Point-sparring strategies

[PsiCop]

This thread is aimed at giving a wide range of secrets and tips for very effective point sparring matches. I've started us off with some of my strategies and "what to do if..." situations. Please feel free to give some feedback on my strategies or add your own. The biggest reason I'm making this thread is because I aim at improving all my skills in MA over the course of my summer vacation. I thought I'd start out with sparring, because that is one of the hardest to master, and because everyone can benefit from interacting in the thread.

1)The most effective combos I've seen in TKD/TSD are usually started with 1-3 kicks and end with some follow-up hand techniques. Your views?

2)What if you're faced with an opponent who is considerably bigger than you. Not nessesarily taller. More in terms of a 6 foot tall, 300 pound guy that looks like he'll pound you to dust. The best skill I've noticed for this situation is having a developed spinning back kick. Opponents like this usually tend to try and keep pushing you back into the corner of the ring, or out of it altogether. Another thing I've noticed is that they tend to keep their body faced toward you... perfect opening for a back kick. The two biggest tips I can give you on using a back kick on these behemoths is to make it fast, while still being able to see your target, and to put it into a straight line from the floor to the target. That is one of the biggest mistakes I see with the spinning back kick is most people will spin and bring their leg up into a chamber similar to a side kick, then push it out just like a side kick. With a person's leg swinging around them like that in their spin, you can see it a mile away and almost always take measures to prevent it's point. If you bring your back kick up straight from the ground, they can't even see it. It travels a shorter distance, making it quicker, and will almost always score if you perfect it. Keep this back kick tip in mind for any opponent. Only I found this strategy works best when you're faced with tanks. Any other strategies you guys would like to share?

3)Roundhouse kick, roundhouse kick, roundhouse kick... This is by far the most common kick I'll see thrown alone (no combo). Another thing i noticed is that people who almost exclusively throw this kick never score with it. Roundhouse kick is great when used in spinning kick combinations, but by itself is almost useless. My tip-If you're planning to throw a single roundhouse kick and that's all, forget it. It's a waste of energy and time. A skilled MA can counter and score on you almost instantaneously for 2 reasons: It's easy to block, and because they realize how much this wasteful kick is thrown in singles (usually by lower ranks, but I've seen Dans do this quite often also).

4)Know your opponents. Watch them carefully and notice their patterns and weaknesses. If you're at a tournament and have never seen this person before, and luck has you placed in the first match against each other then improvise. I would try a small variety of different techniques and basic combos for the first 40 seconds. Watch carefully and see how he reacts to them, and if and when he strikes. Look for openings and blind spots. Anything you can notice as a weakness can usually be effectively exploited against him. After this beginning period has ended, use the rest of the time scoring points and blocking the combos you've seen so far, but always be ready for a suprise if you've never seen this person before. And also be very self-aware. If he's experienced, he'll be watching for your weak points too.

5)What to do when faced with a tall opponent, or one with a considerably longer reach than yours'. The best tip I can give is to get in on him. His longer reach is useless if you're too close for it to make any difference. This is where highly developed and fast hands come in handy. If at all possible, don't get out of your own reach, you can think of this as the 'kill zone' for fighters like this. They love it. Some may contradict that this plan gives you no chance to plan if you're always in his face attacking in a flurry. Well, every tournament has a brief period where they tell you to stop fighting while the judges give their call. Don't rest or even pay attention to what they say, just plan your next set of hand combos. Any thoughts about this strategy?

6)Very fast opponents are deadly and can often win entire tournaments based simply on their quickness alone. The only tip I can give you is don't slow down, speed up! Also search for any weaknesses they might have. Speed point scorers often will depend on a single fast move to score a point, if they do this, use your combinations and you should be able to overwhelm him overall. And if he uses combinations and doesn't have any apparent weak points, just move as fast as you can and do your best. Once in a while, you'll come across a fast fighter with no weak points, uses combos, and leaves little open to be scored upon. Fighters like this will seem better than you in many ways, but don't get discouraged. Fight your best, and there's still a chance you'll win.

7)Combinations are your best friend. Learning to use them effectively will win a great number of matches for you. If you throw a flurry of 3-15 techniques at your opponent with no seeming end, you will almost always score with at least one of them. Don't stop when you've gotten a point, keep going until the judge calls break. A good hand combination to follow up some kicks that I use is backfist, punch, ridgehand. You alternate hands every technique and face them the whole time. You can keep this combo going forever with no pauses. For example, you backfist with your right hand, punch to the body with your left, then ridgehand to their head with your right hand again. After your ridge hand you do the exact same combo except backwards. since your right hand is out with the ridgehand, you immediately use your left hand to do a backfist to the same side of their head while pulling your right hand back to the chamber. Visualize it, and you can get it. It's hard to describe in words, but just visualize. I look forward to hearing your sparring combinations.

