What style of silat do you practice?

[Crucible]

Hi,
What style of silat (or kuntao) do you practice and where and who did you learn it from? Just want to get a sense of the wealth of knowledge in this forum.

[Ular Sawa]

Pukulan Cimande Pusaka from various teachers under Pendekar William Sanders.

[Crucible]

Pukulan Cimande Pusaka from various teachers under Pendekar William Sanders.
Sir,
Would you please tell us a little about your lineage of Cimande and of Pendekar Sanders?
Thank you.

[Crucible]

Also I would be intrested if others would be willing to state if thier training included weapon arts and breathing/meditation.

[Ular Sawa]

Sir,
Would you please tell us a little about your lineage of Cimande and of Pendekar Sanders?
Thank you.


If you are really interested in the lineage, I would recommend you check out www.cimande.com for more information. It would be far easier to read what's posted there than for me to write what has already been expressed in a far more articulate manner.

Selamat

[krys]

Apart from Hadji's silat I study silat lincah , I used to practice Setia Hati Terrare, silat Gayong and for a very short time a malaysian turtle based system while I was in Malaysia.

[Crucible]

If you are really interested in the lineage, I would recommend you check out www.cimande.com for more information. It would be far easier to read what's posted there than for me to write what has already been expressed in a far more articulate manner.

Selamat
Thank you, Its a very full website. I'll have some questions when I've fully imersed myself in it.

[Fist Of Legend]

I practice Bongkot harimau style. I also did Manyang (wasp) and Pamor Badai. http://www.silat.be it's a verry good website with a lot of information (it's my club :D )

[mdz81]

I practice Imua Shantung Kuntao with Sifu Eduardo Ojeda in Tarragona (Spain). We have a MSN group (in spanish): http://groups.msn.com/ESTUDIOYPRACTICAKUNTAO

[Saiful Azraq]

Salam hormat,

I studied:
1. Silat Cekak Hanafi: 1995-1996-Learned from YM Md Radzi Hj Hanafi (through cikgu Che Yusof Che Mat). Mainly empty-handed. No weapons form learned yet, usually adapted.
2. Silat Melayu Keris Lok 9: 1997-2003-Learned from founder Guru Azlan Ghanie. Main weaponry-Keris. Adapted weaponry: Stick, Sundang, Sword, Staff, Tekpi, etc. Includes basic and advanced breathing methods. No meditation.
3. Silat Kuntau Tekpi: 2001-2002-Learned from Guru Sani Zainol Abidin (through cikgu Norazlan Wahid). Mainly empty-handed. Main weapons form: Tekpi.
4. Silat Kuntau Sendeng: 2003-Learned from Guru Jamaludin Shahadan. Mainly empty-handed. Main weapons form: Keris, Tumbuk Lada, Sword, Stick, Kerambit.
5. Silat Abjad: 2003-Present-Learned from Ustaz Ahmad Che Din. No silat techniques involved. Religious lessons only.

Salam persilatan,

Saiful Azraq

[amirul_tekpi79]

Peace to all,

1) World Tae Kwon Do Federation: 1987-1992
2) Choy Lay Fut: 1998
3) Shi-Kendo: 2000-2001
4) Silat Pauh Minangkabau: 2002-2003
5) Silat Kuntau Tekpi Malaysia: 2003-Current

Peace

[Crucible]

Salam hormat,

I studied:
1. Silat Cekak Hanafi: 1995-1996-Learned from YM Md Radzi Hj Hanafi (through cikgu Che Yusof Che Mat). Mainly empty-handed. No weapons form learned yet, usually adapted.
2. Silat Melayu Keris Lok 9: 1997-2003-Learned from founder Guru Azlan Ghanie. Main weaponry-Keris. Adapted weaponry: Stick, Sundang, Sword, Staff, Tekpi, etc. Includes basic and advanced breathing methods. No meditation.
3. Silat Kuntau Tekpi: 2001-2002-Learned from Guru Sani Zainol Abidin (through cikgu Norazlan Wahid). Mainly empty-handed. Main weapons form: Tekpi.
4. Silat Kuntau Sendeng: 2003-Learned from Guru Jamaludin Shahadan. Mainly empty-handed. Main weapons form: Keris, Tumbuk Lada, Sword, Stick, Kerambit.
5. Silat Abjad: 2003-Present-Learned from Ustaz Ahmad Che Din. No silat techniques involved. Religious lessons only.

Salam persilatan,

Saiful Azraq
Sir,
could you please tell us a little of the basic and advanced breathing methods you learned?
Thank you.

[paulcaz]

I train in Menangkabau Harimau Pentjak Silat, been doing it for about 3 months so just stratching the surface of this fascinating art.

Paul

[Saiful Azraq]

Salam hormat,

I apologise for my lateness in answering. I was away from the computer for a week or so. On to the topic!

As with most things in Silat, to explain in writing will only increase the complexity and comprehension of the subject discussed. Therefore, I will try to remain as far within the boundaries of normalcy as possible.

In Silat Melayu Keris Lok 9 (Lok 9), the 'basic' and 'advanced' breathing methods are not separate entities, just one breathing method used in different situations. Some people suggested its relationship to Sufi forms of breathing but I have personally not verified this.

The method is called Nafas Melayu (Malay Breath) and consists of inhalation through the nasal cavity and compression (not contraction) of the stomach muscles, creating a slight pressure in the lungs and lower back. Good posture is a side-effect of this. At the same time, the internal organs are put into a tensed state. For stamina purposes, the breath is held for various increased counts and released. This slowly acclimates the lungs to absorb more and more oxygen on every breath. This process usually takes 6 months. The compression is held even during normal functions such as prayer, walking, standing, running and results in a marked change in stamina and loss of breath. *However, to avoid possible misuse and damage to the organs by anyone reading this, I have left out one key element of this exercise.

After 6 months, the student progresses in identifying different muscles in the abdomen that is affected by and affects the breathing process. Understanding this correlation helps the student to contract certain muscles to "keep the breath locked" in one or several of these points at once (There are seven, collectively called 7 Makam or 7 Places) for different purposes. Speed (for multiple hand attacks), Agility (for langkahan), Flexibility & Flow (for locks and unlocking), Power (for full body weight impacts), Balance (for jatuhan and sweeping), Strength (for high-impact punches and kicks) and Sensitivity (to connect all 6).

Different silat categorise different ways using different words, in fact even the experience differs from one pesilat to another. The key point is to identify these points on your own body and to make use them when and where necessary. Additionally, none of these seven are independent but alternate between one and the other and shift back and forth to achieve the pesilats goals.

Salam persilatan.

Saiful Azraq

[krys]

Good advice Saiful Azrac, one shouldn't practice without proper instruction if he doesn't master the whole procedure


Speed (for multiple hand attacks),

I heard that sentence too :) , I have my own idea on this but what is your opinion on how silat breathing increases the speed of hand attacks?

Thanks.

[moe389]

I've been training buka jalan pentjak silat for a few months. Its been primarily empty hand training and we did one class with daggers which was very interesting.

thanx moe389

[Saiful Azraq]

Salam persilatan,

Although I have yet to fully understand the complexities of this method, but practising and experimenting with it on a day to day method has left me with this thought: Many martial arts train with breathing methods to increase intake of oxygen and facilitate calmness. However, Nafas Melayu simulates a situation of low-oxygen whereby the pesilat is forced to operate in breathlessness, pain, confusion, panic, stress and many others especially if attacked by multiple opponents and with weapons.

