defending yourself / running away

[Solomon]

i'd love to take tai chi when i get the time and money, so maybe there are just somethings i don't know about ma's much, but anyway...

i'm seeing alot of advice to runaway if possible. And i'm thinkin whaaaaaa?

why not use the training you've been given? its supposed to work right?

now i know this much, you don't try to take on a knife/gun/group/much larger oppenent, yeah then you run, but if the guy is your size give or take, than don't you face him? (as long as your defending your self and not the aggressor)

i was tought never to run from a fight. stay till its over/till the attack is over.

[surgingshark]

Because for all you know, the assailant may have a dozen of his buddies (hidden from view) waiting to pounce on you if you stay.

[Timmy Boy]

Because for all you know, the assailant may have a dozen of his buddies (hidden from view) waiting to pounce on you if you stay.

Or just better at fighting than you.

[surgingshark]

Or concealing a weapon.

[Timmy Boy]

Or concealing a weapon.

Or a million other reasons :D

[surgingshark]

...and that's why running away is a good idea :D

[robertmap]

Hi,

Not getting into trouble - VERY GOOD

Talking your way out of trouble - GOOD

Walking away - GOOD

Running away - GOOD

Fighting - BAD
- It's always BAD - no matter what the situation - of course sometimes it may be necessary - but it's still BAD :(

All the best.

Robert.

---
Robert Agar-Hutton
Instructor Protectics Karate Jutsu
Instructor Luton Tai Chi Club
4th Dan Kyu Shin Ryu Karate
www.p-k-j.org (http://www.p-k-j.org/)

[Dr.Syn]

Read ALL of the above posts...Excellent comments...

[Thomas]

I agree with all the previous comments... our fighting skills really should only be used when there is no alternative... mainly because "anything that can go wrong could go wrong..."

Beyoind that, if you do have to fight, finish it as quickly and efficiently as possible and then immediately get out of there.

[leeless]

The most effective way of not getting beaten up is not being there. It's also the easiest.

[Solomon]

alright, thanx for the help.

[kayraku]

lol peopel who run are weak in my opinion, dont run because then the people will rember you by the wussy person who ran, you dont want that you want to be rembered as the guy who beat them up or somthin i dunno. i just think running is bad.and if some on had a gun pointed to your head then u dont really have a choice to run so y not beat him up and take the gun wile your at it, i joined ma to defend my self not to run so i dont knwo y all of you run froma fight but i will allways stay there intill its over, thats wat were taught right?

[Gasg]

I agree with most of the others, there's a million reason why not to fight. But i want to add about the size of your opponent. Even if he is much smaller than you, really annoying and everything, if you can get out, do it. My kung fu master is really small and thin, yet im 'scared' even just to hold the punch/kick bags when he wants to show something. Now i sure don't judge people by their size. I hope i make sense..

About looking weak and everything, i prefer to look weak than to look 'cool' or whatever in a hospital bed. And i can't speak for everyone, but at least im taught not to fight.

[Florida Warlock]

There's no chance I'd run from a fight. If the guy is much bigger, I have a knife. If he has a weapon, I'm faster than he is, so that won't help him. Cutting wrists usually disarms well. :)

If you're against the group, once you take the leader down, they all get scared and back away(usually). If they all come at you at once... that's not good. But I still wouldn't run. I have a knife for that, too. :)

The common street thug usually isn't a martial artist. the advanced street thug may be an interesting opponent, but still probably an easy k- opponent.

If they have guns, running most likely won't help. You'll just die tired. :o If it's a bank robbery, there's a chance they're professionals, so even I wouldn't try to be the hero. Some people could probably disarm one if they were threatening them at gunpoint, then use the guy's body as a shield; but I wouldn't try it.

If you're gainst one guy with a gun, disarm him. As a martial artist, you're hands are faster than his.

Don't take my advice; might get ya killed. That's just what I'd do; I'm psycho in fights. :D

Never fight for money; always fight for life.
(and freedom, racism, etc. :))

[E-Rocker]

My instructor's instructor (Guro Rick Faye) describes self-defense as "safe escape." Nothing more, nothing less. Running away is often a much more efficient and direct route to safe escape than fighting.

Y'all can stick around & try to bust heads if you want to. I've got a wife to get home alive to. :love:

[YODA]

My instructor's instructor (Guro Rick Faye) describes self-defense as "safe escape." Nothing more, nothing less. Running away is often a much more efficient and direct route to safe escape than fighting.

Y'all can stick around & try to bust heads if you want to. I've got a wife to get home alive to. :love:
When Rick Faye speaks - I'm all ears.