8)Develop good defense. If the opponent can't even score a single point on you due to a lightning-fast defense, you only need to score once! True, it's impossible to develop a 100% perfect way to defend any technique or combo, but you get my point in seeing that a strong defense can make a match much easier to win, because you don't have to score as much yourself. It's like Baseball. If your team has a great offense and you score 10 points every game, but always lose because your pitching is terrible and the opposing team scores 20 points, you can realize the point.

9)Walk away from every match having learned something. If an opponent scored on you 2 or 3 times with the same technique to the same spot, realize why. Think about what you did wrong, and how you can improve it.

Well, there you have it. That's about the entire depth of my 7 years of point sparring experience. Are there any beneficial strategies, or personal/secret combos that you have and would like to share? I've givin my knowledge, now add to it with yours':cool:

[Andy Murray]

Hi PsiCop,

That's a good post.

I've done a bit of 'point' in my day, so I found that very interesting.

[Helm]

Eeh i'd add something, but this seems stop-point ITF and im not sure WTF is what your looking for, as different stagegies pay off in WTF.

However the Tall/heavy one is the same, staying close..

[DarkKnight1967]

I agree with Helm. Being in WTF, strategies don't always coincide. For instance, I can't use ANY hand techniques - absolutely no hands to the head and they rarely (if ever) give points when hands are used on the body. I strongly agree with your points on round house kicks and combos, though. Rarely have I seen a single round garner a point (except in kids and lower belts). However, a round kick, turning back, ax or swing kick CAN be effective.

Thanks for the great post PsiCop.

[Greg_G47]

even in WTF hands can be really useful. If you get inside of a roundhouse kick combo (takes a bit of speed to do this) you can easily put someone on their back by punching into the solar plexus while their leg is in the air. :)

[Helm]

Hehe yeah, thats actually one of my favourite things to do in competition when im ahead, it saves loads of energy and really annoys them..

Plus a solid punch "accientially" thrown just above the body protector can hurt them alot.

Not that i would ever do such a thing ;)

[mattsylvester]

Low roundhouse (I know, not allowed but don't make contact :)), jab, cross, rear high roundhouse. Nearly always guaranteed to make contact at some point.

Hook kick across/over the head, hang the kicking leg and blast out tappy roundhouses as they come in to punch. Works nearly everytime :) I even got people pointing out on buses for that one :)


This thread is aimed at giving a wide range of secrets and tips for very effective point sparring matches. I've started us off with some of my strategies and "what to do if..." situations. Please feel free to give some feedback on my strategies or add your own. The biggest reason I'm making this thread is because I aim at improving all my skills in MA over the course of my summer vacation. I thought I'd start out with sparring, because that is one of the hardest to master, and because everyone can benefit from interacting in the thread.

1)The most effective combos I've seen in TKD/TSD are usually started with 1-3 kicks and end with some follow-up hand techniques. Your views?

2)What if you're faced with an opponent who is considerably bigger than you. Not nessesarily taller. More in terms of a 6 foot tall, 300 pound guy that looks like he'll pound you to dust. The best skill I've noticed for this situation is having a developed spinning back kick. Opponents like this usually tend to try and keep pushing you back into the corner of the ring, or out of it altogether. Another thing I've noticed is that they tend to keep their body faced toward you... perfect opening for a back kick. The two biggest tips I can give you on using a back kick on these behemoths is to make it fast, while still being able to see your target, and to put it into a straight line from the floor to the target. That is one of the biggest mistakes I see with the spinning back kick is most people will spin and bring their leg up into a chamber similar to a side kick, then push it out just like a side kick. With a person's leg swinging around them like that in their spin, you can see it a mile away and almost always take measures to prevent it's point. If you bring your back kick up straight from the ground, they can't even see it. It travels a shorter distance, making it quicker, and will almost always score if you perfect it. Keep this back kick tip in mind for any opponent. Only I found this strategy works best when you're faced with tanks. Any other strategies you guys would like to share?

3)Roundhouse kick, roundhouse kick, roundhouse kick... This is by far the most common kick I'll see thrown alone (no combo). Another thing i noticed is that people who almost exclusively throw this kick never score with it. Roundhouse kick is great when used in spinning kick combinations, but by itself is almost useless. My tip-If you're planning to throw a single roundhouse kick and that's all, forget it. It's a waste of energy and time. A skilled MA can counter and score on you almost instantaneously for 2 reasons: It's easy to block, and because they realize how much this wasteful kick is thrown in singles (usually by lower ranks, but I've seen Dans do this quite often also).