Used improperly, it causes long term damage and loss of muscular control (twitching, cold rushes, etc) but when taught correctly, the method has proven invaluable in a normal daily setting to 'switch on' to combat mode almost immediately. I have seen some of my seniors able to absorb oxygen so efficiently they achieve a sort no-breath state. You cannot tell when they're inhaling or when they're exhaling since they do it so quietly and finely. A sort of unexplainable aerobic/ anaerobic marriage.

As for the speed factor, contracting the muscles in the upper chest cavity (can't really describe where) creates a relaxation of the shoulders and allows the hips to move freely, akin to the silver thread theory in Taichi or the Alexander technique in theatre, though that's the closest example I can give.

Hope it helps.

Saiful Azraq

[Crucible]

Thank you.

[studionaga]

I study Poekoelan Tjiminide Tulen with Mas Goeroe Barbara Niggel, since 1988. We do study and practice meditation and dynamic breathing techniques, through compression and lowering and expanding qualities of breath for flow, stamina and power. Meditation is an intrinsic aspect of study and healing.

in peace,

studio naga

www.studionaga.com

[Saiful Azraq]

Salam hormat,

I just visited your website, Studionaga and am impressed! Would you mind at all sharing a little of the breathing and meditation techniques you studied?

Salam persilatan,

Saiful Azraq

[SteveJKDUK]

I train in Buka Jalan Silat as well...

[mqqier]

i practice Nusantara Pencak silat under Pedekar Bong Abenir Check it out! (http://www.kpsnusantara.com) :)

[bernie]

Amirul

aloha ! Please check your email box as I sent you a message. Mahalo

Bernie

[Crucible]

i practice Nusantara Pencak silat under Pedekar Bong Abenir Check it out! (http://www.kpsnusantara.com) :)
Are you a member of the PHILSILAT team? I notice you refer to your teacher as pendekar and he began his training 1998, is this usual in KPS Nusantara, to become a pedekar in 6 years? No disrespect intended, I just found it highly unusual.

[Crucible]

i practice Nusantara Pencak silat under Pedekar Bong Abenir Check it out! (http://www.kpsnusantara.com) :)
I want to reemphasize that I do not doubt your teachers lineage or abilities, simply found it unusual and wish to be informed. :)

[mqqier]

Are you a member of the PHILSILAT team? I notice you refer to your teacher as pendekar and he began his training 1998, is this usual in KPS Nusantara, to become a pedekar in 6 years? No disrespect intended, I just found it highly unusual.

I'm not a member of the philsilat team, i've only been under his tutelage for the past 3 yrs. I don't know when he formally started although i think in kpsnusantara to do just that but to achieve you must train hard and that's what he did. Every person has different levels of learning, maybe he learned that fast, i mean 6 yrs. in silat is nothing compared when you're training your whole life.

[mqqier]

I want to reemphasize that I do not doubt your teachers lineage or abilities, simply found it unusual and wish to be informed. :)

unusual... how does it take for one to become a guru or a pendekar for a practioner of pencak silat?

[krys]

My guru once said in an article something like 30 years .... but there are different kind of pendekars.

[mqqier]

My guru once said in an article something like 30 years .... but there are different kind of pendekars.
What style of silat do you practice?

[Kareema]

Hello Everyone!

I'm a 'newbie' to this forum, and an east Detroiter (where I currently live) by way of Trinidad. I've studied Capoeira Angola, Shorin Ryu, and Silambam (Indian stickfighting) back home and I currently train in an ecclectic Silat system in the Detroit area. I really appreciate the multicultural aspect of SE Asain martial arts.

Looking forward to benfitting from the wisdom of others here :)

Kareema

[Crucible]

Hello Everyone!

I'm a 'newbie' to this forum, and an east Detroiter (where I currently live) by way of Trinidad. I've studied Capoeira Angola, Shorin Ryu, and Silambam (Indian stickfighting) back home and I currently train in an ecclectic Silat system in the Detroit area. I really appreciate the multicultural aspect of SE Asain martial arts.

Looking forward to benfitting from the wisdom of others here :)

Kareema
Kareema, Welcome,
Can you tell us a little about the form of silat that you practice? I am also interested to find out about the Indian stickfighting system you do as well, but perhaps you should post that in the weapons section. :)

[Ular Sawa]

Hello Everyone!

I'm a 'newbie' to this forum, and an east Detroiter (where I currently live) by way of Trinidad. I've studied Capoeira Angola, Shorin Ryu, and Silambam (Indian stickfighting) back home and I currently train in an ecclectic Silat system in the Detroit area. I really appreciate the multicultural aspect of SE Asain martial arts.

Looking forward to benfitting from the wisdom of others here :)

Kareema
Welcome fellow east sider

[Kareema]

Thanks for the warm welcome :love:

The system I study is what I guess you could call a mixture of hard/soft as far as fighting techniques. The hard techniques are basically buahs with the joints (knuckles, wrists, elbows, knees) and bones (forearms, shins, headbutts) the soft techniques are joint locks which lead to breaks or throws. As my limited understand goes, the 'kombinasi' are examples on combining the buahs. Some we do sitting on the ground, some we do standing. My least favorite is the forearm conditioning :cry: I knew my black and blue forearms were bad when one of my co-workers who doesn't know anything about martial arts sat me down for a heart to heart talk about maybe going to a battered women's shelter!

The footwork is interesting in that you are evading the opponent's attack and at the same time advancing toward him. In Shorin Ryu, we also moved in on the opponent, but the emphasis was on blocking the attack, not necessarily evading it. As far as the weapons we use, its the knife and staff.

I also understand that there is a healing aspect to this art as well but I have not been privy to much of it as yet.

Well, I realize thats probably about as generic a description as you could get, but as I said I'm just a beginner. If you guys have any specific questions, maybe I could be more descriptive, or I'll ask my Guru. I'm mostly here to learn!

Bye 'till later,

Kareema

[Crucible]

Is there a name to the form of silat your training in, or does your teacher simply refer to it as "an eccletic silat system"?

[Kareema]

Sorry Crucible! My Guru just refers to it as 'Silat Majapayit' or 'Kendang Silat' I know that there are heavy doses of Cimande as a principle system in our school.

Ciao,
Kareema

[Crucible]

Thanks! Ciao!

[pesilat]

Sorry Crucible! My Guru just refers to it as 'Silat Majapayit' or 'Kendang Silat' I know that there are heavy doses of Cimande as a principle system in our school.

Ciao,
Kareema

I'll hazard a guess and say that you train with Chris Malgeri in Madison Heights?

If so, then what he's teaching is what he learned from Dan Inosanto and Herman Suwanda (and possibly others). It has heavy influence from Mande Muda Silat (which draws heavily from Cimande) and Pentjak Silat Serak, as well as others. Of course, if I'm wrong on who you train with then please disregard all of this and tell me your instructor's name. I try to keep somewhat current on FMA and Silat instructors - especially in the midwest (I live in Louisville, KY) - and Chris is the only guy I know in that area who would call what he does "Silat Majapahit" or "Kendang Silat." I know there's another guy up that way who teaches (or used to teach) Cimande Pusaka but I doubt he'd call what he teaches anything other than Cimande or Cimande Pusaka.

