decide you want to fight the attacker then avoid any show of force.

[Sonshu]

No doubt that if you live where the law prevents you from carrying a weapon
that makes it tough...personally i would move to a country that allowed me the freedom to protect myself and family until the "calvary" arrived.
especially until MUCH better screening of who gets a badge and a gun is done.
There are far too many instances of the good guys "accidentally" killing innocent people...just because someone gets to put on a uniform does not make them infallible...as long as you have no weapons you are at the mercy of those who do...the opium wars or boxer rebellion in china is a perfect example...a nation without arms was forced to trade against thier will and were paid in opium...then had to ask for foriegn help to save themselves...leading to economic and social rape of thier culture...a population that owns it own weapons and practices with them is of far more use to a military than people who never held one until the day they joined the military or police.
one of the most helpful factors for the USA in the revolutionary war was the fact that we owned guns and used them to hunt...we needed to be able to hit a squirrel..so since necessity is the mother of invention, we invented the rifled barrel...allowing us to defeat the "superior" british army :D that is a fact of history which proves that an armed populace SHOULD be an asset to its country and leaders...UNLESS the government fears its citizens...now if you are fair and honest with them this shouldnt be a problem. If however your leaders have motives and plans the populace might find unacceptable were they armed they are probably going to disarm you to insure the continued control and furthering of thier agendas at your expense.
...................................... THINK ABOUT IT.............................................


It does not make it tough really as the majority of threats you will encounter are via unarmed people. This is also the same in your country as well. If you go out looking for that kind of heat you can get it and you can get shot in the UK as well.

I think just about everyone in the UK is happy there is a no gun law here and that knives are controlled. You can carry a knife with a small blade but 99% of people dont as there is really just no need.

Perhaps its safer in the UK than the US but everytime I have been to the USA it has been pretty safe. If someone breaks into your house you are able to defend yourself and your property and you are also of course able to defend yourself if attacked or threatenend but for everyone to be carrying knives is a bit OTT.

Are you one of the conspiriciy people who thinks the USA government is plotting against you or is your government fair to you? If its fair why carry a weapon its pretty fair in the UK.

[Sonshu]

Same here. I just leave it at home most of the time. But I would be sure to bring one if I were in something like a wilderness setting.

I think thats common sence and basic survival skills.

[Sonshu]

Man gettin a little upset don't get a knot in your knickers it's just a forum right.
First off stating a fact and making fun are 2 diffrent things all I have stated was a fact about the tragdegies.

Having a knife in hilsburgh would have made no difference - do you know why the event even happened?

Second I'll be the first to say if the Americans on those planes during 911 had been trained even a little and int he right mind set maybe one or two would ahve died but the towers wouldn't have been destroyed. THATS OUR BAD 100% NO EXCUSES FROM ME.

No as one plane did resist - it was a well planned attack and what should have happened was US airport security should have done its job. One plane did fight back and they ditched the plane although its also rumoured the US armed forces shot it down. The planes were unguarded which is why the US air marshals were created. Where do you get this info from?

I'll state again and get on yahoo news and READ an article or two about whats happening here in the states the hurricane has cause crazy crap to be happening. National Guardsmen (thats some of our military) are shooting people for no good reasonh and watching people get raped in the streets IF these people were armed and trained then women wouldn't be getting raped and having their throats slit and the military wouldn't be shooting people who ask them to stop it.

Once again where do you get your info from - the National Guard were brought in to restore order not shoot inocent people. There is a state of hysteria and order needs to be restored. The reason why you have an armed mob is because stores like Wallmart continue to sell firearms even after collumbine. Someone else has pointed out that the National Guard are trying to control the situation and keep people safe it is also on the news here and it seems that mob rule has taken over and as there armed with guns it makes the situation worse.

But hell I guess thats just me making fun of another tradgey.

If i'm so childish they why did I try to get the thread back and track.

Cos you started it

And one last thing I have said this before and you have show absolute ignorance to this fact if you don't stop asking me how many people I have killed I am gonna PM a MOD. Pro's don't ask this people in jail don't ask this and people on the street don't ask this. Let me educate YOU this is the worst kind of manners EVER in any circle of people who have actually had to fight for thier lives and I know a few this is worst then asking your buddies wife how many guys she has been nailed by. If you knew anything about life and death situations you would know this so stop showing how IMMATURE you are.

