Multiple Opponents

[Black Dog]

Imagine yourself on the street, walking home late at night when you notice two people following you. You start to take off and run and they chase you to two other friends that corner you. What are your strategies for staying alive? (Assuming they're out for blood)

[Ikken Hisatsu]

hit one of them and try to make a break for it. failing that, get the living hell beaten out of me while i cry like a girl and offer them my wallet :D

[Sever]

Like Ikken said, hit one and leg it. Make sure you hit hard and first too, counterpunching will never work in a situation like that. If that doesn't work, curl up into a little ball until they've had enough and join a sprinting club when you're healthy enough so you can get away next time :)

[medi]

Launch into one of them simultaneously biting off their nose, gouging out their eyes and ripping their cheeks open.

[Bil Gee]

Act like a crazy man, hit at least one of them hard and fast and then run.

[Davey Bones]

For some insane reason, medi's idea might actually work. the "mike tyson" strategy. thugs don't like crazy people.

barring temporary insanity? i'm going to be a sheep and agree. hit one hard and fast and run like the wind while distracting the other with some loose change and a few bucks thrown to the ground.

[Punchy]

I have been in that situation but there were more than two of them. I hit one hard first and backed up against a wall so they could not get behind me. After a bit of a verbal argument I got away. My suggeston is to get in first and when trying to escape don't run as it will encourage them to pursue you. Back away facing them with guard up. Only aggression works in my experience. The submission stuff (offering your wallet etc) only encourages them and makes it a lot worse for you.

[Sgt_Major]

Personally I'd keep running into the 2 that are waiting, screaming like a banshee, and swing for them with fists and feet, trying to get through/past them without breaking my pace, but putting them on a backfooting, and just keep legging it!

[Trinity]

Forget punches or kicks this only makes you opponent very angree. in this situation if you are trained correctly then break dislocate and eyegouge this is what really makes the attackers think they have made a big mistake. To say hit and run in this situation with four guys might sound good and i believe if you lake confidence then it is the best and safest option but if you dont get away you will be in Chicken mode and tired and not in attack mode it will give them the advantage.
Any ways I think this subject has two many what ifs what if they chase, what if they are quicker, what if you cant run, what if they are drunk, what if they are skill fighters.
I have been in situation like this a few times and worse there has been times chosen to fight and others when i have ran it depends on situation. But i sugest to to people who either lack confidence or are unskilled with multiple attackers. A. Act Crazy. B. Run Run Run. C. Hit to the throat, eyegouge break and dislocate and run. Or D. All of the above.

PS: Silatpupils option is awesome as well.

[moononthewater]

Get myself a taxi home!

[Matt_Bernius]

Personally I'd keep running into the 2 that are waiting, screaming like a banshee, and swing for them with fists and feet, trying to get through/past them without breaking my pace, but putting them on a backfooting, and just keep legging it!Acutally, I recommend this route over the simple hit and run. A key trick in all of this is to run through the people in front of you. And try to run into a very well lit area, still screaming like a bansee and attracting as much attention as possible. Also running into a store or some other insitution is a great idea.

Overall people don't expect the person playing victim to charge them. Doing so can provide a temporary cognative overload that will aid in the escape.

The other thing to do is start scanning for environmental weapons. Heck even stabbing someon with a pen or pencil could help your situation.

- Matt

[GojuKJoe]

I would just attack the nearest one as hard, fast and brutally as i could, then run for it.

[Black Dog]

There are a lot of hit and run suggestions... Wow.
I understand the logic of running, but there's always a good chance one of the four is faster than you. It may sound rash and overconfident, but if you're well-trained, strong, and fast, you probably could knock a couple of them out before they get the chance to really strike back. Then, wouldn't the odds start to landslide in your favor?

[GojuKJoe]

There are a lot of hit and run suggestions... Wow.
I understand the logic of running, but there's always a good chance one of the four is faster than you. It may sound rash and overconfident, but if you're well-trained, strong, and fast, you probably could knock a couple of them out before they get the chance to really strike back. Then, wouldn't the odds start to landslide in your favor?

I don't think anyone on this forum could take on four opponents at once. Except maybe Siphus :D . To be honest, I think it's more likely that you will be faster if you train for sprints as well as fighting, so I'd definately take my chances with hit and run, or just run if possible.

[Ikken Hisatsu]

I can only think of 3 people with verified accounts of having beaten up more than 4 determined attackers- Bas Rutten, Coban, and Mark Hunt. I seriously doubt anyone on these boards comes close to their respective level of skill so 4 dedicated attackers is probably pushing it.