Mike

[Kareema]

Pesilat,

I don't recognize the name you mentioned. My guru's name is Malik. I know his teacher is an American, I'll ask his name at next class - or whenever I get the student manual back from my husband (whichever comes first :p ) .

Kareema

[pesilat]

Pesilat,

I don't recognize the name you mentioned. My guru's name is Malik. I know his teacher is an American, I'll ask his name at next class - or whenever I get the student manual back from my husband (whichever comes first :p ) .

Kareema

Cool. I don't think I've heard of Malik. I look forward to hearing more about him.

Mike

[Stxsas]

Buka Jalan Pentjak Silat for me..

[jkdsilat]

Hi,

I practice Buka Jalan Penjak Silat unfer Guru Cass Magda & Sifu Dave Carnell.
look at the links below for further information:

www.cassmgda.com

www.impactjkd.co.uk

[masterfinger]

Sorry for chiming in so late. I study & teach Pentjak Silat Serak under Pak Victor DeThouars. I've also learned a little Maphilindo Silat from Guro Dan. I plan on visiting Guru Bob Vanatta in Colorado soon, to pick up some Silat Bledek.

[moe389]

I was at a weapons demo yesterday one of the guests was a guy who studies sheik fighting system I believe he called it ganti he mostly talked about the weapons they used. He mentioned their empty hand system was based after eight different animals and he did some stuff that kinda looked like a form of djurus. does anyone know more about this style is it like silat or harimau.

thanx moe389

[Crucible]

I was at a weapons demo yesterday one of the guests was a guy who studies sheik fighting system I believe he called it ganti he mostly talked about the weapons they used. He mentioned their empty hand system was based after eight different animals and he did some stuff that kinda looked like a form of djurus. does anyone know more about this style is it like silat or harimau.

thanx moe389
Sheik or sikh? One, sheik, is a title. The other, sikh, is a religion. I've had a couple sikh friends and apparently they have a long martial tradition and are well known as warriors and justice keepers. The impression that my friend gave me is that sikhs were known as justice and peace keepers when fighting broke out between muslims and hindus in diffrent time periods in India. One of the 5 symbols of thier religion is the blade which they're supposed to have on thier person on all times, usually these days its evolved into a harmless peice of jewelery(like a sikh equivlent of a christian cross). Acouple friends have accidently wandered into park clearings where sikhs were practicing and they immediately stopped. I think in many cases they're still pretty secretive about thier art.
Gatka-the sikh martial art-websites
http://www.warriorsaints.com/
http://www.gatka.de/
http://www.sikhwomen.com/sikhism/culture_arts/gatka.htm

[Steve Perry]

I study Pukulan Pentjak Silat Sera. We sometimes use the silent "k" on he end of Sera. West Javanese, and my teacher is Maha Guru Stevan Plinck, who is one of Paul de Thouars senior students.

We are based on the blade, though we don't get to that until our teacher deems we have enough skill in empty-handed work to properly deal with the knife.

It's a djuru-based art, and my teacher's website is www.pencaksilat.com, for more information.

Steve

[Silat Student]

Well I train in Pencak Silat Pertempuran down here in Sunny Florida (although recently it's been hurricane florida). I'm learning from a combination of personal lessons from Pendiri Stark and tape training. I've trained in a few different martial arts (none of them long enough to mention) and PSP is the most fun I've had.

[Sgt_Major]

Pukulan Cimande Pusaka from various teachers under Pendekar William Sanders.

Likewise here...and I also would refer you to cimande.com / silatireland.com ballymenasilat.com <- club I attend

:bang: <- loving it still...makes me laugh

[Garuda]

I practice the pencak silat styles Pamor and Badai. On our site you can read a bit more about the styles and about my teacher.

www.pamorbadai.com

Garuda...

[Wali]

WaliSongo Silat and Cimande Silat.

www.eastweststudios.com

[Angah]

Hello my name is Rob but my Malay name is Angah

when I was 7 years I have learnd stepts from an uncle I don't know the aliran.

Pencak Silat Kuda Kuningan (Pelatih Theo Fermont)
Pencak Silat Pancasila (Pendekar Soplantila)
Silat Melayu Keris Lok 9 (Cikgu Azlan Ghanie)
introduced by Silat Pantas Tangan (Pak Par)

[tellner]

Same as Steve Perry - Serak with Guru Stevan Plinck

[silatliam]

I teach the following styles
Pukulan Cimande Pusaka
Tari Kolot Cimande
Cirang Cimande
Sera Cimande
Pamacan Cimande
Trumbu / Keris/ Kunjang/ Cabang/ Stick

For more details check out our website
www.silateurope.com

Liam

[ICT]

Here are the ones I studied,

Bersilat Willow system
Wu Tong Silat
Bakti Negara
Huc Chung Kuntao
Trained & worked out with other silat practitioners and instructors as well.

There are to many styles from these systems to post here so If you want to know more go to this page http://www.ict-silat.com/pukulan_pencak_silat_tempur.htm

Sincerely,
Teacher: Eddie Ivester

[Ular Sawa]

Hi Eddie,

Thanks for the SilatMart link you posted earlier. Also, wanted to welcome you to MAP since I've only recently seen your posts. I don't make it to Talahassee too often but I'd like to visit the next time I do. Cheers!

[JKD guy]

I do penjtak silat serak. Pak Victor de Thouars is the immediate teacher of my teacher, and certifies my teacher.

[Ular Sawa]

I teach the following styles
Pukulan Cimande Pusaka
Tari Kolot Cimande
Cirang Cimande
Sera Cimande
Pamacan Cimande
Trumbu / Keris/ Kunjang/ Cabang/ Stick

For more details check out our website
www.silateurope.com

Liam
Welcome to MAP Guru Liam. The updated web site looks good. Cheers.

[silatliam]

Thanks for your good wishes. Glad you enjoy the website hopefully trying to get some new photos on it shortly. Best Regards.

Liam

[tellner]

People are providing links to their teachers and schools, so here's the site for Guru Plinck's cabang (http://www.pencaksilat.com)

[rizal]

I studied Silat Harimau (the Sumatra one, not the Java one), Silek Pauh, and Silek Tuo. I also have some exposure to Cimande, Cikalong, and Sabandar.

[Kiai Carita]

Hello and salam to all, I practise a family silat that has no name but I also learned silat from the Bogor Bangau Putih school. However I was never a proper pupil in the organisation. I only met the late Grand Master Subur Raharja a few times. He was a very spiritual man, the most spiritual man I have ever met. ... The question about breathing is not one easily answered over the internet. The only breathing exercise I know that can be taught over the internet is pernafasan bayi (baby breath). This is the breath one does when totally relaxed. One practises it by practising relaxation. ... The non technical baby breath is the base on which to learn other breathing techniques. Technical breathin is best learned under a the guidance of a proper instructor.

Salam

[Bobster]

I train primarily with the Suwandas, particularly Bambang. I am a former student of Pa Herman, up to his death in 2000. Saying that, I guess you could say we have our fingers in everybody's business. :D However, I primarily concentrate on the Sundanese styles, and I especially appreciate thier approach to Ibing (Kembangan).