That is because you have never used a knife on anyone - I am not asking some prison guy about it I am asking you..... You have never needed to use it but you carry one just incase. I could have used a knife years ago but still did not need it as my martial arts helped me that is why I do it. PM a mod I am sure they will be interested to see you posts about the people on the otheside of the pond. You have not used a knife but carry one anyway.

By the way nobody else here has said I'm an idiot or they're are just doing better things with thier time then yelling at the screen and typing in this thread because they aren't as immature as you.

By reading between the lines on a quote from someone saying they were not going to reply to your post, and others correcting you on your wrong interpritation of the Falklands War and WWII which you seem to have little knowledge on this I was taking to be the indicators.

Now did you have anything realavant to say about the topic of discussion cause if you want to rant start a thread called "drunkenmonkey is a retard" and have fun with it

This one is doing the same job as any thread I could start. I would suggest you get your story straight as on Map often first impressions last. I think I have a good rep on here for being a straight talking person.

As far as on subject we do martial arts to learn to protect ourselves. If you feel the need to carry a knife or gun why waste hours doing an empty hand art. It take no training to stab somoene - just carry a knife with you.

I dont carry a knife as I am now out of the kind of circles where one is regualry needed. I have plenty in my house along with swords etc but on the street I dont go to the kind of places where one is commonly needed and I dont have victim written on my head. People prey mostly on the weak and often the weak look like there weak.

[Sonshu]

usually folding knives, im also big into throwing knives and other things like throwing spikes. That's a great skill cuz i can throw a pen or pencil, steak knife or fork into someone up to 20 feet away (anythin further than that wont do much damage by the time the pen/pencil hits them)

I guarentee at ten or 5 feet throwing a pen or pencil at me wont do much apart from a possible flinch reaction. Throwing spike and knives are hard to get credible one and harder to use them.

I spend 5 years doing Ninjitsu and a good hand knife is better by far.

[drunkenmonkey]

Cold steel and bud nealy both make great throwing spikes and I know several people who can run at you from 30 feet away deploy 3 of these with pin point accuracy and the deploy and use a knife in about 6 seconds. Throwing spikes are easy to find from these 2 makers while not exactly Wal-Mart cheap well worth it and if trained regularly very good weapond to have along with a knife.

[drunkenmonkey]

If you wanna continue to harrass me go to the new thread I started yo're wasting valuable time of people who want to talk about martial arts. And you really need to lear to read the news because there ARE reports of Natn'l Guard ignoring rapes and shooting unarmed people. One man couldn't take the screams of a woman being rapesd so he confronted natn'l guardsmen out side the Superdome and they shoty him then quote "the mob took care of the rapist after he slit the woman's throat" thats in a documented article on yahoo news from Reuters so get the facts before you flap youir jaw SCooby Doo.

And even though other peoiple have posted on topic you're still personally attacking me. I am not feeding this stray dog so get of my front porch before I have to chase you off with a broom.

And itys a good thing in GB thats criminals stay in whatever area or zone you have designated for them there. But here our criminals no robbing each other won't get them anything so they go out to the nicer parts of town were people have money in thier wallets. I don't travel in circles were there is trouble but at trhe very least two words "home invasion" geez I guess I'm looking for trouble in my own house. I don't go to bars cause I don't drink I don't do drugs so going to bad neighborhoods isn't my thing but people are attcked in the yards at work or at stores everyday whereever you live by criminals and a criminal is someone who doesn't follow thw LAW.

And you have got to be the most dense rockheaded idjit in the world you have offended me and everyone in this forum by continually asking me how many people I have killed or stabbed. Snoopyu go give Charlie Brown your food bowl and prtend to be the Red Baron because once again if you had EVER been REALLY afraid for your LIFE in a REAL self defense situation you would know not only do you like to think about what you had to do or brag about it but you sure as hell don't want to talk about it so you're just showing blatanmt ignorance at this point. If you can't carry a weapon in your country fine don't stay outta jail , prison sucks I know weather you want to belive it or not is your OPINION its not a FACT but don't knock me and mine for having every advantage to stay alive.

