The Zen Monks

[pgm316]

Two Zen Buddhist monks were walking along a path. They saw a woman trying to cross a river. One monk said, “Let us help the woman cross the river”. The other said, “No, it’s too dangerous to cross the river”. The two monks carried on their journey along the path. A while later one of the monks said, “We should have helped that woman cross the river”, the other said, “Why do you still carry her?”

[TkdWarrior]

"enlightened" :)
-TkdWarrior-

[wayofthedragon]

:confused:
eh, I'm kinda slow

[YODA]

Hmmmmmmmm........... a very misquoted and simplified version of a famous Zen Koan. Danger was not the reason for not carrying the womsn - it was forbidden for their order to touch women. I'll se if I can dig out the traditional version - I must have it somewhere in the famous Yoda Archives :D

[YODA]

I have it......

"Two monks were traveling in the rain, the mud sloshing under their feet. As they passed a river crossing, they saw a beautiful woman, finely dressed, unable to cross because of the mud. Without a word, the older monk simply picked up the woman and carried her to the other side.

The young monk, seemingly agitated for the rest of their journey, could not contain himself once they reached their destination. He exploded at the older monk. "How could you, a monk, even consider holding a woman in your arms, much less a young and beautiful one? It is against our teachings. It is dangerous."

"I put her down at the roadside," said the older monk. "Are you still carrying her?"


------------ The exact wording in not important (there are many versions) but the reason the youn monk was angry - and the fact that he waited so long to say it are important factors.

[wayofthedragon]

awww....I understand now:)

[khafra]

Yoda's version makes more sense. In fact, it makes too much sense to be a real zen story. PGM's has to be the original version.

[YODA]

Originally posted by khafra
Yoda's version makes more sense. In fact, it makes too much sense to be a real zen story. PGM's has to be the original version.


LOL! You're probably right :p

[pgm316]

Mines the real version, them zen blokes are always misquoting me! :D

A buddhist told me the version I wrote, it must have been passed around like chinese wispers and I did change it to a river, the carrying someone over a puddle didn't make much sense! ;)

[DeSeRt RaT UK]

I would have thought that the reason the monk asked why he still carried her was because the other monk still carried the woman in his head.

[TkdWarrior]

hey desert rat...welcome to forums...
well another one from UK... this is UK forum i guess :)
-TkdWarrior-

[pgm316]

Indeed young grasshopper ;)

[DeSeRt RaT UK]

thx :) Been reading as a guest for a week and thought it was time I posted :D

[YODA]

Hi DesertRat - Welcome to the nut house :D

[chapskins]

Hi DesertRat - Welcome to the nut house :D




this whole site, man, feel like Jack Nicholson some times in One Flew Over The Cuckoo's nest, come on, which one of you nuts has got any guts, seems like some have, lol, medication time everyone, medication time :eek:

[Knight_Errant]

You should talk :D

[jroe52]

i liked this alot, i need to learn to meditate on such things, rather then thinking logically and giving up. the younger monk was the one thinking of her, not him. they were not to give into temptation, the elder monk was helpful and kind, the younger monk just thought about the sex of the person and its consequences! hehe

[Maximicus]

Are you sure you don't mean The Shining? Oh well, let me get my pillow... Juicyfruit.... *smashes window with sink, runs out to freedom*

[chapskins]

Are you sure you don't mean The Shining? Oh well, let me get my pillow... Juicyfruit.... *smashes window with sink, runs out to freedom*

It's kool to speak with others that hav'nt quiet lost the plot ehh? The next girl i'm ganna meet is ganna light up like a pin ball machine and pay out in silver dollors, you know what i mean cheif?

:D

[Knight_Errant]

I shouldn't imagine he does, you know....
Again, I'm having considerable difficulty here. Do you think you could try talking sense?

[Maximicus]

You've never seen One flew over the cuckoo's nest? :eek:

[ajacxxion]

Has anyone read the book Zen Mind, Beginners Mind by Shunryu Suzuki? A fantastic book by a Zen monk who is said to have singlehandedly brought Zen to the United States. He was the head abbot of the first monestary in America called the Zen Center (in California). I find it to be the best description of Zen practice understandable to Westerners.

From what I have read and seen Bruce Lee was a student of Zen.
The most popular Koan-type anecdote he used was that of Nan-in in the Meiji era, who overfilled the cup of a university professor who was filled with his own presuppositions and conceptions about Zen, which was preventing him from learning more about it.

The Unfettered Mind was a Zen sword classic written by Takuan Soho.

[Poop-Loops]

I read that story in The Book of Five Rings. Basically, it means that you should just do stuff, and spend less time thinking about it.

PL

[john yates]

Mines the real version, them zen blokes are always misquoting me! :D

A buddhist told me the version I wrote, it must have been passed around like chinese wispers and I did change it to a river, the carrying someone over a puddle didn't make much sense! ;)

just let it go :confused:

[Princess]

Hmmmmmmmm........... a very misquoted and simplified version of a famous Zen Koan. Danger was not the reason for not carrying the womsn - it was forbidden for their order to touch women. I'll se if I can dig out the traditional version - I must have it somewhere in the famous Yoda Archives :D

forbidden to touch a woman... how can anyone be wise without a sense or knowledge what "touch" feels like? For touch is equal to feelings, right? Everyone goes through experience to "feel" so they can "know" and thus become "wise" and "grow" up to become a better person. If that older monk did not touch and carry the woman across the river, I'm sure both brothers have to go through and harder road to see another woman so they can touch or carry another woman.... so they can learn. Also it isn't the woman's fault that man go crazy... if only men able to control themselves... then touching isn't such a problem.

I hope I make sense.

Regards ~ This Princess.

[LaWnY]

Okae, this makes sense... May i juz ask, is there any site more on zen? I just wanna write more about it.. Thankz..

[HK Pedestrian]

Zen women and rivers, eh? Let me see...

Two beautiful blonde women are standing opposite each other on the banks of a swollen, flooding river. One yells across the river to her friend:

1st Blonde: "Help, help!"

2nd Blonde: "What's wrong?"

1st Blonde: "I need to get across the river!"

2nd Blonde: "You already are!"

Thankew, thankew... :love:

-HKP

[shunyadragon]

I have it......

"Two monks were traveling in the rain, the mud sloshing under their feet. As they passed a river crossing, they saw a beautiful woman, finely dressed, unable to cross because of the mud. Without a word, the older monk simply picked up the woman and carried her to the other side.

The young monk, seemingly agitated for the rest of their journey, could not contain himself once they reached their destination. He exploded at the older monk. "How could you, a monk, even consider holding a woman in your arms, much less a young and beautiful one? It is against our teachings. It is dangerous."

"I put her down at the roadside," said the older monk. "Are you still carrying her?"


------------ The exact wording in not important (there are many versions) but the reason the youn monk was angry - and the fact that he waited so long to say it are important factors.


There are other versions in China, the story is older than Japanese Zen and it is not considered a Koan in Chinese tradition. Also your conclusion is not correct.

[shunyadragon]

forbidden to touch a woman... how can anyone be wise without a sense or knowledge what "touch" feels like? For touch is equal to feelings, right? Everyone goes through experience to "feel" so they can "know" and thus become "wise" and "grow" up to become a better person. If that older monk did not touch and carry the woman across the river, I'm sure both brothers have to go through and harder road to see another woman so they can touch or carry another woman.... so they can learn. Also it isn't the woman's fault that man go crazy... if only men able to control themselves... then touching isn't such a problem.

I hope I make sense.

Regards ~ This Princess.

Interesting and valid point, but I do not think that is related to the orginal intent of the story.