[scottsummers]

I practice Amerindo Self Defense under Oom Jim Ingram. It is a combination of about 5 or 6 systems of silat, boxing, military combatives and some other neat stuff.

[scottsummers]

my teacher has been learning silat for 65 years and he still wont call himself a pendekar. He says that when no one else has anything left to teach him he might think about it.

[Hobbitlauncher]

When i begin training it'll be under the Suwanda family, doing mande muda, harimau, and cimande, or at least once i end up in seattle training with bobster =P I'm not sure which styles of silat MKG teaches, Bobbe probably knows more than me.

[scottsummers]

check out Jim INgram when you get to seattle. You will be suprised

[tellner]

From what I understand MKG teaches the Inosanto-blend Maphilindo plus stuff from instructors they bring in for seminars. I don't know about their Silat program, but they are an excellent school overall.

[Hobbitlauncher]

this is what i've heard, just gotta up the cashflow before i can drive 50 miles each way and pay the costs =P

[tellner]

50 miles each way? Which direction from Seattle?

[mas guru]

:yeleyes: i study lanka empat system from sumatra from greg alland. ive been doing it almost 10 years now. i also work on the mande muda and sundanese silat systems from west java.
mas paul

[Hobbitlauncher]

nonono, the origninal mkg (minnesota kali group) branch, in minnesota lol, I wont be in Seattle for quite a few years

[scottsummers]

nonono, the origninal mkg (minnesota kali group) branch, in minnesota lol, I wont be in Seattle for quite a few years
__________________
-You need to get here as fast as you can! I could go on and on about Guru Ingrams skills. Imagine doing silat for 65 years-no sport applications at all. No high kicks or anything impractical. Add that to knowing many systems of silat as well as other stuff he knows and welding that all into one fluent system. And, it has been tested in real life situations. Not only that but you dont have to be super flexible to do the techniques. We call them "old man techniques" because most of them dont take too much effort or motion but are VERY effective. I am so lucky to have found him. I have just come into contact with some of the suwanda videos and think those are the closest thing on video you can see to compare guru Ingram's skill with. Even at 75 he moves like lightning.

[Silatyogi]

Pukulan Pencak Silat Serak/bukti negara & Kilat Silat Tuo. I am now just beginning to learn Wali Songo from Guru Cliff Stewart.

[serakmurid]

Pencak Silat Serak with Pak Victor de Thouars.

[soulguru]

Tausug Silat-Kuntaw from Sulu; actually more of a hybrid, familial, indigeneous Silat art i'm very fortunate to have experienced & still learning from...

[Gajah Silat]

Harimau Berantai, originaly from East Jawa.

Selamat Hari Natal to everyone.

[CQC]

I learned Silat Seni Gayong Malaysia when I was 15 (from year 2000-2002), then I quit after I got the white bengkung since I have to face my examination.

Currently I'm learning Silat Cekak Ustaz Hanafi, and this time I will finish the whole sillibus.

[sulaiman]

Salaams all,
I started off with silat PD in the UK ( 4 years)
Then in 98 I began training Seni Silat Haqq Melayu with Cikgu Ariffin and still am to this day - as part of that training he asked me to study the Silat Gayong Malaysia syllabus , which I did, PSSGM then gave me permission to open Gayong Spain and VOILA - here we are, going strong in our third year.
salaam silat
Sulaiman

[bernie]

Sulaiman Aloha !
Hope you are doing well. I trained under the late Pendekar Herman Suwanda from 1988 till his passing and now train with his brother Bambang. Have also had the pleasure of learning from other Pendekars such as Pak Ariffin, Ibu Rita, Pak Dadang, etc. and wish everyone Haouli Makahiki Hou ( Happy New Year ). May all of us be enriched with more information about silat in '06 and how to live as a better indivudal in this world. Mahalo

[Taker]

Peace to All,

Summarizing my journey as a martial artist:

1. Tae Kwon Do (1996) :bang:
Didn't learn much. Just went for the class for about 3 months and then stopped for some reasons. Did bought the uniform, only to wear it 2 times.

2. Silat Gayung Fatani (1999 - 2000) :rolleyes:
First time training silat, and man I'm loving it (besides McD). I really put my effort here as I had somehow developed the love for Malay Martial Arts, because I'm a Malay! But I stopped after 8 months as I moved following my family, and the new place didn't have any Silat Gayung Fatani class.

3. Silat Cekak Ustaz Hanafi (22 July 2004 - present) :love:
The one to be held for life. Started learning when I was studying in a university and continued to study right to this day. Now in the level of Assistant Coach Trainee.

Just my short story to share with others.

[Orang Jawa]

I'm a student of silat majalah, Iaijutsu/Aikijutsu and Shotokan Karate-do.
Tristan

[bayu segara]

I studied:
1. Silat Aceh.
2. Silat Tapak Suci from Muhammadiyah.
3. Silat Cimande.
4. Silat Merpati Putih (present)

[jeff5]

The two main styles I study are Kuntao Silat DeThouars and Majapahit.

[soulguru]

in Sulu/Mindanao, its generically called 'kuntaw silat'; to be specific though, its Silat Lanswang Sepring, coming from the fusion of various arts by mu guro...

[CraigLeeJKD]

Buka Jalan.

Love it.

[Gajah Silat]

Someone teaches Buka Jalan in Co. Durham? :eek:

Hmm, interesting. My instructor has trained a lot with Cass & speaks very well of him :)

[coldxsg]

i don't have that much history:

Persilatan Kembang Wali (1985 - current)

Singapore Taekwondo Federation (1989 - 2001)

i've been searching around and getting more and more info from other arts for around 10 years, but still feel i've not learned enough.. still feel there are still a lot out there i haven't know..

cheers!

[CraigLeeJKD]

Someone teaches Buka Jalan in Co. Durham? :eek:

Hmm, interesting. My instructor has trained a lot with Cass & speaks very well of him :)

Yup, our school is 'Impact North East', we are a satellite school of Dave Carnell's Impact Martial Arts (Sifu Dave is a full instructor under Cass Magda).

We do Silat and Kali to compliment our JKD, and are based in Castle Eden (near Peterlee).

You'd be more than welcome to come check us out sometime :D

Peace

[Gajah Silat]

Ah, I see! Probably a bit too far for any regular training(I already do a 120 mile round trip for that), but closer than Stoke.

Do you do any seminars up there?

[Pekir]

I started training pukulan silat in 1980. Our schoolname is Barongsai, this is not a style or aliran reference, just a school name. It originates from the Sundanese area and is a symbiose of Chinese Kuntao, silat and pukulan Betawi since way before the IIWW era. My teachers are Dutch-Indonesian and so am I.

I also studied Kempo for about four years but this training has no significant bearing on my present MA training.

I hope to travel to Indonesia later this year and acquire some knowledge of the family pukulan from my relatives in Jakarta. So who knows an update by then.

[CraigLeeJKD]

Ah, I see! Probably a bit too far for any regular training(I already do a 120 mile round trip for that), but closer than Stoke.

Do you do any seminars up there?


I'm afraid not, we have to go down to Stoke or Manchester for seminars.