[robertmap]

Hi,

"If you're gainst one guy with a gun, disarm him. As a martial artist, you're hands are faster than his"

Um, why? How do you know that the guy with the gun isn't a better martial artist than you - I was over in Malaysia a few years ago and on the news a housebreaker (thief) had been caught by the police - he had been competing (the month previously) in the South East Asia Games as a Silat competitor - so lets see he would (probably) be damn near world class - good with knives and he's robbing a house - you decide to have a go - and?????

Yes of course there are all sorts of circumstances in which you have to fight - but if you can avoid fighting - that is the highest art... Why? Because killing and hurting is easy - any punk can do it - preserving and safeguarding life is the way.

All the best.

Robert.

[Bob1770]

The most effective way of not getting beaten up is not being there. It's also the easiest.
LOL, my dad always told me, (especially when posting bail that I have a knack for being in the wrong place at the wrong time). I don't seem to have a problem getting beaten, but I sure had a knack for getting arrested, sometimes when I didn't do it! :D

[enquirer]

If I run then the average snail will catch me .... from behind. Made me think.

[Cosmic Monk]

Avoid all confrontation if you can is my view, if you cant, do what you need to..... then run :)
As for guns... it doesn't matter how fast you are! :woo:
and a good drill for knives... have a mate / student attack you with a red marker pen (as if its a knife) with your shirt off.... then you'll see why knife defense is a risky business as well.

[Infrazael]

*ahem*

my philosphy of self-defense

AVOID FIGHTING IF POSSIBLE. IT'S POINTLESS. GOING CLUBBING, HITTING ON GIRLS, OR WATCHING A MOVIE ARE ALL BETTER OPTIONS.

ONLY use your training as a last resort. If you MUST use it, use whatever you know to end it as quickly as possible with minimal damage on either side (knocking the aggresor out is a good idea tho).

[GCS15]

If they have a gun do what they say.

Some of you are giving such bad advice you should be ashamed. Making assumptions on other peoples skills is very bad. If you have ever seen the results of a gunshot wound you'd be advising differently. Got a gun and want my wallet? It's yours

I call for the forum moderators to censure any advice regarding disarming firearms. This is such a dangerous area. If a fully trained, gung-ho, battle tested SAS to the core soldier can get wounded in a knife fight against an untrained thug a "I am Bruce Lee reincarnated" stands a good chance of being the next person I pick up in my ambulance. Let me tell you the survival rate is POOR.

Moderators - if you want to censure me on this go ahead. Guns are BAD news. No macho BS please relating to weapons which equate to making the baddies choose between shoot / don't shoot or threaten / potentially kill.

Just my opinion and my experience. Hey I'm getting better at firearm injuries so your chances may improve but then again why take the chance? Your injuries may exceed the skill of the most experienced A&E team but what the hell. Have fun

[surgingshark]

I call for the forum moderators to censure any advice regarding disarming firearms

I wouldn't go that far...

[GCS15]

I wouldn't go that far...

Not doubting your ability to handle yourself but would you accept full responsibility for someone taking action regarding advice in this thread? I know that I wouldn't like to. " Your honour I'm not GCS15 and I would NEVER advise people to take on an armed assailaint. I can't be responsible for 15 year old Johnny's actions acting on that advice"

I read a quote regarding firearms. Can't recall from where but it goes a little like "when talking about guns small men talk loudly and the big men shut up". It's a nice equaliser that strips you of all your training and brings you down to being made of flesh and bone where basic anatomy and physiology rule "air goes in and out and blood goes round and round. Anything else is a bad thing" pretty much sums it up.

I am no IT expert but I am sure a well financed mother or father could hire a forensic IT expert to determine the real person behind a user name. Hey they did it for MP3's so why not for the person who advised their child to fight a person armed with a knife?

My opinion

[surgingshark]

I'm saying that theft is not the only reason a person will point a gun at you or thrust a knife at you. If their only reason is to kill you, you're dead anyway, so if the option of running away is unavailable (e.g. cornered, open field with the other guy being a better shot than Golgo 13), then wouldn't you rather take the slim chance of survival than just stand there and, with a red felt pen, draw crosshairs on your forehead?

note: this advice is only for when escape is no longer an option

Now for the censureship...

Advice is just that, advice, now although I might not agree with how a couple of people would go about the situation on this thread, advice, unlike orders or command, has the option of you not taking it. One's opinions, no matter how much you disagree with it, should not be censured (except for those that were specifically mentioned in the Terms of Service), because let's face it, Martial Arts instructors will teach you disarm moves at some point, so it's undestandable for their students who are on MAP to relay the information.

My opinion.