4)Know your opponents. Watch them carefully and notice their patterns and weaknesses. If you're at a tournament and have never seen this person before, and luck has you placed in the first match against each other then improvise. I would try a small variety of different techniques and basic combos for the first 40 seconds. Watch carefully and see how he reacts to them, and if and when he strikes. Look for openings and blind spots. Anything you can notice as a weakness can usually be effectively exploited against him. After this beginning period has ended, use the rest of the time scoring points and blocking the combos you've seen so far, but always be ready for a suprise if you've never seen this person before. And also be very self-aware. If he's experienced, he'll be watching for your weak points too.

5)What to do when faced with a tall opponent, or one with a considerably longer reach than yours'. The best tip I can give is to get in on him. His longer reach is useless if you're too close for it to make any difference. This is where highly developed and fast hands come in handy. If at all possible, don't get out of your own reach, you can think of this as the 'kill zone' for fighters like this. They love it. Some may contradict that this plan gives you no chance to plan if you're always in his face attacking in a flurry. Well, every tournament has a brief period where they tell you to stop fighting while the judges give their call. Don't rest or even pay attention to what they say, just plan your next set of hand combos. Any thoughts about this strategy?

6)Very fast opponents are deadly and can often win entire tournaments based simply on their quickness alone. The only tip I can give you is don't slow down, speed up! Also search for any weaknesses they might have. Speed point scorers often will depend on a single fast move to score a point, if they do this, use your combinations and you should be able to overwhelm him overall. And if he uses combinations and doesn't have any apparent weak points, just move as fast as you can and do your best. Once in a while, you'll come across a fast fighter with no weak points, uses combos, and leaves little open to be scored upon. Fighters like this will seem better than you in many ways, but don't get discouraged. Fight your best, and there's still a chance you'll win.

7)Combinations are your best friend. Learning to use them effectively will win a great number of matches for you. If you throw a flurry of 3-15 techniques at your opponent with no seeming end, you will almost always score with at least one of them. Don't stop when you've gotten a point, keep going until the judge calls break. A good hand combination to follow up some kicks that I use is backfist, punch, ridgehand. You alternate hands every technique and face them the whole time. You can keep this combo going forever with no pauses. For example, you backfist with your right hand, punch to the body with your left, then ridgehand to their head with your right hand again. After your ridge hand you do the exact same combo except backwards. since your right hand is out with the ridgehand, you immediately use your left hand to do a backfist to the same side of their head while pulling your right hand back to the chamber. Visualize it, and you can get it. It's hard to describe in words, but just visualize. I look forward to hearing your sparring combinations.

8)Develop good defense. If the opponent can't even score a single point on you due to a lightning-fast defense, you only need to score once! True, it's impossible to develop a 100% perfect way to defend any technique or combo, but you get my point in seeing that a strong defense can make a match much easier to win, because you don't have to score as much yourself. It's like Baseball. If your team has a great offense and you score 10 points every game, but always lose because your pitching is terrible and the opposing team scores 20 points, you can realize the point.

9)Walk away from every match having learned something. If an opponent scored on you 2 or 3 times with the same technique to the same spot, realize why. Think about what you did wrong, and how you can improve it.

Well, there you have it. That's about the entire depth of my 7 years of point sparring experience. Are there any beneficial strategies, or personal/secret combos that you have and would like to share? I've givin my knowledge, now add to it with yours':cool:

[mattsylvester]

Another good way of scoring against WTF is to fake a punch to the head (they hate that) like a backfist and then punch to the chest. Freaks 'em out. :)

[Burnsey]

A good technique that i've been shown is starting techniques that take different lenghts of time to complete at the same time (sorry about the poor explanation).

For Example If you throw a punch to the body and start a roundhouse to the head at the same time, the punch will land first quickly followed by the roundhouse. This method is faster than the usual punch then kick combo and it is hard to defend against.

[mattnz]

Nooooo, zombies are everywhere!

[neryo_tkd]

Nooooo, zombies are everywhere!


matt this is the second time you're doing this. if you don't have anything creative to contribute, don't post at all.

[Incredible Bulk]

Another good way of scoring against WTF is to fake a punch to the head (they hate that) like a backfist and then punch to the chest. Freaks 'em out. :)


no hand fakes to the head are allowed seeing that its an illegal move provoking a response :p

this is ITA rules though, but it should be the same for everyone else

[neryo_tkd]

no hand fakes to the head are allowed seeing that its an illegal move provoking a response :p

this is ITA rules though, but it should be the same for everyone else


i agree, since it is not allowed, no point in doing it.