Where do you train and who under if you dont mind me asking?

Peace

[taoizt]

I practice pukulan in a small group only for about 3 years now...I wish I started sooner..:(
But have some 17 years of kempo (more of a kuntao or kungfu-like branch than karate) knowledge and now trying to get that way of movement out of my system..harder to unlearn than to learn from scratch...

[Sgt_Major]

why unlearn? Theres information you could incorporate into your new style ... no point wasting 17yrs of learning, just because its not the same....

to learn french, you dont forget your english.

[taoizt]

Well offcourse there is 'knowledge' in your body which is useful but some things quite simply don't match. Like for instance using plenty of force in your body in the previous styles. Or punching in a karate like way or moving backward in stead of moving forward. If you want to learn the style properly you have to 'empty the cup'. If I start combining kempo-punches with thai-kicks and aikido like holds, nothing really good will come from it ;) Although most will probably disagree (following the MMA trend of today)

[Steve Perry]

Well offcourse there is 'knowledge' in your body which is useful but some things quite simply don't match. Like for instance using plenty of force in your body in the previous styles. Or punching in a karate like way or moving backward in stead of moving forward. If you want to learn the style properly you have to 'empty the cup'. If I start combining kempo-punches with thai-kicks and aikido like holds, nothing really good will come from it ;) Although most will probably disagree (following the MMA trend of today)

Got to agree with this. Some material in some arts will still be useful -- some of the kicks and punches you pick up might blend right it. But some of the philosophical tenants do get in the way. In a silat style in which one closes most of the time, coming from an art that teaches you to back up and block every strike directed at you is a hindrance, not a help. You have to unwire that part of your brain, and it takes a while. T he longer you've been training, the longerit takes.

From my experience -- including myself --- new students who know other arts usually have a harder time learning our version of silat than students who know nothing at hall. Bad habits are harder to get rid of than new habits are to develop ...

[Rebo Paing]

Bad habits are harder to get rid of than new habits are to develop ...[/FONT]

Partly true ... and it also depends on what we construe as "bad habits". Most people I observe day-to-day don't know how to exist within their body structure, nor how movement and being relates to gravity. Hence most people I observe have developed bad habits!


I observe that there is only one way to move the body optimally regardless of "style".

I don't expect anyone here to agree, but here's a clanger ... style is mostly irrelevent ... except where it can lead us to exist within our body structure and body knowledge of how it relates to gravity ... and a lot of "styles" are useless to realise this truth because the teachers themselves don't understand ... :eek:

Salam,
Krisno

[Steve Perry]

Partly true ... and it also depends on what we construe as "bad habits". Most people I observe day-to-day don't know how to exist within their body structure, nor how movement and being relates to gravity. Hence most people I observe have developed bad habits!


I observe that there is only one way to move the body optimally regardless of "style".

I don't expect anyone here to agree, but here's a clanger ... style is mostly irrelevent ... except where it can lead us to exist within our body structure and body knowledge of how it relates to gravity ... and a lot of "styles" are useless to realise this truth because the teachers themselves don't understand ... :eek:

Salam,
Krisno

You open a large can of worms when you say there is only one way to move optimally. That might be true, but: each person is different and what is optimal for one won't be for another. A hundred-pound ballerina on point is different from a four-hundred pound sumo wrestler in a a crouch, and while gravity and physics don't change, how one moves is going to be dictated by other things. Mass matters. Shape, too.

What works for the shrimp may not work for the elephant.

Some people move better than others and some teach better than others, and if you are fortunate -- and I am -- you get a teacher who can move and teach.

And yes, while no style covers everything, some offer more efficient and effective ways of moving than others. Moreover, they can also offer a better system for learning and applying the art -- a set of principles that apply widely and thus can be relied upon to offer something useful when the need arises.

We're big on structure, and for bipeds in one-gee, we think that position is more important than speed or power. Some styles think otherwise. You pays your money and you takes your choice ...

[Rebo Paing]

Moreover, they can also offer a better system for learning and applying the art -- a set of principles that apply widely and thus can be relied upon to offer something useful when the need arises. ...

Have to agree with you there my friend!

Having said that, the principles germaine to the mechanics and neurology required to generate effective movement and the expression of power are the same across the board, whether one be a shrimp or a human of elephantine proportions. We all might have our genetic limitations to overcome as well. :D .

If we can express those principles to direct our movement and our stillness, we transcend style. The vessel with which to convey the understanding of body knowledge i.e. "style" becomes superfluous once understanding is embodied.

That is what it means, to have body knowledge.

There is only knowing or not knowing. There are no shades of achievement in between and there is no compromise. It is Gerak Nurani.

Salam,
Krisno

[taoizt]

interesting discussion. Body knowledge sounds like the thing I'm struggling with :) Only problem is...I have knowledge of the way to move according to the laws of gravity, but the main hindrance here is not being able to relax enough to let gravity do it's work :-) So much to learn, so little time :-)

There is a big difference between consciously knowing how to move and subconsciously knowing how to move....

Greetings,
Taoizt

[Steve Perry]

Have to agree with you there my friend!

Having said that, the principles germaine to the mechanics and neurology required to generate effective movement and the expression of power are the same across the board, whether one be a shrimp or a human of elephantine proportions. We all might have our genetic limitations to overcome as well. :D .

Well, in the most general of ways, sure, the principles of physics and chemistry are going to be the same; however, the specifics vary in real-time application, because the systems of the ballerina and the sumo aren't identical in how they function for real tasks. Strength-to-weight ratios vary. Pound-for-pound, there are lightweight lifters who are stonger than the super-heavyweights, even though in terms of totals, the big guys can push way more. Somebody who bench presses three times his body weight is proportionaly stronger than somebody who presses twice his weight. How many chin-ups can a sumo wrestler do compared to, say, a gymnast who weighs a third as much? The principles are the same, but the applications need to take into account the genetic differences. Expecting a sumo wrestler to strap on ballet shoes and balance on his toes is as realistic as expecting a ninety-pound ballet dancer to step into the sumo ring against a four-hundred-pounder and win.

Which is to say, either event is highly unlikely.

There are fast big guys, but a lot more fast little ones -- power is not the same as strength, and the bigger and heavier somebody is, the harder it is to move quickly. The applications will be limited by the particulars of the system. A mack truck that can pull a twenty-ton trailer is much more powerful than a Maserati, but if you are betting on a race for a mile up hill on a mountain road, put your money on the sports car.

If we can express those principles to direct our movement and our stillness, we transcend style. The vessel with which to convey the understanding of body knowledge i.e. "style" becomes superfluous once understanding is embodied.

Sure. But to get to that point from don't-know-squat to total understanding involves something of a journey. The zen concept of mountain-no mountain-mountain works here. Without basic tools, you can't make that leap from point A to point Z unless you are some kind of genetic superman. Most people aren't, and before you can transcend style, you have to have a place to start, which, for most of us, is a style.


There is only knowing or not knowing. There are no shades of achievement in between and there is no compromise. It is Gerak Nurani.

I have to disagree with this. Yoda's "Do or do not, there is no 'try.'" is a fine movie line, but in no way deals with most consensual reality. There are many resting places where you have completed part of the path. It's true, you can either do a thing or you cannot do it, but there are, and always have, been levels of achievement short of total mastery. The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step, and nobody I know can cover the whole distance in a single leap.