[Scarlet Mist]

I'd break out in wonderful song vocalizing like the Romanian pop group the Outlaws, while I sing their song "love from the linden trees" while dancing like the Numa Numa kid.

[spikeg]

Hi the first in the throat and run, if they come after you therell only be 3 left (or 2 if one is calling an ambulance for his mate) keep repeating above step untill no one is following you

lol you get the idea, hit and run is the best i think, alternatively a rear naked choke on one and you drag him backwards putting him between you and his friends, then when he passes out run for it :)

the idea of the hit and run is just to make an oppurtunity to get away and also most people dont like or want to get hit so if the attackers think that what happened to their friend could happen to them theyll think twice about coming after you

[Scarlet Mist]

Hi the first in the throat and run, if they come after you therell only be 3 left (or 2 if one is calling an ambulance for his mate) keep repeating above step untill no one is following you

lol you get the idea, hit and run is the best i think, alternatively a rear naked choke on one and you drag him backwards putting him between you and his friends, then when he passes out run for it :)



And then the blows raining forcibly upon your head will bring you back to reality. This is not Rurouni Kenshin, you know.

Nu ma nu ma iei

[Raven Wing]

I have faced off against more than four once but the emphasis is on face off, I was damn lucky that they were not absolutly at the point of just running in and stomping me - if they had have done that I probably wouldnt be here typing this. The only tactic that really helped was aggression - anytime one of them came close I went straight at him. It was my luck that they were marginally more afraid of being hurt than they desired to hurt me. I guess they were looking for a victim not a fight. If they had all come in at once (about 6) then I guess the only thing to have done would be hit, grab anything and try to rip it off and basically take a serious beating. Believe me if I could have just run off I would have.

[Sgt_Major]

There are a lot of hit and run suggestions... Wow.
I understand the logic of running, but there's always a good chance one of the four is faster than you. It may sound rash and overconfident, but if you're well-trained, strong, and fast, you probably could knock a couple of them out before they get the chance to really strike back. Then, wouldn't the odds start to landslide in your favor?

If you run, and one of them is faster than you, you end up with a 1-1, at which point you have better odds.

if you're well-trained, strong, and fast

thats a big if, cos it also includes if you're better trained than them, stronger than them, and faster than them, cos they have numbers on their side.

even you knock a couple out, which is unlikely, you will hurt them, but probably not knock out in a few secs, you still got a 2-1, which has bigger risks than the option of running for a 1-1.


And thanks for backing of my idea guys, it was based on, as matt says, attackers expect victim behaviour from you, not an aggressive assault, which is what they will see coming, and screaming makes them think there might be something mental about you so can help make them wary, as you close on them, Id expect them to get more wary, and possibly assume a defensive position, which is what your aiming for as your not actually going to engage them, rather pass through.

I would say tho' this is only effective with plenty of space between you to start with. If its enclosed, or they are only 10feet away from you, its gonna be a different kettle of fish!

[HEN]

Hit first dirty as you can nut shots and eye pokes!

[Black Dog]

Well, let's take into consideration that a lot of people only think they know how to fight from seeing MA movies (rolls eyes) and maybe some street experience. Plus, they are probably more used to fighting with a crowd behind them than one on one. If you start to cut down their numbers, their confidence gets extraordinarily shaken.

I know that it is different from street fighting, but a lot of people here have probably sparred against multiple opponents. Some may have won and some may not, but those are usually against trained fighters who are almost always tougher than your average street thugs.

[cxw]

I can only think of 3 people with verified accounts of having beaten up more than 4 determined attackers- Bas Rutten, Coban, and Mark Hunt. I seriously doubt anyone on these boards comes close to their respective level of skill so 4 dedicated attackers is probably pushing it.

There was some Muay Thai trainer who took on 4 machete weilding home invaders as well. You'll find the article on Bullshido.

I agree with you though that 4 determined attackers is almost impossible. Of course in reality sometimes only 1 might be that determined.

[Sgt_Major]

I know that it is different from street fighting, but a lot of people here have probably sparred against multiple opponents. Some may have won and some may not, but those are usually against trained fighters who are almost always tougher than your average street thugs.

and your sparring partners are trying to floor you and stomp on your head?? :rolleyes:

[Black Dog]

and your sparring partners are trying to floor you and stomp on your head?? :rolleyes:

That's why I said it was different. Full-contact sparring is different than street fighting in that you are not trying to kill each other (usually). But, what you need to win in a sparring match like that isn't THAT different from what you need to win on the street.

[Bil Gee]

It really boils down to who the four assailants are, if its a gang of young children, or a rampaging mob of little old ladies I don't think you'd have to be at the top of the tree in MA to ensure your safety.