[redsandpalm]

I presume this is all trolling, but just in case any-one would take any of this advice;

There's no chance I'd run from a fight. If the guy is much bigger, I have a knife. If he has a weapon, I'm faster than he is, so that won't help him. Cutting wrists usually disarms well. :)If the police bring you in for anything, ever (even making too much noise at night or urinating in public on the way home from the pub, i.e.you don't have to be a hardened criminal to see the inside of a police station), they will ask you to turn out your pockets. It's illegal in most places (certaintly the UK) to carry a concealed weapon like that. If you ever use it on someone you're totally screwed. Attacking with a knife inherently risks killing the opponent - I assume most MAPers would have a problem with that. If you had a bright career planned, it might be scrapped now.

If you're against the group, once you take the leader down, they all get scared and back away(usually). If they all come at you at once... that's not good. But I still wouldn't run. I have a knife for that, too. :)This has to be a joke.

The common street thug usually isn't a martial artist. the advanced street thug may be an interesting opponent, but still probably an easy k- opponent.Interesting??? Something tells me you've never taken a good headbutt to the face before.

If they have guns, running most likely won't help. You'll just die tired. :o If it's a bank robbery, there's a chance they're professionals, so even I wouldn't try to be the hero. Some people could probably disarm one if they were threatening them at gunpoint, then use the guy's body as a shield; but I wouldn't try it.Good, depending on the ammunition type and the gun caliber etc. somebodies body will most likely make a very inadequate shield. If somebody is shooting off a gun (especially if it's not particularily aimed at you) then you run, keeping low, zig zagging, and get around a corner or if you have to, take refuge behind the wheel of a truck/car before getting out of there. People who are experts in guns and situations involving them all say that running and taking the actions outlined above will be of most help.

If you're gainst one guy with a gun, disarm him. As a martial artist, you're hands are faster than his.Than his trigger finger?? He/she will probably stay out of your effective range anyway. Do whatever you percieve to be the least dangerous thing. If they want your wallet, give it to them. If they just want to kill you, and you think you're so close to them that running away would be more dangerous than attempting to disarm - then go for the disarm.

Don't take my advice; might get ya killed. That's just what I'd do; I'm psycho in fights. :DCongratulations. I wonder how many of those fights you could have avoided or actually actively encouraged?

Never fight for money; always fight for life.
(and freedom, racism, etc. :))I presume you want to fight to abolish racism?

Alot of people read these posts, many of whom you don't know. Someday they might end up in a sticky situation and recall advice given on forums like this. It's just a case of being responsible in your advice.
Being macho is not a good goal for a martial artist to have. I'm glad to see so many people reply with a simple 'run away' because it really cannot be overstated enough. People always say stuff like 'Well what if I'm cornered and there's a tiger on either side of me and Linford Christie is trying to attack me with a knife. I can't run away then, can I?' Maybe not, but realistically running will be the best option in almost all scenarios (or maybe a fluster of parrying movements followed by running :) ). Going around trying to come up with new and more extravagent scenarios where you absoloutely have to use your MA skills shows that you're thinking aggressively, and that thinking isn't good for stopping fights it's good for breeding them. Actually carrying a knife on you is worse.

run

[reikislapper]

I know I'll get a moan about this one, so I'll just put what I feel to be true lol,

Right then firstly, I've always been taught from day one not to engage in any fight outside the class structure.

If I had to defend myself and I knew the person then I might just go against what I'd been taught if it ever happens (where's an evil smiley when you need it lol ). I would first make sure they had the warnings they deserve and let them know that I wouldn't be going down without a fight and I'd make sure they would come off worst.
I do have respect for all of my past teachers and always will but they all know that you can only be pushed so far before you fight back.

I know that self control has a lot to do with it but when your in the situation then sometimes all you have learnt in the classes goes through the window and you just go in like the rest.
(sorry)
lisa xx

[GCS15]

Not doubting your ability to handle yourself but would you accept full responsibility for someone taking action regarding advice in this thread? I know that I wouldn't like to. " Your honour I'm not GCS15 and I would NEVER advise people to take on an armed assailaint. I can't be responsible for 15 year old Johnny's actions acting on that advice"

I read a quote regarding firearms. Can't recall from where but it goes a little like "when talking about guns small men talk loudly and the big men shut up". It's a nice equaliser that strips you of all your training and brings you down to being made of flesh and bone where basic anatomy and physiology rule "air goes in and out and blood goes round and round. Anything else is a bad thing" pretty much sums it up.

I am no IT expert but I am sure a well financed mother or father could hire a forensic IT expert to determine the real person behind a user name. Hey they did it for MP3's so why not for the person who advised their child to fight a person armed with a knife?

My opinion
Surgingshark - Good Points. Difficult to disagree with them. Thanks