[Rebo Paing]

Well, in the most general of ways, sure, the principles of physics and chemistry are going to be the same; however, the specifics vary in real-time application ... There are fast big guys, but a lot more fast little ones -- power is not the same as strength, and the bigger and heavier somebody is, the harder it is to move quickly. The applications will be limited by the particulars of the system. A mack truck that can pull a twenty-ton trailer is much more powerful than a Maserati, but if you are betting on a race for a mile up hill on a mountain road, put your money on the sports car.

You are correct in that it depends on what one wishes to achieve. I agree that there are many different definitions of power. There appear to be many holy grails. I doubt that weight lifter who relies on weight lifting alone will achieve the flow that I enjoy. I also doubt that I could put on a tutu and ballet shoes and do what a ballerina does ... :eek:, but when I move with flow and presicion with a full reservoir of power, I need to be in a certain body state, optimally relaxed and attuned to my total environment. I also am of the opinion that this state would benefit most other specific types of activity.

But to get to that point from don't-know-squat to total understanding involves something of a journey. The zen concept of mountain-no mountain-mountain works here. Without basic tools, you can't make that leap from point A to point Z unless you are some kind of genetic superman. Most people aren't, and before you can transcend style, you have to have a place to start, which, for most of us, is a style.


That is right. I think that I have already stated previously that style is the vessel on the journey to achievement. At a certain stage a person may make the decision to loosen ties to the vessel if it no longer serves the purpose for the journey, when the journey becomes more important than the vessel. Some people put the vessel above the journey.

I have to disagree with this. Yoda's "Do or do not, there is no 'try.'" is a fine movie line, but in no way deals with most consensual reality. There are many resting places where you have completed part of the path. It's true, you can either do a thing or you cannot do it, but there are, and always have, been levels of achievement short of total mastery. The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step, and nobody I know can cover the whole distance in a single leap.

I think that you misunderstand me. Each time a person achieves a breakthrough in knowledge and understanding, there is the A-HA moment, the Eureka moment of I finally understand! However such moments are steps to the next level of understanding. In our current conciousness we might never reach the final understanding, even should such a condition exist! There is no in between level of achievement.
In other words the process is fluid and continuous, never stopping at the last level until we become aware of the depth of mystery ... yes I'm waxing melodramatic again and I do think Yoda is a great role model :o

Salam,
Krisno

[Kiai Carita]

... but when I move with flow and presicion with a full reservoir of power, I need to be in a certain body state, optimally relaxed and attuned to my total environment. I also am of the opinion that this state would benefit most other specific types of activity.
Salam,
Krisno


Salam Mas Krisno,

Why do you want to move with a full reservoir of power? Should not one be kosong-isi (empty-full) according to the circumstance? In my understanding power is weak and emptiness has unlimited potential.

Warm salams to all,
Bram.

[Steve Perry]

I think that you misunderstand me. Each time a person achieves a breakthrough in knowledge and understanding, there is the A-HA moment, the Eureka moment of I finally understand! However such moments are steps to the next level of understanding. In our current conciousness we might never reach the final understanding, even should such a condition exist! There is no in between level of achievement.

In other words the process is fluid and continuous, never stopping at the last level until we become aware of the depth of mystery ... yes I'm waxing melodramatic again and I do think Yoda is a great role model :o

Salam,
Krisno

Yeah, I am having some trouble taking your meaning. I understand that there is alway something more to be learned, but certainly there *are* levels of achievement along the way. And when you have one, but not the next one, then by my definition, you are between the two ...

As to your philosophy of moment, it sounds as if you are saying that there is only one right way to move, and while I believe that in a given set of circumstances there will be one peak-efficiency motion, in a real-world situation, that moment is apt to shift so quickly that what was the most-effective move a quarter-second past is no longer the right one.

The tool you want might not be at hand --all kinds of reasons why -- and you'll have to use the tool you have.

While you might be able to postulate that move A is the most efficient use of all the factors -- gravity, mechanics, muscle power, speed, etc -- and that moves B,C, or XYZ would be therefore be less efficient, I think the fluidity of a real-time fight is such that being able to pull that theoretical move out and apply it exactly when and where it is needed is hardly a given. You have to see what is coming, realize what is needed, and do it faster than the speed of conscious thought or you'll be too slow too pull it off.

Sometimes there is more than a bit of a gap between the theory and the practice.

Nor is it necessary to always *use* the best move. Something that is, say 2% less efficient, or 20% less, might be enough to do the job in most cases. Given the choice, I'd drive nails with a hammer, but in an emergency, I can do it with a big rock. Somebody who comes along later probably won't be able to tell the difference ...

In a perfect world, sure, you'd have what you need right there. Of course, in a perfect world, you'd never have need for a fighting tool -- nobody would ever attack you ...

[ptkali778]

in our club we practice jati wisesa silat and mande muda

[Rebo Paing]

As to your philosophy of moment, it sounds as if you are saying that there is only one right way to move, and while I believe that in a given set of circumstances there will be one peak-efficiency motion, in a real-world situation, that moment is apt to shift so quickly that what was the most-effective move a quarter-second past is no longer the right one.

It appears that you are alluding to a sequence of actions ... like the most appropriate jurus for example. My apologies then because when using the word "move" I meant along the lines of :

the most efficient use of all the factors -- gravity, mechanics, muscle power, speed, etc -

... and don't forget position. This is exactly what I mean.

The body requirements are to be dynamically relaxed and to sink into the earth, the mind requirements are to be calm and focused wening, and the tactical requirements are to feel and follow the opponent roso, not resisting but redirecting and neutralising or alternatively amplifying an attack. It is impossible to do this if one is tense as well as being intent on their own construct (stuck on style), exclusive to that which is being presented by the situation.

Aquiring the body-knowledge to align to these requirements is the function of style which contains the syllabus of method.

My argument is that once embodied, the primacy of style is not as critical. One can then analyse other styles for their technical/tactical solutions to specific scenarios without the tunnel vision that so often accompanies discussion on style.

There is a gateway to the stage of body knowledge where this can all begin to coalesce. That gateway to a plateau (as you accurately described) is a level of psycho-physical achievement. However that is a threshold which has to be crossed before we can realise effective body-knowledge. This is also the portal for Gerak Nurani.

Salam,
Krisno

[Rebo Paing]

Salam Mas Krisno,

Why do you want to move with a full reservoir of power? Should not one be kosong-isi (empty-full) according to the circumstance? In my understanding power is weak and emptiness has unlimited potential.

Warm salams to all,
Bram.

Salam Bram,
A full reservoir of power comes from kosong. Nek wis isi (when already full), it is no longer a reservoir or potential power, but the actuality or the expression of power.

Power is an over-arching description that encompasses the states of kosong and isi. The release of optimal energy is possible when the relationship between kosong and isi is realised. The relationship involves the vertical harmonising (push against and sinking into) with gravity as well.
Weakness is when the factors of the relationship are not understood and a person relies on sectional power or truncated power i.e the power of the arm alone or leg etc.

In Silat Seng I, Patkwa and Taici they allude to it as whole body power or connected power. Watching the video of Cingrik Goning it appears they follow similar principles. Lelaku follows these principles.