Most streetfights that I've seen involving groups tend to have one person initiating the attack with a group of less brave people hanging around to put the boot in once the person goes down. In this case knock out the right one and the rest will probably back off for long enough for you to get away.

On the other hand a good control and restraint team can take down just about anyone, ussually on the basis of a weeks training. The general idea is a team of four, one on each limb and one holding the head. I've seen this technique work effectively, against formidable opponents, when not one member of the C&R team has any MA training or would be able to hold their own in a fight.

I don't think a general principal would be useful for this and you would have to judge each situation on its own merits.

[leo]

if you can take one of them hostage break his fingers then choke him and tell the others you will break his neck if they attack you and you wont let him breath untill they are out of sight, when they are out of site leave him and run before they come back. Ofcourse ud have to make a little distance between u and teh other oppoents for this.

what bone breakign techniques does everyone here know? is there any information on how to break someones arm ect easily on the net?

[ap Oweyn]

Well, let's take into consideration that a lot of people only think they know how to fight from seeing MA movies (rolls eyes) and maybe some street experience. Plus, they are probably more used to fighting with a crowd behind them than one on one. If you start to cut down their numbers, their confidence gets extraordinarily shaken.

I know that it is different from street fighting, but a lot of people here have probably sparred against multiple opponents. Some may have won and some may not, but those are usually against trained fighters who are almost always tougher than your average street thugs.

You're really reaching here dude. When you start describing your theoretical opponents' level of expertise, fitness, and coordination, you've made the shift from hypothetical situation into fantasy writing.

Think about sparring. How often have you honestly landed a shot where you could say to yourself "man, if I'd followed through with that, he'd be out cold!" I'm guessing if you're being completely honest with yourself, one-hit knockouts would be very infrequent indeed. So now you're talking about at least a couple of hits per bad guy. And how long do you think it's going to take for four (or even three) dudes to dogpile you?

It's possible to beat those odds. But not even remotely as easy as you're suggesting.

Think about this: The first guy (assuming they're kind enough to go in order) doesn't have to fight you well. He just has to occupy you for a moment or two. Hell he could get knocked out cold and fall toward you and accomplish that. And how long do you think it'll take for three other guys to bum rush you while you're dealing with one?

You'd have to have stellar shot placement to land those knockouts, brilliant footwork to avoid getting surrounded or dive tackled, and more endurance than a movie buff sitting through a Kevin Costner film festival.

Nah mate. That's a bad scene any way you paint it.


Stuart

[Splush]

When I was 13 I beat the removed out of 3 people trying to harm my five year old brother... I don't think that counts though.

Edit: mis-info, I was 12...

[Splush]

I'm not talking about getting jumped. Just street-fighting in general.

If you are a dedicated MA who trains hard and realisticaly, I personaly think you should be able to defeat two average joe opponets similiar to your body type.

[Sgt_Major]

we talkin 4, not 2

[Splush]

we talkin 4, not 2


Ya... I know.... Just saying. :(

[TheCount]

With martial arts yes you may have an advantage but then you may not. A guy at my school claimed to be so tough while he was given me and some mates grief and he was apparently trained in the art of ninja and so on and knew all this deadly stuff. My mate has never done MA in his life or weights, beat the living daylights outta him.

Video Deleted

That just about sums it up lol. You never know whats gonna happen and its so easy to get taken by surprise

[Lennert]

I have neatly survived an encounter with 5 attackers. I think what saved me is that they didn't really surround me from the start, so I could knock the first one out before the others could actually get to me, then I managed to take 2 more down (1 with a punch, breaking his nose, other with hane goshi) before I got away. I kept the other 2 at distance with simple pushkicks..
But I've seen people post you should get down and roll up.. NEVER lay down, ALWAYS try to keep standing.. If you lay down, your dead..

[Sever]

But I've seen people post you should get down and roll up.. NEVER lay down, ALWAYS try to keep standing.. If you lay down, your dead..Who said that? The nearest I've read is that your best bet when you get knocked/ taken down (and you most likely will if you've got four determined, capable attackers on you), curling up will give you more chance of avoiding serious injury than just laying there

[Lennert]

Maybe I misread it :) either way.. it's better to try and get up again, If you keep laying down, in any way, your dead meat..

(depends ofcourse on how dedicated your attackers are, if they are kind of dedicated they'll just keep on kicking untill you stop yelling..)

[KenpoDavid]

we practice multilpe attacker situations, mainly focused on avoiding takedown for as long as possible... and getting back up once taken down. It seems the most important thing you can do is to keep your feet moving. As soon as your feet stop moving they get their hands on you and that's it.

