Religious fighting arts?

[Adam]

I just read in some history book that during the various wars and crusades in medialval times, the holy warriors of the church were only allowed to fight with blunt and bashing weapons, because spilling the blood of humans was against god's will, and so developed their fighting skills to suit this weapon.

Also the Khali-worshipping Thuggee thief and assassin sect in India used silk or leather scarfs to strangle their victims because their religion forebade them to spill the blood of the enemies of Khali.

Does anyone know of any other methods of fighting, armed or unarmed, that have been influenced by religion?

[simonlarcombe]

Some eastern martial artists believe in the use of charms, tonics etc. used along with their religion for some quite strange things.

[aikiMac]

Originally posted by Adam
Does anyone know of any other methods of fighting, armed or unarmed, that have been influenced by religion?
Aikido was built upon religion. There are scores of books about the connection between the physical movements of aikido and the founder's religious beliefs.
Shaolin kung fu is the embodiment of Shaolin Buddhism. The Shorinji style of karate is closely related to Shaolin kung fu, and it too is very much built around Buddhism.
Some of the silat and kali styles are deeply tied to indigenous jungle religions.

[JediMasterChris]

Tai Chi is centered around Taoism I beleive.

[stump]

Gatka is a martial art linked to seik (sp) people. Not sure if teh link is cultural or religious but I assume there's elements of both

[YODA]

Many Silat systems are heavily entwined with their religion.

[stump]

And many of the Filipino martial arts have a spiritual side, using Amulets (anting anting) and oracions (prayers)

[Casado]

Most kung fu is Buddhist in origin, the three internal styles (Pa kua, tai chi and one I can't remember) are Dowist -they also invented acupuncture, Mo kung fu is muslim. Most Japanese and Korean arts are heavily influenced by Buddhism. Muay thai is Buddhist. Aikido seems to belong to a religion of its own.

In their native countries the religious aspect seems much more important than here in the west. Tai chi and Akido seem to be the only two that emphasise "mind expantion" as the main benefit of these arts in the west.

[JediMasterChris]

Most kung fu is Buddhist in origin, the three internal styles (Pa kua, tai chi and one I can't remember) are Dowist

That is the same thing as Taoist, yeah?

[vprengan]

Hiya,

Have you guys avery heard of Marathiyam. This is an ancient Indian Martial art which utilises a long pole to fight. It is amazing, as this art is very spiritual in its practise.

Once a person is allowed to use a pole to train, then one should think, that art is holy. No one is allowed to step on the stick. Apart from that you will be train to all 5 major worldly elements in Hinduhism. Only then you will be start you training.

Isn't that wonderful. mail me

[TkdWarrior]

ok i don't know much religiousMA'...
but i want to correct ur info on Thugee...
first thing thugs or thugee don't hav anything to do with kali...
some worship them some dont.

thugs r just michevious ppl who hav eye on ppl's money, they'll lie cheat and do anything but most of them don't kill cuz it causes too much attraction...
thugee is sort of attribute related to thugs
i've written on lengths on KungfuMagazine.com's forums on this. you can search on Thug and with my Name TkdWarrior

Kali is Goddess, one of avatars of Shakti(Lord Shiva's Wife). she's protector of her ppl and destroy evil. there r pics of her on net where u'll see her wearing a Mala made of Human skull those are asura's(Evil Doers/demon) skulls.
None Of Hindu God/Godess asks for killing of anything for worshipping her...

so next time someone tells u about kali n thugs then just remember this.
Thugs are evil doers and the word is used in one of Indian Dialects(language).
unfortunately even on site(Dictionary.com) Thugs are kali worshippers. they need to get their info correct.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
\Thug\, n. [Hind. thag a deceiver, robber.] One of an association of robbers and murderers in India who practiced murder by stealthy approaches, and from religious motives. They have been nearly exterminated by the British government.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
robber/deceiver is correct no religious motives but british didn't exterminated by it,cuz it's not cult.

-TkdWarrior-

[TkdWarrior]

hi vijen,
most of Indian arts are worshipped by their practioners,there is culture of worshipping ur weapons/armours in Khastriya Caste(Warrior Caste).
even before when they enter any GuruKul(School/Dojo) they worship(in the form of gesture call "DandVat Pranam") and only then they enter. sadly this culture is being westernised even in india. Indians don't like to be Indian anymore... a Shame.
-TkdWarrior-

[wayofthedragon]

capoeira........

capoeira was influecned heavily by religion. Hidden in it are african religous dances and rituals to hold on to their traditons. Also being that most of all africans were converted to chritianity when they came to the new world. They sang a lot of spirituals, in their "capoeira songs". I read that on a site about capoeira

[erikido]

I think almost all martial arts were based on religion. I take hwa rang do. Based on daoism.

[LilBunnyRabbit]

I just read in some history book that during the various wars and crusades in medialval times, the holy warriors of the church were only allowed to fight with blunt and bashing weapons, because spilling the blood of humans was against god's will, and so developed their fighting skills to suit this weapon.

Given what a heavy mace can do to unprotected flesh I suspect they used them more because they're incredibly effective against armour rather than to avoid spilling blood. A good heavy mace, swung hard from horseback, could quite happily take someone's head off or turn a large portion of the target into a bloodly pulp.