Salams,
Krisno

P.S. Do not confuse isi with muscular tension/force. The muscular-skeletal structure is a construct of dynamic relationships of balance not of force, to facilitate unobstructed connectivity. Dynamic tension/relaxation erquires no more than the srtuctural relationship to gravity.

Imagine a fire hose threaded thru a structure ... if screwed up and convoluted it is "tense" and water (energy) is unable to flow through. Energy takes the path of least resistence to its flow, so keep the hose rounded. When the energy is flowing through unimpeded ... that is isi. Better still, when you visit me, I will show you.

[pengolahanjunki]

I am a Balik 1 level Merpati Putih practitioner...

[bayu segara]

We are the same pengolahanjuki. I am balik 1 level too in merpati putih. Actually I should be kombinasi 1 but I was bussy with the job and family. Where do you stay now? I am glad, I have 'saudara seperguruan' in this forum. Keep practice bro..... :cool:

[pengolahanjunki]

Myself as well...if I had truly applied myself and focused as much as I intended to I would be Kombinasi level. Sometimes life has a way of undermining your best efforts..... aside from power suddenly getting MUCH harder at Balik level. I was under the impression that the kolat I attend is the only MP school in the US. We are in Utah. Where are you? Yes, good to have a brother....

[bayu segara]

I am in Jakarta. How many students in Utah?

[pengolahanjunki]

Sorry, I guess I was being a bit narrow minded and I assumed you were in the US or maybe the Netherlands. I THINK there are 40 or so active members Dasar 2 and above. The Dasar 1's train seperately, and most don't make it to Dasar 2 for pretty obvious reasons. My Mas' were just over there testing for Khusus 1 along with a group of senior students that are between Balik 2 and Kombinasi 1. I would love to train in Indonesia. I imagine Mas Nate and Mas Mike are a bit softer on us in training than it would be over there. It is still a challenge, but it would be interesting to see if anything is "lost in translation" as far as training methods, points of movement, getaran and meditation go. Do you guys do pembinaan every day? What pembinaan exercises do you do (garuda, listric, bollock(sp)-balik,etc)? Other types of power besides pengolahan? Lidi? Im not trying to test you, I'm a sponge and very interested...good to know you, my friend..

[bayu segara]

Oh yeah, my friends saw your mas in jogja too. Unfortunately I couldn't go there. Do pembinaan every day? I don't do it every day my friend, it depend on my practice. If I practice every day, so I do pembinaan every day. But my mas suggest us to do pembinaan every day when the weather exchange. We call it 'musim pancaroba'. You can get sick easly, so you must do pembinaan to protect your body.
Usually we do pembinaan twice in one time. First 'garuda', 'dorong tarik', 'dorong tarik kombinasi' and 'listrik'. Second 'listrik', 'dorong tarik kombinasi', 'dorong tarik' and 'garuda'. But in the second time we use 'nafas kering'. For getaran, my mas teach us some shapes of 'garuda', 'dorong tarik and dorong tarik kombinasi'. To increase our power, we do pengolahan with 'beban'.
Lidi? hmm, yeah I know this. Btw my mas taught us tunggal baku. Do you know it? It's IPSI regular movement. It consist of 50 'jurus tangan kosong', 25 'jurus golok' and 25 'jurus toya'. Usually I apply this 'jurus' for my 'kembangan'.

[nathanwc]

I am a very new student of Maha Guru Pak Victor de Thouars at the VDT Academy.

[pengolahanjunki]

Yes, I find that doing a couple sets of good hard pembinaan when I start to feel sick will keep me from actually getting sick. It just goes away. Our normal pembinaan is garuda,dorong tarik,kombinasi,listric. We take small rest and a couple breaths between each. Also "penyaluran" if we are breaking. Then sagitiga and pembursi 1 and 2. We also have what we call "bolok balik" which is garuda, dorong tarik, kombinasi, listric, listric, kombinasi, dorong tarik, garuda. We do this on only one breath. Is this "nafas kering? Mas' say it is good for getaran. I don't know what "beban" is. We use flower pots full of cement in pengolahan. Lidi is a bunch of bamboo in a bundle. We twist it for forearm strenght. Then in Balik 2 we use weighted lidi in pengolahan. The only breathing I know for pengolahan is dada and perut. I have not heard of "tunggal baku". I have a few jurus, nothing with the goloks yet. Sorry for all the questions. My Mas grew up doing karate and sometimes I wonder if some of that finds its way into the MP he teaches. I love MP, it has changed my life. I want to make sure he is teaching what he has been taught correctly. He has had personal lessons with Mas Poeng. Crazy, eh? We tried to get Mas Hariyadi over here to teach us, but it is hard to get a visa for someone from a mostly Muslim country now. I want to go to Jogja for a month each year to train, but I don't really know how to make it happen. I guess I better learn to speak Indonesian first, hehe. Happy training, my friend.

[ptkali778]

wow this pembinaan exercise sounds great. care to share. dont wana get sick too :)

[bayu segara]

Ooh lidi is bamboo. I see that, here we call it bamboo not lidi. Lidi is more tiny than bamboo. Yeah we also use lidi to prepare if we want to break a target. Usually one or two months before. I correct your word yaa, it's pembinaan bolak-balik not bolok-balik. 'Nafas kering' means when you do pembinaan in second time, no oxygent at all in your body. Usually before do pembinaan we exhale the oxygen and then inhale the oxygen. After that we do pembinaan, right? In nafas kering we just exhale the oxygen and then do pembinaan. That's nafas kering.
Woow, how lucky your mas could learn from mas poeng personally. Actually tunggal baku doesn't come from MP, but it's better if MP practioners know tunggal baku. Why do you love MP? Could you tell me how you knew MP and then decided to join MP?
Yea it's very helpful if you know bahasa Indonesia. Btw if you want to go Indonesia, don't forget to stop by to Jakarta. You can stay in my house. And we can practice or discuss about MP.

[pengolahanjunki]

Yes, little bamboo. Those are great. My forearms are ripped from that alone.
Wow, nafas kering sounds intense. So no breath in or out for all of bolak balik, or from the second listric back down to garuda? Either way, that's a burn you can feel.....My Mas' Mas is actually Mas Heru. He is a doctor, but also was a special forces MP instructor in Indonesia. Mas Nate and Mas Mike have been to Indonesia twice now, and they met with him, went blindfolded driving,went to the blind school. Their tests were insane, from what I hear. Up for days,no food,very little water. They had to run 30 miles barefoot up a jungle covered mountain while people waited to ambush them and they had to defend their sabuks. Even the students that went over got a REAL pembajahan. Worked so hard they strated hallucinating.... just stuff I've heard from friends who went. I guess they are trying to get western scientific documentation of vibravision so they can get a grant to open a blind school here...cool.....

I love MP because of how it has improved every facet of my being and life. More TENAGA, more focus, more resolve, more self-discipline, more peace, more insight, more intuition, more love, more health, more crazy skills....I never thought before MP than I would break multiple pieces of steel with almost no muscular effort...or see three pipas broken with two fingers...see people doing vibravision... I have been healed and am learning to heal myself. My Dasar 2 test I sparred with a very skilled Balik 3 who never physically hit me hard, not once. But almost every hit he landed took me to my knees and made me dry heave, even hits in the ARM. Then Mas would come, wiggle his hand and pull it out. Then I would be fine, at least until he hit me again. I love MP for showing me the sheer size of my own potential, and helping me forge the will to fulfill it. Jedi shiieet, man......