Sometimes it works well to go right over one of them and sometimes it is best to circle to the outside. You just have to flow and read and move... and try to move so that one obstructs the other.

[Paul Genge]

The most extreme form of defending against multiple opponents takes place when you work in a crowd. I have an article on my site covering the approach Systema has to learning this work. Click here for a direct link. (http://website.lineone.net/~paul_genge/page55.html)

Paul Genge
Russian Martial Arts Northwest (UK) (http://www.russianmartialart.org.uk)

[MarioBro]

Well, more than 3 or 4, run like heck.


But for 2 attackers, a common strategy is to keep them in a line from you (if you have the room) so you are always fighting against only one of them and he is blocking the other...then take that one out hard. This may take alot more movement, but once you get the first guy incapacitated, chances are the second will back down...if not, he (she) is still only one.

[leo]

The most extreme form of defending against multiple opponents takes place when you work in a crowd. I have an article on my site covering the approach Systema has to learning this work. Click here for a direct link. (http://website.lineone.net/~paul_genge/page55.html)

Paul Genge
Russian Martial Arts Northwest (UK) (http://www.russianmartialart.org.uk)

the advice given on there unfortunatly seems to be orientated to you knowing it is going to happen and having enough time to ewmpty your pockets etc.
as for staying relaxed but mainting posture i.e i move my feet only if there is noone to stop me from falling i completely agree with do use as one of my tactics.
the most ppl i have had a fight with has been about 15 on more than one occasion, ok i never managed to beat them all infact i only ever managed to take out one guy in all all cases but relaxing stops you getting hurt as you absorb blows as well and i have neevr fallen to the floor in a multiple attack situation. Oh except when i was sittign on teh floor and all my mates did a pile on on :D

[JKD_forever]

try to impress them with your knowledge of katas, and maybe they'll let you go with minor bruses hehehe :Alien:

[leo]

try to impress them with your knowledge of katas, and maybe they'll let you go with minor bruses hehehe :Alien:

lol, finally a good reason to learn katas!!!

[leo]

other ways of defending against multiple attackers, always wear a fake vest bomb so they *insert word here* them selves when they start pushing and pulling you and find a bomb attached to you.
I hold no liability for any arrests made using this method

[Black Dog]

I've always thought that the key was not to let them surround you, because then, a guy just pops you in the back of the head.
Then you just have to control the distance between you and your attackers and always stay on your feet.
I definitely agree that when you're on the floor and 3 or more people are waiting to pound on you, you are screwed.

[Rebel Wado]

One key is to be able to make a quick and accurate risk and threat assessment of the situation. What tactics you use depends much on the threat and risk which includes an assessment of how the environment and culture play into the calculations.

For instance, being on the ground kills your mobility but there are situations where it gives you a lower profile, such as if someone is shooting a gun, the ground may provide you with best choice to cover and not being a target, giving you time to draw your own weapon. Or if people are running by you, hiding behind something solid might provide you with temporary cover, etc.

Against some threats, distance may be the best option whether that be back pedalling or running full out away.

Having a wall behind you can cover your back, but in other situations it inhibits your escape.

Match your tactics to the assessment based on threat, risk, environment, culture, situation. Be prepared.

[Natswoo]

A well aimed kick in the balls can keep a male attacker down for long enough to escape..... or atleast long enough to take the other 1.....
But best defence is to run... run as fast as you can and into a populated /defended place asap.
If cornered then start growling, and make youself look like some kind of maniac... worked for me

[uki]

plow into each of them like an avalanche; the force of rolling boulders. :)

[ap Oweyn]

uki has a black belt in metaphor. :)

[Sonshu]

Things I have seen from a multi opponent situation (this if from my experience) on 2 occasions I have picked up a few things.

1) If you feel there will be trouble you MUST take the initiative and start to cut at least one down as soon as possible

2) Make noise it can attract the attention of door staff or members of the public that may assist (double edged sword)

3) Lie - tell people there are CCTV cameras about as your mates brother works in central control for the police and they will get arrested as the cops will be here in a flash - then if they go call the police to pick you up!!!

4) Be prepared to make a mess of someone, so go in with conviction if the case warrants it!

5) Keep busy and keep moving it means you are more intimidating when attacking a person and others are less interested in getting into the melee.

6) Make a point of saying you do not want to fight Say it fairly loud so if it goes to court people will hear this, support it with defensive gestures open hands etc. This is only if you have the chance though as people remember gestures more than words often and CCTV does not show words often.

7) Expect to take some knocks and work fast, use your fear (it will be there).