[Ragnarok2005]

I'm by no means an experienced sparrer, but I know from fighting with experienced people a few tips and tricks.A move everyone seems to have overlooked is twisting kick. Not sure what the Korean is, but it's like a front kick but curving your kick outwards. I've had people throw punches to the chest and head to occupy my guard and then snap that one into my ribs. It's very effective. Another one is goburyo sogi 'jamming' kicks. People pulling their legs into the side piercing kick [Ap-Cha Jirugi] chamber position with their leg serving as a guard and then simply doing sharp kicks leg to leg when I try to kick them, or doing a side kick if I try to get close or around them. While we're on that subject, how do I deal with people doing that technique?

Pressure is a brilliant strategy in sparring. There's plenty of people who guard and then dash out for one strike that is easily blocked. The people who always beat me are the ones who know how to alteranate between guarding solidly and then attacking fiercely at multiple points putting me under pressure to defend everywhere and to fall back. They almost always hit me. And vice versa. It works when I do it.

[Incredible Bulk]

i whole heartedly agree that pressure is one of the best tactics/strategies to use. I am always moving forward and i only move backwards to avoid a kick i know that would be hard to block.

It throws people off their game when they have this person moving forward all the time. I acknowledge hits so its not like i'm just steaming into kicks and punches, its the other way round, my opponent is spending so much time on defense and avoidance that they only start their attack when i've stopped or there is a natural "lull".

[ZenPixelTKD]

. People pulling their legs into the side piercing kick [Ap-Cha Jirugi] chamber position with their leg serving as a guard and then simply doing sharp kicks leg to leg when I try to kick them, or doing a side kick if I try to get close or around them. While we're on that subject, how do I deal with people doing that technique?


Side stepping, or sliding off to the side, whatever you want to call it, is one method.
Or you can fake so that they throw the side kick while you are just out of range, I am talking like 3 to 6 inches out of range, not a whole arms length back. The moment after the side kick is thrown, before they retract or drop their leg, is when you rush in/ counter. If they are the type that drops their leg, even better, because at that moment, their balance can be a little off.

Hope this gives you some ideas

[Taliar]

People pulling their legs into the side piercing kick [Ap-Cha Jirugi] chamber position with their leg serving as a guard and then simply doing sharp kicks leg to leg when I try to kick them, or doing a side kick if I try to get close or around them. While we're on that subject, how do I deal with people doing that technique?


If someone's keeping you at distance with side kicks, the first thing to do is make sure you circle towards the heel side off their kicking leg, as its lot harder for them to follow you effectively that way.

If they'e slowish you can try and do what Zen suggested and jam their leg down and come over the top, learning to jump in and leave you legs behind will help in this but does require good timing.

If you feeling nasty just axe kick over the top, just make sure that it looks like your going for the body, but dont worry to much if you catch their leg, may pick up a warning but hopefully they'll be more hestitant about keeping their leg up, - gotta follow in with strong hands.

You can step out and counter with a turning kick but as your moving to the toe edge they will be able to follow your movement easier, so only use if your very quick or much taller or their tired.

My favourite is to make sure your in closed stance, sweep across with a waist block and back kick, should be able to get them with that but takes alot of practise to do without telegraphing it to high heaven.

[xxblackkatxx]

People pulling their legs into the side piercing kick [Ap-Cha Jirugi] chamber position with their leg serving as a guard and then simply doing sharp kicks leg to leg when I try to kick them, or doing a side kick if I try to get close or around them. While we're on that subject, how do I deal with people doing that technique?



To kind of further the side-stepping thing- it's an excellent oppertunity to work your angles. Angles can be one of the strongest weapons in your arsenal, so long as you know how and when to use them.
Like both Zen and Taliar said, move to the side.

What I do whenever someone tries this, or a back kick for that matter, I slide up and to their back, i.e. if you and your opponent are faceing one another, he fires off a right-leg side piercing kick, move quickly forward and to the left- you're RIGHT on them right behind them, and what's open? Their guard is on their OTHER side, they've got virtually no defense against a head shot. Slide in and BAM, hit to the head gear, two points.

Another one to use is when someone throws a front turning kick- slide to their open side and smack them upside the head. This one's got to be WICKED quick, though, as you're in full veiw and they juuusstt might be as quick as you. With this it's almost a Hail Mary, you're going to their open side and there's a possibility of them hitting you, but that's why you've got to be lightning quick and give them a shot to the head or chest. You can tag them with either a jab or a kick, it's all on you. The kick requires the skip-in, it covers distance and whatnot. But again, with this you've got to have speed.