I also notice you have a hard on for me because other people have posted since you started this verbal tussel and you seem to be avoiding them.
Call me names say I don't know a thing and that credibility you're so proud of is gonna go right down the toilet.
Now leave me alone Rin Tin TIn and go find your chew toy I have people here who want a serious discussion :D

[drunkenmonkey]

Thank you everyone who is still keeping this thread on track most of the last few posts have been great intelligent and incitful and I appreciate it sorry some people have to train wreck this and the survial T.V. show post was great it just added dimension to this thread.

thank you to most everyone

[Sonshu]

Cold steel and bud nealy both make great throwing spikes and I know several people who can run at you from 30 feet away deploy 3 of these with pin point accuracy and the deploy and use a knife in about 6 seconds. Throwing spikes are easy to find from these 2 makers while not exactly Wal-Mart cheap well worth it and if trained regularly very good weapond to have along with a knife.


3 at 30 ft away - Rubbish. But then it depends on what art you do as I know there are some people of certain styles that will buy this crap.

Also if it on the news then it must be true. Think I will leave you in dreamland.

[drunkenmonkey]

3 at 30 ft away - Rubbish. But then it depends on what art you do as I know there are some people of certain styles that will buy this crap.

Also if it on the news then it must be true. Think I will leave you in dreamland.

Wow tell me something where did you get all this knowledge and expierence from I mean you seem to have the ultimatley right answer for everything you're like some martial arts god or something you must be the most knowledegable MA on the planet and only in just under 30 years. You must have loads of combat expierence and trained under the best of the best. But I'm just a "winging child" who's full of crap and I see you're gonna follow everyone of my posts with belittlement because your pride was hurt. Keep trolling me please it'll keep my brain juices flowing so I can think better at how to deal with knowitall's like yourself. :eek:

[Sonshu]

Remember I asked you for your experience.

I have trained under some good instructors and now I teach and have been for the past 5 years. I did Ninjitsu and spent time with throwing knives and bo shurikens and there so bloody hard to use.

I have been training 14-15 years now and been around a lot of people who know what is what and what is practical. I am a better fighter than martial artist but I know plenty of truths about martial arts.

Most people dont like to here them - You do TKD and Shoulin (sp) Kung Fu right?

There are a good number of people who understand my views on map and also many I have trained with. 2-3 of my students are regular posters on Map so I must be doing something right.

[Hobbitlauncher]

It wouldn't surprise me if someone was that good, so I'll stay out of it. All I know is I can toss one from 20-30 feet away and hit (or get pretty darn close) to a playing card.

[Sonshu]

It wouldn't surprise me if someone was that good, so I'll stay out of it. All I know is I can toss one from 20-30 feet away and hit (or get pretty darn close) to a playing card.


Please post a vid of you doing this from 20-30 feet away and hitting or getting close consistantly with power on a playing card.

When using bo Shurikens I found them to be more accruate than normal ones and knives are ok but there such a random weapon that throwing the bladed item I have to someone is the last option for me as they might use it on me.

[drunkenmonkey]

Please post a vid of you doing this from 20-30 feet away and hitting or getting close consistantly with power on a playing card.

When using bo Shurikens I found them to be more accruate than normal ones and knives are ok but there such a random weapon that throwing the bladed item I have to someone is the last option for me as they might use it on me.

I will give respect where it is due and you have put in your time also I am glad to see you know there is a diffrence between an MA and a fighter. I listed some of my arts I have practiced some of the I didn't because they are unconventional and I don't really like to publicly advertise them. Second yes it would be hard to deploy 3 bo shurikens that fast but knealy throwing spikes are built diffrently than those.

And finally you asked me how many people I had stabbed not my expierence there's a diffrence if you want to know my expierence that will have to be a private conversation if I post it in here it would be the same as bragging.

[Matt_Bernius]

Ok, everyone's been busy and going off topic, so I'm going to temporarily suspend this conversation while I read through the previous posts. So have a happy Labor Day to the US folks and check back in later to see if this discussion gets opened.

- Matt the mod