8) If you hit the ground GET UP as soon as you can and be aware there may be more people than you can actually see (kicking out time at clubs etc)

9) If you can’t see the attack coming your ON YOUR OWN and most of these don’t apply as you will be in trouble!!!!!!, if you remain coherent then use them but you cant defend the ones you don’t see - Keep some mates about you.

[Matt_Bernius]

Very, very, very nicely put Sonshu. You've hit all the biggies and then some!

BTW congratz on the Nuptuals... Matt

[Kwajman]

Things I have seen from a multi opponent situation (this if from my experience) on 2 occasions I have picked up a few things.

1) If you feel there will be trouble you MUST take the initiative and start to cut at least one down as soon as possible

2) Make noise it can attract the attention of door staff or members of the public that may assist (double edged sword)

3) Lie - tell people there are CCTV cameras about as your mates brother works in central control for the police and they will get arrested as the cops will be here in a flash - then if they go call the police to pick you up!!!

4) Be prepared to make a mess of someone, so go in with conviction if the case warrants it!

5) Keep busy and keep moving it means you are more intimidating when attacking a person and others are less interested in getting into the melee.

6) Make a point of saying you do not want to fight Say it fairly loud so if it goes to court people will hear this, support it with defensive gestures open hands etc. This is only if you have the chance though as people remember gestures more than words often and CCTV does not show words often.

7) Expect to take some knocks and work fast, use your fear (it will be there).

8) If you hit the ground GET UP as soon as you can and be aware there may be more people than you can actually see (kicking out time at clubs etc)

9) If you can’t see the attack coming your ON YOUR OWN and most of these don’t apply as you will be in trouble!!!!!!, if you remain coherent then use them but you cant defend the ones you don’t see - Keep some mates about you.

Sounds like you've had some personal experience.... :)

[minimal]

By attacking with more than two in their team, they have escalated it to the realm of lethal force, so get on that wavelength. You want to control space so that you keep, when possible, one opponent near you and between you and the others.

This is one of the few situations where I would advocate something like an eye-strike. Not as the first move, but early, when a nearby opponent has compromised guard. (You should never be able to predict your first move, and neither should your opponent.) Once an opponent is hit and temporarily not a threat, do something nasty to them like breaking the elbow backwards. Throw the person after that into the other opponents and choose either the closest, or the one you think you can take or manipulate the easiest, and break them next.

If you have to run, run around a corner and when it would give the best element of surprise, run back into the nearest opponent and finish with a break or two. Rince, repeat.

Or run into a populated area, somewhere with security like a bank or nightclub (or best of all police station).

Breaking gives you a chance of scaring the other opponents, tying them up helping their injured friend, who should be making a decent amount of noise, and semi-permanently puts the attacker in question out of the assault business.

Remember that they have made it a potentially lethal attack, and once you break someones arm you must assume they'd do the same and you must maintain control. You've got to assume they might kill you anyhow. Most important is not to let two people get in striking range at the same time.

Impromptu weapons can be important in a situation like this, but don't lose other advantages like timing and position fumbling for a weapon. Even dirt could help.

Getting witnesses to your desire not to fight is certainly wise, when possible. These same witnesses might also help.

Hopefully the situation will not come up for any of us.

[Sonshu]

Sounds like you've had some personal experience.... :)

I have had the odd bad day so to speak but thankfully not for a few years now.

Cheers

[Sonshu]

Very, very, very nicely put Sonshu. You've hit all the biggies and then some!

BTW congratz on the Nuptuals... Matt

Cheers Matt, 3 weeks into it now! - think I covered most points off the top of my head.

[Hades]

friend of mine had this sort of problem... he was doing his work as a paperboy in the early morning... it was in a suburb.. and two guys asked for a cigaret, and punches his face... his bike falls on him, and they start beating him... kicking... his defense was quiet simple.... roll up like a ball... and scream, curse and shout at them.... it didn't take long before people woke up, and got out bed... the guys took off... quiet effective apparently

[Hades]

by the way... hasn't anyone come up with looking for objects on the ground? I know I feel a lot more comfortable when holding a piece of glass or a metal pipe in my hand...

and a question for all of you... what do you do when you're threatened by a couple of assailants... say... 4 guys of you're size.... and one of them is holding a knive... or they have bats... or brassknuckles...

your thoughts on this please..

[Sonshu]

Say sorry or pray your faster!

I think the chances of getting cornered by people with these weapons are slim and from experience (in UK) so far the only time I will get that kind of heat I will be expecting it as you have to cheese someone off pretty badly to get that kind of response or you by bad luck enounter 4 very unhinged people.