Tonight I've got class, so I'll come back and post some more sparring tips if I can.

PsiCop- you've created an excellent thread and your tips have helped me a LOT and as I've got a tournament coming up I definately needed them and DEFINATELY plan to use them, so thanks a lot :D

-Kat

[Carly_TKD]

Front kick off the front leg is a winner every time for me. Hand techs after kick combos r good too!

[Ragnarok2005]

I've got a point-sparring competition on the 12th February. So we're doing a lot of preperation and we've got two champions coaching us. I've learned a lot of little tricks for point-stop this last week. These are not moves that I'm telling you to do, they're coming from two excellent sparrers with 20+ years of experience each.

People try to stay in opposite stances. So if your opponent's left leg is forward, you will put your left leg back. It's subconscious. But if you watch people this is the most common 'face-off'. My instructor does the opposite, and it's very intimidating. I tried to switch stance because it felt un-natural to be sparring him with the same leg forwards. As if I was exposed. He switched with me. My defence was to throw a quick punch off the front hand at his [very close] head to get him to move back. However due to the feet positioning he was ideal to simply step to my blind-side, backfist me in the head. Point.

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f54/ShaunMcLorie/sparposition.jpg

Crude Drawing. The black feet are mine.
-
A jumping back fist strike at a distance. The flash towards the eyes causes then to guard and blink and the jump causes them to halt their advance. As long as your legs are covering your ribs you won't recieve a counter. As soon as their guard is up, your back hand then strikes them in the body. When I was told that I doubted it could work... It definetly does.
-
To deal with a blitz attack. Jump in the air smack them on top of the head. It's vital your back hand covers your ribs while your in the air otherwise you can get hit. A backwards moving, flying turning kick into the ribs is a move I scored twice with tonight against a guy I've never been able to counter before. His arms were up high punching and my leg clipped him underwards. Very nice 2 points.
-

I understand that these techniques are fairly complex. But then everybody knows the most common combos that get used. The above 3 are ones I've used tonight and struck with them. Your opinions?

[xxblackkatxx]

Alright, after manya fruitless nights hoping for sparring, last night was one!

I learned very very quickly that if you throw a quick axe kick, then immediately throw a mid or high section front turning kick, you're likely to get a tag with it. I.E. you and your opponent are closed-facing, both of you have your right leg forward. you throw an axe kick at them, be it in an actual attempt to score points or just to lead to this next part, and then once your leg comes down, put your foot down quickly, and rocket your leg back up at them. their guard's up, they're confused as all hell, and if you're quick enough it's an easy tag.

another one to work is the flying punch. sounds funny, and it feels it at first, but sometimes it's the best thing. It's just like one of the things Ragnarok said, except you two are closed-faced, and your lead handblocks your opponents lead hand down, while simultaneously jumping and pummeling them in the head with your back hand. it's interesting to try out, so the process of action is: jump in/smack their hand down, punch their head.
This is an excellent technique for shy sparrers, or one's that don't expect an aerial/ head shot.
Ideas on how to lead up to this technique?

Switchkicks are another thing that i've found worked, but not always and they've got to be quick. If you don't know what this is, it's where you throw a front turning kick, then immediately throw your back leg. You can do it numerous times, I usually max out at 4 or 5. it's a good way of getting their guard down, chasing them out of their lines, trying to measure them up, or trying to score points.

aaannnddd..
methinks that's all i had time to process :D

hope it helped, give me opinions on 'em if you want
-kat

[HwaRang]

[QUOTE=Ragnarok2005][Ap-Cha Jirugi] chamber position with their leg serving as a guard and then simply doing sharp kicks leg to leg when I try to kick them, or doing a side kick if I try to get close or around them. While we're on that subject, how do I deal with people doing that technique? [QUOTE]

dont worry about it, eventually they try a high kick and get an accidental sharp kick to the nuts. they dont do it often after that :cool:

[Carly_TKD]

What competition is it on the 12th Ragnarok2005? i've got one that day too!

[Ragnarok2005]

Hampshire County Championships.

Do you live round here Carly?

[Carly_TKD]

Hampshire County Championships.

Do you live round here Carly?

It's not the same one i'm going to! No, I live in the West Midlands. :)

[Hapuka]

I have one technique i like to use from time to time in a sparring match and that is if some one is coming forward you with a side kick I like to jump backwards diagonally blocking the side kick so it goes down and tagging my opponent with a jumping turning kick (jumping round house kick) or jumping forward diagonally with a jumping double punch to the head. lol. I may be a yellow belt in ITF taekwon-do but I know this technique works. :D.

[ShadowWarrior]

I intend to watch your next sparring match and see this work :p