I ownder where I can go to learn it....oh well, its at least a year away, but I'd like to hang out if and when I make it...thanks for the invite


ptkali788-

It would be extremly difficult to describe. It needs to be shown. Plus, before I was given they breathing keys, I had to build my channels up to take the stress. I used to get insane headaches....basically, it is a set of moving full body isometric poses/exercises combined with breathing techniques designed to dramtically increase internal pressure. They light you up pretty good...

[Rebo Paing]

Lidi is the spine of a coconut leaf, the individual spines of the leaves on the frond.
In Java brooms for the yard are often made from a bunch of lidi tied together. Jenenge sapu-lidi.

Hehe ... Bayu Segara is a Javanese name ... the wind of the sea. Cool name :D .

Salam,
Krisno

[ptkali778]

Yes, little bamboo. Those are great. My forearms are ripped from that alone.
Wow, nafas kering sounds intense. So no breath in or out for all of bolak balik, or from the second listric back down to garuda? Either way, that's a burn you can feel.....My Mas' Mas is actually Mas Heru. He is a doctor, but also was a special forces MP instructor in Indonesia. Mas Nate and Mas Mike have been to Indonesia twice now, and they met with him, went blindfolded driving,went to the blind school. Their tests were insane, from what I hear. Up for days,no food,very little water. They had to run 30 miles barefoot up a jungle covered mountain while people waited to ambush them and they had to defend their sabuks. Even the students that went over got a REAL pembajahan. Worked so hard they strated hallucinating.... just stuff I've heard from friends who went. I guess they are trying to get western scientific documentation of vibravision so they can get a grant to open a blind school here...cool.....

I love MP because of how it has improved every facet of my being and life. More TENAGA, more focus, more resolve, more self-discipline, more peace, more insight, more intuition, more love, more health, more crazy skills....I never thought before MP than I would break multiple pieces of steel with almost no muscular effort...or see three pipas broken with two fingers...see people doing vibravision... I have been healed and am learning to heal myself. My Dasar 2 test I sparred with a very skilled Balik 3 who never physically hit me hard, not once. But almost every hit he landed took me to my knees and made me dry heave, even hits in the ARM. Then Mas would come, wiggle his hand and pull it out. Then I would be fine, at least until he hit me again. I love MP for showing me the sheer size of my own potential, and helping me forge the will to fulfill it. Jedi shiieet, man......


I ownder where I can go to learn it....oh well, its at least a year away, but I'd like to hang out if and when I make it...thanks for the invite


ptkali788-

It would be extremly difficult to describe. It needs to be shown. Plus, before I was given they breathing keys, I had to build my channels up to take the stress. I used to get insane headaches....basically, it is a set of moving full body isometric poses/exercises combined with breathing techniques designed to dramtically increase internal pressure. They light you up pretty good...

thank you! it sounds very interesting

[bayu segara]

xi xi xi : :D sampean benar sekali kembang alas. Nama kulo is angin laut.
Nafas kering = no oxygen in our body. When you do pembinaan for the example garuda, and then you do without oxygen in your body. That's pembinaan with nafas kering.

[ptkali778]

xi xi xi : :D sampean benar sekali kembang alas. Nama kulo is angin laut.
Nafas kering = no oxygen in our body. When you do pembinaan for the example garuda, and then you do without oxygen in your body. That's pembinaan with nafas kering.


Is it like parnafasan where you breath in, hold it and then execute a few movements, then breathing out after?

[bayu segara]

Is it like parnafasan where you breath in, hold it and then execute a few movements, then breathing out after?

yea something like pernafasan, but you don't breath just exhale until your oxygen out from your body and then execute a few movements. If you mean with dry breathing/'nafas kering'

[Joe Aaron]

I also train in minangkabu harimau pencak silat and have just started, I train at the yoorkshire silat academy and had my first lesson last thursday. :)

[fire cobra]

Hi Joe,you got a great teacher,say hello to paul for me please :)

[pengolahanjunki]

yea something like pernafasan, but you don't breath just exhale until your oxygen out from your body and then execute a few movements. If you mean with dry breathing/'nafas kering'


So when you bwen(sp) nafas and push it all out, you don't tarik a small amount of air and hold that air in dada? Crazy.....that's intense. It makes sense though, we are told that over time, we should decrease the amount of air we take in while doing pembinaan and pengolahan. he goal being able to fight without breathing, I guess. And blindfolded, hehehehe

[ptkali778]

still doesnt make sense to me. i'll just find me a silat guro :bang:

[bayu segara]

actually i don't hold the air in my dada because no more air in my dada. And we also my mas would know if some one doing a mistake by hold the air in dada because when we 'buang nafas', we would hear ssssssss. but if you don't hold the air at all in dada and then 'buang nafas', you would hear nothing. usually mas mas would say ok....you pushed up :D for the people who has made a mistake.
I practise getaran once a week. it's a great time for me and challenge me.

[glennlobo]

Apart from Hadji's silat I study silat lincah , I used to practice Setia Hati Terrare, silat Gayong and for a very short time a malaysian turtle based system while I was in Malaysia.

hey Krys. where do you study Lincah?
regards
Glenn

[Red1Storm]

I pratice the style of Pukulan Pentjak Silat Serak and this style teaches knife, stick, and staff.

[tellner]

I pratice the style of Pukulan Pentjak Silat Serak and this style teaches knife, stick, and staff.

Cool. Whom do you study with?

[Red1Storm]

Cool. Whom do you study with?

I study with Guru Ray Graham in CA. He is a great teacher.

[taoizt]

I quote from site of Ray Graham:

"one of the four full Gurus of Serak in the world"....

ahum.. aren't there some more gurus in America and Holland as well?

[tellner]

Redstorm, I don't want to cause unnecessary trouble, but your teacher's website isn't quite complete.

Guru Graham is one of four people whom Victor de Thouars currently recognizes as a completed Serak student. There were quite a few others over the years such as Bob Vanatta. His older brothers Maurice and Paul have turned out completed students. One of them, Stevan Plinck, is my teacher. Some of these men have passed the system on to students of their own.

There is plenty of Sera/Serah/Serak/whatever the spelling is this week outside of the de Thouars. The de Thouars brothers learned from their cousins the de Vries. The de Vries live in the Netherlands.

Sera is certainly not extinct in Indonesia. It's not hugely popular, but it is around. That's where the Suwanda family is from and why it's part of Mande Muda. They aren't the only teachers. A couple pesilat I know have made the trip and learned Sera in Java from a variety of teachers.

[Gajah Silat]

Hi Todd,

Any contacts for Sera(k) in Java, as I'll be there for a month or two next summer?

Please PM me.

Cheers

Martin

[tellner]

Gajah, I responded to you by PM.

[Zealot]

I practice a combination of Pukulan Cimande Pusaka and Kalasag Kuntao Silat.
I also trained at Sityodtong Academy with associates of Mark Delagrotte.