If I am expecting trouble like that I deal with it before its 4 on 1. Make it 1 on 1 and then call it a day not that I am advocating violence.

As mentioned about picking weapons up on the floor, in the UK there are no bottles or metal bars laying about (depends where in UK :Angel: ) but I when ending up on the floor with kicks raining down just had a loud voice saying GET TO YOUR FEET, COVER YOUR FACE!, grabbing someone as a shield I crawled my way up him for balance as was a bit disorientated.

[Albert]

Yah ive been in that situation but with 5 guys instead of 4, i would do what i did then, and try to fight all of them, which isnt as smart as making a run for it, but thats just me. And sonshu yah that post was nice, those things i would say, are dead on. Especially 1 4 5 7 and 8 once the fight starts.

[Sonshu]

Cheers Albert!

[dcr_70]

Assess the biggest threat out of the four and pre-emptively attack, also using plenty of verbal, to the usual disabling targets - eyes, nuts, knees. Then leg it! If you've knocked the wind out the group leader the remainder are less likely for chase.

[reel deel]

While in the process of running you could also use obstacles running through car parks, jumping fences anything that will slow them down.
If there is one who is faster than the rest, turn, hit, and run, (assuming that you can run of course) look for weapons of opportunity, house bricks bottles bits of wood, If you can find somewhere to hide long enough to catch your breath then do it ( as long as the hiding place is a good one)
I was chased by four lads many years ago, I was in a fish and chip shop, and I was chased through the streets by four guys (The reason being at the tme I had long hair and wore a leather jacket, this seemed a good enough reason for them to want to beat the crap out of me) Fortunately I knew all the alley ways bushes everything like the back of my hand (I lived just around the corner) and I used this knowledge to run and ambush, hide and ambush, I finally escaped through a gap in a fence, Though I know that everyone might not have the luxury of knowing the area in which they are attacked, the use of hiding, camoflage, and ambush can still apply.
I do reccomend a book by Marc 'the Animal' Macyoung called street e&e (escape and evasion) it's a great book that gives you all sorts of strategies for this kind of thing.

[NaughtyKnight]

Imagine yourself on the street, walking home late at night when you notice two people following you. You start to take off and run and they chase you to two other friends that corner you. What are your strategies for staying alive? (Assuming they're out for blood)

A good friend of mine got attached by 12 lebs when he was coming home from a the pub. He jumped up and bit off the first guys ear (tyson style). The other guys left him alone because they thought he was a nut case. Saved him from getting a nasty beating.

[Serpent]

Good in movie example of what to do vs multiple people is in the movie Baby Boy. When Tyrese and his friend had Snoop Dogg cornered Snoop hit one of them in the face and that guy fell to the ground. Then Snoop started running away.

[Timmy Boy]

Forget punches or kicks this only makes you opponent very angree. in this situation if you are trained correctly then break dislocate and eyegouge this is what really makes the attackers think they have made a big mistake. To say hit and run in this situation with four guys might sound good and i believe if you lake confidence then it is the best and safest option but if you dont get away you will be in Chicken mode and tired and not in attack mode it will give them the advantage.
Any ways I think this subject has two many what ifs what if they chase, what if they are quicker, what if you cant run, what if they are drunk, what if they are skill fighters.
I have been in situation like this a few times and worse there has been times chosen to fight and others when i have ran it depends on situation. But i sugest to to people who either lack confidence or are unskilled with multiple attackers. A. Act Crazy. B. Run Run Run. C. Hit to the throat, eyegouge break and dislocate and run. Or D. All of the above.

PS: Silatpupils option is awesome as well.

IMO the aim of a multiple attacker situation should be to enable you to escape, not to try and cause as much damage as possible. A solid punch to the face may not knock them out, but it's quick and will give you the split second you need to get away. I think locks are far too slow and technical to be messing around with in this situation.

Speaking from my limited experience... one thing that may be on your side in such a situation is the psychology of your attackers. If they're really determined then I don't think there's much you can do, but sometimes (especially with random chavs who want to fight for no reason) there is a good reason why they're attacking in groups - they know that they couldn't take you on their own! I have found in my experience that you can sometimes emerge from a multiple attacker situation by battering one of them so hard that the rest are too scared to attack you, especially if that person is the leader of the group who they're all hiding behind. However, I have also seen people (including myself) get completely swamped with numbers because the attackers were determined and got worked up into a frenzy.

[Freeform]

Hey Timmy, in my experience that only works if you've got a right cross like a mule and the 'leader' goes down in one. Otherwise the other lads will not be detered enough not to swarm you.

But then every situation has it's idiosyncrosies, there can be very few hard and fast laws.