Swung against a knight, its better than a battleaxe.

[teacher]

Good point CKDstudent. What I heard may also be old meadeival myff. There is a quote in the bible about those who live by the sword die by the sword.
A heavy mace is an excellent weapon I suspect all spurious so called explanations came later.

[LilBunnyRabbit]

Actually I've always suspected the mace thing came mostly from D&D, where the cleric class can't use anything with a blade.

Most priests in England around that time would carry at least a dagger, partly because about 80-90% of the population was armed, usually with bows or staves or something similar, but priests could afford daggers.

[teacher]

Pretty sure I heard the miff before I did any D+D but it certainly reinforced the idea. Pretty sure I heard it from my dad as we visited Kelvingrove Museum ( cool arms and armour sadly closed at the moment) that would be just before original D+D.
Good God I'm older than D+D.

[LilBunnyRabbit]

Good God I'm older than D+D.

You poor, poor guy.

Don't worry though, you're probably younger than Chainmail.

[Louie]

In Ireland/Scotland around the times of St. Columba, priests carried a metal fan... present scholars are unsure of it's use, suggesting it was used to keep the flies off the Holy Eucharist... ??
They obviously haven't watched any Shoalin Monk movies....

Louie
http://dirkdance.tripod.com

[Hakko-Ryu]

Shaolin Kungfu was obviously influenced by religion...Shorinji Kempo also.

[tl Eric]

I'm Pretty sure that most CMA are based on Buddhism and taoist/daoist religions. Confucianism is also widely practiced in china but I'm not sure if it has had any influence on martial practices.

[47Ronin]

Most Japanese sword art are based on shintoist ways.

up all night, come chat.

Regards

[CKava]

Originally posted by Adam
during the various wars and crusades in medialval times, the holy warriors of the church were only allowed to fight with blunt and bashing weapons, because spilling the blood of humans was against god's will

I don't believe it was the general crusaders/knights that only used blunt weapons, they are pretty well known for using swords. BUT there was a Pope (Julius II) who was known as 'the warrior pope' and he is supposed to have only used blunt bludgeoning weapons for the reason you stated. You can see pictures of him in Tapestries riding into battle brandishing a big club!

Originally posted by Casado
In their native countries the religious aspect seems much more important than here in the west. Tai chi and Akido seem to be the only two that emphasise "mind expantion" as the main benefit of these arts in the west.

Im not so sure about that, there actually seems to be a trend for Western MA practictioners to be more focused/obsessed with the 'spiritual' sides of certain Martial arts than those who live where it was founded/commonly practiced. For instance amongst lots of young people in Japan Aikido is seen as a very 'uncool' activity its given the equivalent respect that most young people in the UK would equate to practicing ballroom dancing... (Oh and notice I didnt say ALL young people, just lots before someone tells me they are Japanese young and love Aikido).

[zun]

Hsing-i was developed by the chinese muslims.

I've read (can't remember the source - sorry) an opinion that there are three different types of martial art. Of the top of my head, these are.

1. develops fighting ability
e.g. Muay Thai, Boxing, Karate, Judo, Silat etc.

2. develops fighting and internal strength
e.g. Aikido, Hsing-i, Bagwa,

3. develops fighting, internal strength and spirituality
e.g. Shaolin, Taiji Chuan

Agree/Disagree? What's your opinion?

[Cudgel]

Originally posted by ckdstudent
Given what a heavy mace can do to unprotected flesh I suspect they used them more because they're incredibly effective against armour rather than to avoid spilling blood. A good heavy mace, swung hard from horseback, could quite happily take someone's head off or turn a large portion of the target into a bloodly pulp.

Swung against a knight, its better than a battleaxe.

Yeah I mean has any one looked a flanged mace?
its jsut a multi sided dull axe
And warhammers had nice poky bits on them.

[Sub zero]

Originally posted by Adam
I just read in some history book that during the various wars and crusades in medialval times, the holy warriors of the church were only allowed to fight with blunt and bashing weapons, because spilling the blood of humans was against god's will, and so developed their fighting skills to suit this weapon.




Hmmmm. Sounds a bit odd. I mean Myamato musashi fought for a long time wiht only a bokken (wooden samurai sword) and only lost one dule out of about 60 in hid lifetime (i tihkn ihe lost to whoever stylised the Jo as a a wepon) And i doubt many of them werte up to his standard.

So i would seem that teh spilling of blood was ok for arabs but not westerners.hmmmmm


What's this about aikido not having a knwon religion? I thought it was some form of buddisim or shinto (but i thought budhism

[Shesulsa]

I think almost all martial arts were based on religion. I take hwa rang do. Based on daoism.

Actually, the classic history of HRD states that it is founded on three religions - Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism (more a philosophy than religion).

The Hwarang Meng Sae was developed by a Buddhist monk, Won Kwon Bopsa.

[Visage]

Most kung fu is Buddhist in origin, the three internal styles (Pa kua, tai chi and one I can't remember) are Dowist -

Just for the record, there are more than 3 internal arts, and they're not all founded on the principles of Tao.

EDIT: and the one you cant remember is Hsing I

EDIT 2: Just noticed the dates on the previous posts. Let the dead rest in peace!