[Freeform]

4) Be prepared to make a mess of someone, so go in with conviction if the case warrants it!


Hey Craig, I just picked this one out because of its pivotal nature (and I agree with you). This is one of these talk the walk things, it's easy enough for somebody to say and think this, but most people haven't considered this all the way through.

Are you prepared to gouge somebodies eye out (t3h ub3r ;) )?
bite somebodies ear off?
smash their face into a shale wall and drive it down?
break a limb?

Until you've been in a situation it all goes a bit Hollywood in your head, then when you actually get into a real situation you get the 'pre post-fight repercussions' thing going on.

The problem here is cyclic, you don't know what's being asked of you until it happens, and you can't mentally prep yourself for it unless you know what it is.

All these fears of repercussions have to be out of your mind so that you can do the job, which means spending some time to think about it outside of your normal life/training. This is the part that most people haven't done and why they can't go through with 'whatever it takes'.

[NaughtyKnight]

The only real defence against mulitple attackers is run rabbit run.

One thing that did work for me was calling out the leader. Say stuff like "why be a bitch, you and me settle this". etc. You can just see him shrinking as his mates laugh. Sometimes it works and you get a 1on1 fight and its left at that. Other times they smack you down.

[karate princess]

i dont really know how id handle it untill i was actually there, but in class we do an exercise to help with group attacks.
one person stands in the middle of a circle of people and each person in that circle has a number. my instructor calls out a random number and we have to find them and defend their attack of choice. it is quite effective and if you cant remember the numbers you have to rely on the sound of movement or looking out of the corner of your eye.
also i find it best to start with facing the most menacing opponents and have my back to the weaker ones.

[Freeform]

i dont really know how id handle it untill i was actually there, but in class we do an exercise to help with group attacks.
one person stands in the middle of a circle of people and each person in that circle has a number. my instructor calls out a random number and we have to find them and defend their attack of choice. it is quite effective and if you cant remember the numbers you have to rely on the sound of movement or looking out of the corner of your eye.
also i find it best to start with facing the most menacing opponents and have my back to the weaker ones.

That's not a group attack scenario, that's a single aggressor from an unknown angle/attack. Now if everyone in the cirlce piled onto you, THAT would be a multiple opponent scenario.

[NewLearner]

I can only think of 3 people with verified accounts of having beaten up more than 4 determined attackers- Bas Rutten, Coban, and Mark Hunt. I seriously doubt anyone on these boards comes close to their respective level of skill so 4 dedicated attackers is probably pushing it.

You can add Prof. Wally Jay who sent several muggers to the hospital when he was in his 70's, if I recall correctly.

The running is probably the best thing for anyone to do. But what do you do when you can't run? I have a bad knee and a bad hip. I am not going to out run anyone. The best I can do is to head towards others, find a good defensible spot, and find something I can use to even the odds. 4 against 1 is going to be nasty.

[101madfilipinos]

angles, my good man, angles.
shield yourself from one with the other.
escape.by any means necessary.
if you run and one catches you.
hit fast and hard with whatever will hurt the most with the intent to incapacitate..
then run more.
if you cant run...
angles, my good man, angles.
shield yourself from one with the other.
weapons-whatever they may be.

[NewLearner]

Karate Princess, we do the same drill. However, that is not fighting multiple people. Fighting multiple people is when they all try to get you at the same time.

[robertmap]

Hi All,

I'm not going to try and outrun four attackers - unless they have just come out of the old folks home - they WILL be faster than me and probably being younger they will have WAY more stamina.

What would I do?

Well I hope I never have to...

but...

first - Smile a big smile and say something menacing.

second - Whoever I can get to first - do my very best to make a bloody painful screaming example of them.

next - assuming that his mates have started having a go and I'm taking some hits - again focus on another one to make an example of and so on...

If at any time they should pull a gun and shoot me or stick me with knives - or even beat / kick me to death - hopefully say something REALLY menacing just before dying.


Happy thoughts :) :) :)

All the best.

Robert.

[Xav]

well if you see their friends in front of you dont stop running and think "dam, what to do now!!!", run faster elbow at front and run through them. Think its a rugby match, if you look though they might be surprised and avoid you. If they somehow stop you do everything to get away, fingers in their eyes.
I think there's always a running possibility if you are standing

[101madfilipinos]

ever play red rover?

[101madfilipinos]

ill give it another try too.
dont think.
just live.

[Giver]

Whenever we do 2-on-1 or 3-on-1 sparring, my professor always tells us to line up our opponents as best we can. It's the same kind of strategy as runnning into an alley so that they can't get you from all sides.

I'd line them up, take one down(or use them as a shield), and move around so that they can't surround me. While moving I'd strategically place kicks at the groin, and punches at the kidneys.

[C Mellis]

I'm a cross country addict, so I say run, run, run :D . Its all very well shouting for help but if your being chased by a group of people,
a) How many people would come to your aid - not many I'll be willing to bet,
b) Even if they do then they are in the same position as you. Then you have to worry about them as well :cry: .
In my opinion it is better not to get anyone else involved. Just Keep running and running until they get bored or tired. From my experience chavs have a notoriously short attention span. In the UK half of the chavs hang around on bikes as well, so that does make running....interesting.

Originally Posted by Giver
I'd line them up, take one down(or use them as a shield), and move around so that they can't surround me.
Have you ever tried moving around so you are not surrounded :confused: ? Its allot more difficult than you think. Besides, how do you plan to use one as a shield?

[101madfilipinos]

if anyone thinks they can stand and bang with 5 people and win , 5 people of any size or strength, the exception being maybe 5 eight year olds, you train at a McDojo in a mall, have never been in a fight in your entire life, and your instructor is a complete fraud who doesnt "spar/fight" because he has some ailment of some sort, or his techniques are much too deadly.you also are probably a couch potato and enjoy roll playing games.

tell em i said it.
-101 mad flips.

[Hokuten_Zodiac]

Hey guys, ill put in my two cents if you dont mind. First off, im a security gaurd, and i watch multy perp atacks almost regularily, so ill try to do my best to explain what i have seen, and what i would do (if not on duty) in such an attack. First off, forget punching, nobody cares you work the bag 4 hours a day, you dont know how many hits any one can take, secondly, most attacks where the victim faught back only last a few seconds, so you got to think fast. I train in southern temple tiger style (real nasty stuff) so it goes like this. You notice two guys following, YOU RUN, you see 2 more in front, get up to a sprint as fast as you can, and make your movents as irregulare as possible at point of impact to confuse your attackers as too where your going to strike. Now, heres the nasty part. While sprinting, you can do one of two thing at point of contact. First is keep feet planted, and tiger claws fast, furiosely, and accuratly as possible to eyes, and i dont mean these wimpy eye pockes, i mean total facial tareing, raor like a tiger and rip every peace of skin of their faces between two to four seconds. Second thing, jump into the attacker with the most room on his flank, and rip him to peices. Has any one ever seen a normal house cat fight, do that. Its so fast and devistating you cant even see how many swips and claws they each took to the eyes. The moment you even get more than arms reach from them, RUN RUN RUN, and like the rest said, even if one can catch you its now one to one. Tears his eyes out, is the best way. Intimadation goes along way too, you wanna act like brawler, hmmmm, nah, too wimpy, so how about savage like a tiger, nah we aint animals we can do better. I like to think............DEMONIC POSSESION, act like the devils inside you and send him to hell, but the bottom line is, RUN when you get a chance. Unless your a master at breaking, you can do that either, unless your 240, punchin dont work, use low kicks to keep distance if neccisary, but in my oppinion, any one can claw, slash, snatch out eyes, tear with nails on face, and you dont need a wind up either, just put you nails and hands on his face while avoiding the first hit and make HIM scream like a banshee. Thats all folks.

[Penance]

Here's the cover page to the manual on attacking multiple opponents (yes, attacking).

Lesson 1: Squirrels

Try approaching a squirrel. You'll notice that as you get closer to the squirrel it moves away, ultimately putting some sort of object between you and it, be it a tree, a dumpster, or even another person.

Block your line of sight with as many attackers as you can. Put attackers between you and other attackers. So forth and so on.

Lesson 2: Death as an Example

The easiest way to discourage other attackers is to merely remove one attacker from his support (attacking him and forcing him away from the rest of the group). Beat mercilessly into a bloody pulp, if you can manage to bull rush him and get him to retreat (sometimes you'll just have to give chase). Wash, rinse, repeat, if they aren't running at the sight of a mangled comrade.

Lesson 3: Like the kids at Bible Camp: We BeLeavin'

You can never lose if you run away. If you run far enough, your attackers will have different speeds/endurances. If you have the stamina to string them out a little, this will decrease the likiness that they will catch you all together.

Lesson 4: Unleash the Kickass

If they are undisciplined, untrained fighters, pick the two largest ones and make them hurt a lot. Focus on the attacker that is within your personal space (your own circle of hurt). Change your facing often enough so that it is difficult to get behind you. Move so your attackers have difficultly coordinating their attack.


Good luck with specifics. Text will make demonstration difficult.